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Pakistanis debate real enemy: girl-shooting Taliban or drone-firing US

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The news that the Taliban shot 14-year-old Malala Yousufzai for speaking out against them has sparked debate that highlights a major division in Pakistan.

By Taha Siddiqui, Correspondent / October 18, 2012


The news that the Taliban shot a 14-year-old girl for speaking out against them has highlighted a major division in Pakistan over the question of which is worse: the United States or militants?

On one side are civil society members and some ethnic and religious minorities who find the attack on the girl, Malala Yousufzai, atrocious and are calling for action against the Taliban.

“There are many in our valley who would not dare to name the Taliban, but she spoke against them. We cannot deny her sacrifice,” says Khairullah Sina of Swat Valley, who works in the education sector and knows Malala. On one side are civil society members and some ethnic and religious minorities who find the attack on the girl, Malala Yousufzai, atrocious and are calling for action against the Taliban.

“There are many in our valley who would not dare to name the Taliban, but she spoke against them. We cannot deny her sacrifice,” says Khairullah Sina of Swat Valley, who works in the education sector and knows Malala.

Hundreds of protesters from civil society gathered in Islamabad, Karachi, and Lahore to protest the shooting, and have been calling for the Pakistani Army to head up a military operation in North Waziristan to tamp down on militants in the region.

On the other side are the citizens who are criticizing the international community and media for giving her case “more than the attention it deserves.”

There seems to be a concerted effort to tie the Malala incident to the unrelated issue of US drone attacks in Pakistan, says Baqir Sajjad Syed, who writes on foreign affairs and defense issues for the English-language newspaper Dawn.

Sanaullah, a teacher in Swat and an acquaintance of Malala's father, who goes only by one name, says he doesn't understand why international media cares so much about the attack on Malala when there are greater issues that need to be addressed.

"Every time there is a drone attack, innocent children and women are killed. We should also condemn that since it is equally unjust but no one is highlighting it," he says.

The US says it has no other choice than to use drones to rout out militants in areas like North Waziristan, but many Pakistanis complain that it is a violation of sovereignty and causes civilian casualties. It’s an issue that is used often by right-wing Islamists to whip up anti-Americanism.

A couple of days after the Malala incident, Mr. Syed says that his mobile phone inbox was full of text messages imploring him to remember the “war on terror victims like ‘innocent children’ killed by drones.”

He points out that shortly after the attack, right-wing Islamists and most of the Urdu media started asking the question: “Who used Malala?” That question, he says, implies that the US is actually the enemy.

Just as there have been a number of opinion articles praising Malala’s bravery, there have also been doctored images circulating on the Internet. The images of young, injured children falsely claim to be showing drone attack victims. Some have even circulated images of Malala sitting with American officials and have called her a “US agent.”

Military - civilian divides

The divide can also be seen in the military’s response, say analysts

“This is a double game of national security, which the military has played historically,” Syed says, pointing out that the military built its image both locally and abroad by being at the forefront of efforts to provide Malala medical care and also by issuing statements that they were ready to take on the terrorists.

The initial mobilization of civil society in support of Malala sent a message globally that people of Pakistan are not pro-Taliban, says Sarfaraz Khan, who teaches at the Peshawar University. “Initially, even the military responded very positively," he says.

But the civil society and military have now appeared to retreat to two different corners of the debate, and are further divided among themselves.

The military seems to be split over whether it should actually go into North Waziristan and rout out militants. “While the young blood in the military has started calling the Taliban terrorists, the older generation still wants to live in strategic alliances of the ‘80s and '90s, in which we saw the military having close relations with the Taliban in Afghanistan,” says Professor Khan.

Pointing to the lack of consensus in the Parliament about passing a resolution in favor of a North Waziristan operation in light of the attack on Malala, Khan says Parliament is another place the divide is visible.

“Political parties headed by Imran Khan, Nawaz Sharif, and others, whose traditional voting constituencies lie with Islamists and in whipping up anti-Americanism, do not want to lose voters at a time when elections are near, and that is why they are creating a counter public narrative,” he says.

Pakistanis debate real enemy: girl-shooting Taliban or drone-firing US - CSMonitor.com
 
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I am suprised what our 500,000 Strong army is doing that a girl can be shot inside Pakistan , and no action is taken to completely dismantle any Taliban Sympathisers and their infrastructure

This just is in appropriate makes a normal person take up AK 47 and start patrolling neighbour hood, I mean really ... what are people getting trained for ? in Army , Police and security service?

