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Pakistan's Latest Ruling Makes Us Want To Bang Our Heads On The Table And Weep

Corinne Redfern 11:25 | 04 Aug 2015

In today's depressing news, two judges have ruled that women are second class citizens, even when it comes to raising children...


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Two Supreme Court judges in Pakistan have reportedly ruled that when a couple divorces, the woman only gets to continue raising their children throughout infancy as their ‘supervisor’ - before passing them over to their husband when they’re old enough, because he is their legal ‘guardian’.

Judges Mian Saqib Nisar and Ejaz Ahmad Chaudhry also ruled that Pakistani women cannot keep their children away from their fathers following a divorce, whatever the circumstances.

Of course, it makes sense: these are men who have spent nine months of carrying their offspring inside their bodies… Oh wait.

Depressingly, it’s not the first time courts in Pakistan have ruled against women’s rights. It's not even nearly the first time. In fact, we can't even count the number of occasions when the country's legal system has made it OK for men to treat their wives, sisters, mothers and daughters like second class citizens.

After all, this is a country where up to 90 per cent of husbands are estimated to assault their wives, where only 39 per cent of women can read (limiting their options for financial independence) and wher 24 per cent of girls are married off before they reach the age of 18 (in many cases when they’re only eight or nine years old).

And for as long as the country's judicial system continues to not only enable this, but encourage this, then change is going to be a long and drawn-out process.

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‘Gender violence in Pakistan takes a variety of forms, some of which are common across cultures such as marital violence, including verbal abuse, hitting, kicking, slapping, rape and murder, and economic and emotional abuse,’ says Filomena Critelli, a researcher at the University of Buffalo.

‘Other forms of violence are rooted in traditional practices that continue under the guise of social conformism, customs and misinterpretations of religion, that also include exchange marriage, death by burning (stove deaths, which are presented as accidents), acid attacks and nose cutting (a form of humiliation and degradation). Women are also raped and abused while in police custody, which further deters many women from reporting crimes against them.’

Thankfully, things are improving. This girl is campaigning for parents to keep their daughters in school, education levels are on the rise, and increasing numbers of female activists are fighting to raise awareness of women’s rights around the country.

Now if only the courts would catch up with them.


Read more at Pakistan Women's Rights | Marie Claire

Our courts really needs a good kick to wake up! I say sack all the judges, rape the bloody male or sell them as prostitutes so they realize what shit they are supposed to help in the country ...Stupid worthless creatures! As for the female just sack them too if they cant voice for their own...
Those judges only chose wrong words. In Islam yes mother gives birth but it's husband responsibility to take care of all the expenses of child. In Pakistan many mothers take children because of love but find it hard to finance their children and courts hardly force husband to finance it. So judge need to choose right words.
 
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What does their nationality have to do with anything? Please respond to the arguments they have made and the concerns they have raised.

Spouting abusive language towards them, in the manner you have done, only reflects poorly on Pakistan and Pakistanis.


The judges (assuming the complete SC judgement reflects your mindset) and you are wrong - the mother should receive a monthly stipend (if she has no income earning potential of her own) out of the income of the father to support raising the children through adulthood. In addition, the judgment generalizes and refuses to recognize the fact tat women are increasingly pursuing careers and earning sufficient incomes to support raising a family on their own, even without financial support from an ex-husband and father of the children.

The West has the process and family laws correct - it is the Islamic world that is stuck in the dark ages and medieval mindset with these out of date interpretations.

Will there be an oversight to make sure said stipend will actually be going towards the welfare of the child or will it be like in the "correct" west where the woman takes the money and nobody makes sure the needs of the child is even being met?

As for the careers part of course that should be considered but you and I both know that the vast majority of women in Pakistan do not pursue careers.
 
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So courts should change the verdict because a small small percentage of fathers may be sickos? The vast majority of Pakistani men love their children dearly and to change the law would be an injustice to them.
No BUT they should NOT have brushed everything with the same brush....THINGS written like this (all/ everything/ everybody/ anybody/ without reason/ acxceptions) in the law (as some here are claiming) is the leading cause assholes dont get punished!

So judge need to choose right words.
Either judge, the law or the journalist!
 
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What does their nationality have to do with anything? Please respond to the arguments they have made and the concerns they have raised.

Spouting abusive language towards them, in the manner you have done, only reflects poorly on Pakistan and Pakistanis.
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Their nationality matters because it is not Pakistani women who have a problem with this but rather western women who want to force every nation of the world to change their laws to fit their views.