Something solid should be done from government and Military organization


Talibans are a external threat and thus a military reponse is needed to attack Afghanistan from where these Talibans are coming into Pakistan

The response should be stern and direct

Mission of the operation should be simple

a) 40,000 Troops in group on Pakistan Side clean out talibans heavens
b) 40,000 Troops dropped on Afghanistan Side to clear out any imminent dangers
with cover of 20-30 JF17 thunders to bomb the **** out of any safe heavens or caves

This should be the least response in all logical forms

Simply sitting and saying oh what can be done or whats done is done , or its a sad situation

I think , the Army has to respond "Appropriately" to this incident with out effecting next year's elections

The minimum that can be done @ Civilian level is setup of 40 girls schools in the same city the girl was shot
 
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Something solid should be done from government and Military organization

Nothing ' solid' shall be done.

Everyone seems to be waiting for winter to set in - saves everyone of a lot of bother & by then a new crisis would have come & this forgotten.
 
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why dont they come to conclusion that both are evil and stop the madness
 
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Are the GOP and army playing games with the people of Pakistan?
 
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"Girl-shooting taliban" and "drone-firing US" both are the same.

We didn't have these militants here, or in-fact ANY suicide bombers, before the US came and squatted next door. Wherever the US needs 'em, this core Al-CIAda shows up and starts doing their terror activities. When the US wanted to attack Iraq, alot of Al-CIAda activity was happening in Iraq. Alot of Al-Quack was moved to Libya to support regime change, these people weren't Islamic, started killing black Libyans. Recently, militant gangs in Syria captured an important missile base after heavy fighting, and even a few western media outlets reported that those militant gangs were assisted by Al-Queeeda assets to help 'em win there.

In Pakistan, there is a "core" group of militant high-ups like Mulla Fazlullah and previously Baitullah Masood, whom the US drones repeatedly fail to target. Even with Baitullah who did die in a drone attack, there are official interviews of PAF officials talking about how our Selex Galileo UAVs repeatedly showed US drones NOT taking out high-value militant targets despite Pakistan providing them hard-gained intel about their location, and instead, the militants would hurriedly change their location. Finally when Baitullah was killed, a low-level informer was turned by the ISI, and dropped his GPS indicator where our intelligence agencies knew Bait to be.

Around these high-ups, most of the low-level militants are people who have lost their family in drone attacks. You can't pay anyone to commit suicide because they won't be able to spent that $, but in Waziristan a drone attack kills suspects, their children, neighbors, and these people have a very ancient tradition of "Badla" or revenge. The US has this practice of "double-tapping", where after they've hit a place and killed a bunch of people, when people go in to help any screaming decapitated survivors, the US drones hit the same place again. There have been cases where people wait an hour listening to the screams of the survivors, and then going to help, and the American UAVs diligently "double-tap", leaving more people dead or decapitated. So - these people who've lost members of their immediate family join the militants and suicide-bomb the US or fight against the Pak Army(who they percieve as US's paid/hired guns), it's not justifiable but understandable.

To ask whether the US drone attacks or the militants, are the "real enemy" is a moronic and misleading question.
 
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"Girl-shooting taliban" and "drone-firing US" both are the same.

We didn't have these militants here, or in-fact ANY suicide bombers, before the US came and squatted next door. Wherever the US needs 'em, this core Al-CIAda shows up and starts doing their terror activities. When the US wanted to attack Iraq, alot of Al-CIAda activity was happening in Iraq. Alot of Al-Quack was moved to Libya to support regime change, these people weren't Islamic, started killing black Libyans. Recently, militant gangs in Syria captured an important missile base after heavy fighting, and even a few western media outlets reported that those militant gangs were assisted by Al-Queeeda assets to help 'em win there.

In Pakistan, there is a "core" group of militant high-ups like Mulla Fazlullah and previously Baitullah Masood, whom the US drones repeatedly fail to target. Even with Baitullah who did die in a drone attack, there are official interviews of PAF officials talking about how our Selex Galileo UAVs repeatedly showed US drones NOT taking out high-value militant targets despite Pakistan providing them hard-gained intel about their location, and instead, the militants would hurriedly change their location. Finally when Baitullah was killed, a low-level informer was turned by the ISI, and dropped his GPS indicator where our intelligence agencies knew Bait to be.