No BUT they should NOT have brushed everything with the same brush....THINGS written like this (all/ everything/ everybody/ anybody/ without reason/ acxceptions) in the law (as some here are claiming) is the leading cause assholes dont get punished!


Either judge, the law or the journalist!

Imo you are the one trying to brush every Pakistani father with the same brush by bringing up an extreme situation that we both know does not fit with the vast majority of Pakistani men. Although your concern is valid imo it has little to do with this verdict.
 
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The judges are right, in Pakistan males are the ones bringing the money unless the woman can finance the lives of their children the fathers need to play a part in their lives. Unless you want to hand women custody without responsibility like in the west.
Haii Janab my problem is not the verdict itself but the stupid way of saying it as below:
Pakistani women cannot keep their children away from their fathers following a divorce, whatever the circumstances.

Imo you are the one trying to brush every Pakistani father with the same brush by bringing up an extreme situation that we both know does not fit with the vast majority of Pakistani men.
I am presenting a possible scenario that can take advantage with loopholes....YOU may love to live with loopholes in the law to allow predators but I prefer these to be checked and cemented!

Hence such words should be avoided! How hard is that? Which man in his sanity would put something like that AS A LAW OF THE COUNTRY?
 
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Haii Janab my problem is not the verdict itself but the stupid way of saying it as below:

You are right the wording is weird but I see it as two seperate issues, this verdict is a family court issue whereas your scenario would be a criminal matter.

I am presenting a possible scenario that can take advantage with loopholes....YOU may love to live with loopholes in the law to allow predators but I prefer these to be checked and cemented!

Hence such words should be avoided! How hard is that? Which man in his sanity would put something like that AS A LAW OF THE COUNTRY?

So you have a problem with the possible loophole it gives to rapists and the like alright I can accept that it may give them said loophole but if you have a problem with the verdict in its entirety then you are wrong.
 
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You are right the wording is weird but I see it as two seperate issues, this verdict is a family court issue whereas your scenario would be a criminal matter.
My scenario is based on the law that is presented (if that is the wordings written as per the law)

If its the journalist...Well they need to be sent to gallows for a week or so to realize not to write BS!

So you have a problem with the possible loophole it gives to rapists and the like alright I can accept that it may give them said loophole but if you have a problem with the verdict in its entirety then you are wrong.
Nahh not verdict....Just the loopholes and it is sad to see no one is interested in pointing it out :(
 
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My scenario is based on the law that is presented (if that is the wordings written as per the law)

If its the journalist...Well they need to be sent to gallows for a week or so to realize not to write BS!


Nahh not verdict....Just the loopholes and it is sad to see no one is interested in pointing it out :(

Okay but you see the article you posted does not care about loopholes just the fact that men are granted custody with the main argument being that the law is anti women since women carry the child and not anything to do with the well being of the child.
 
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Okay but you see the article you posted does not care about loopholes just the fact that men are granted custody with the main argument being that the law is anti women since women carry the child and not anything to do with the well being of the child.
I cant find ANY article addressing loopholes :cray:
 
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what is the law in India? who is ultimate custodian of kids in case of separation?
I actually don't know, never looked into it 8-)
...but I have a couple of cousins who are divorcees and in both cases the mother has kept the children and the father has visitation rights on weekends, The husbands seem to take them for longer time during summer school holidays etc. even takes them for holidays abroad at times. Husbands also pay child support. In one case the wife has re-married but the child still lives her and the step father.

The law may be different for Muslims, again not sure. Indian Muslims can opt for Muslim personal law.

Edit - Ok I just saw the question has already been answered by several other people, so go ahead and ignore my response.
 
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Since you are agnostic Islamic laws not implemented on you. you can choose what you want

Why can't the woman keep all her share of the property she inherited from her father?

Plus, why shouldn't the assets of the father and mother (or fathers and mothers) be divided equally among all legal children, assuming no wills changing inheritance allocations? There is no need to complicate inheritance laws.
Since you are agnostic Islamic laws not implemented on you. you can choose what you want
 
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In pakistan the custody goes to father when kids come off a certain age since we are a patriarchal society, it is understood that men can supports kids in a better way both financially and from safety point of view... but again he is bound to let the kids meet their mother! In case father is not capable (financially/ mentally etc), women can file a petition to prove that she can be better custodian. However, when kids grow up they are anyway free :)
Naturally mothers are more fit to raise the kids , court order give financially help to mother to raise kids.
When kids get adult they can themself choose with whom they want to live.
 
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Naturally mothers are more fit to raise the kids , court order give financially help to mother to raise kids.
When kids get adult they can themself choose with whom they want to live.

False.
 
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