Around these high-ups, most of the low-level militants are people who have lost their family in drone attacks. You can't pay anyone to commit suicide because they won't be able to spent that $, but in Waziristan a drone attack kills suspects, their children, neighbors, and these people have a very ancient tradition of "Badla" or revenge. The US has this practice of "double-tapping", where after they've hit a place and killed a bunch of people, when people go in to help any screaming decapitated survivors, the US drones hit the same place again. There have been cases where people wait an hour listening to the screams of the survivors, and then going to help, and the American UAVs diligently "double-tap", leaving more people dead or decapitated. So - these people who've lost members of their immediate family join the militants and suicide-bomb the US or fight against the Pak Army(who they percieve as US's paid/hired guns), it's not justifiable but understandable.

To ask whether the US drone attacks or the militants, are the "real enemy" is a moronic and misleading question.

I have to ask myself how hypocritical a comment can get.

Why did the heroes of the PAF with their Selex Galileo UAVs fail to acquire UAVs that could do the dirty work themselves? Why did they go through the massive charade of informing the US, and then waiting with hands crossed over their bellies for the Americans to do this dirty work for them? Why, when they are so well-informed, can they not prevent attacks on their military, air force and naval bases? Why are they unable to take care of terrorists forcibly executing and mutilating their own jawans and civil and police officials?

This is a post that makes one really queasy with distaste at the sheer hypocrisy and bad faith displayed.
 
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Who has short Malala is also the enemy and also USA who are doing drones attacks USA was the reason which these TTP thing came
 
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Pakistani Youth & general public considers Malala & the ones who killed in drones as Pakistan's daughters & sons & now we consider both TTP & US Drones same.....

May be Pakistani Media couldnt connect dots but just see the social networking sites u may see the real picture of Pakistan which is soo bright & Positive.

US Elections are near, They are asking to do operation in so called heaven of extremists in north waziristan, Pakistan govt army civil society & public have already refused any more operations, this could be another tactic to convence Pakistani peoples tht an operation is invetible, just they did in Sawat every one was against operation but just a single video of a girl changed the mind, or the 9/11 incceident to conveynce americans for war, but not this time.
 
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A: Malala was shot by Talibaboons for what? speaking for Girls education.

B: Drones shoot Talibaboon hideouts for what? Attacking and killing NATO troops (and Pak troops + civilians)


Whoever equates case A and case B must go back to school and learn some logic 101


peace
 
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Why does it have to be one or the other. Malala Yousafzai was targeted by Tehrik a Taliban of Pakistan (TTP). US Drones target the Taliban of Afghanistan. Educate yourself and learn the difference between these two groups. Taliban of Afghanistan are not involved in terror in Pakistan. It is TTP that is involved in terror in Pakistan.
 
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I have to ask myself how hypocritical a comment can get.

Why did the heroes of the PAF with their Selex Galileo UAVs fail to acquire UAVs that could do the dirty work themselves? Why did they go through the massive charade of informing the US, and then waiting with hands crossed over their bellies for the Americans to do this dirty work for them? Why, when they are so well-informed, can they not prevent attacks on their military, air force and naval bases? Why are they unable to take care of terrorists forcibly executing and mutilating their own jawans and civil and police officials?

This is a post that makes one really queasy with distaste at the sheer hypocrisy and bad faith displayed.

What exactly is hypocritical about my comment? Just because something doesn't fit the media's official narrative doesn't mean it is "hypocritical", learn to think a little and talk facts.

Your point about PAF's "failure" to acquire UAVs that could target the militants ourselves rather than US drones... What other options were out there specifically? We can't go for US drones for political reasons. Selex Galileo offered the best payload, endurance, and performance parameters available. The UAV can carry a wide variety of payloads including weapons, but the Italian OEM has rebuffed PAF's offer to weaponize these drones under US/NATO pressure so far.

They do try to prevent attacks on our military, air force and naval bases, for example the most recent attack at Kamra where the militants were held on the exterior perimeter and the base's commander took charge and led the defence of the base himself and sustained bullet wounds in the process.

These militant attacks on our bases are a consequence of US interference, just like the Malala incident. We DID NOT have these attacks AT ALL before US attacks. The link between the rise of militancy in Waziristan and drone attacks in Waziristan is painfully obvious, I don't know why some people have a hard time seeing that. If your parents and siblings were suddenly killed, you might harbor some anger against the people who killed them as well. US drone attacks CREATES recruits for these militants, it CREATES suicide bombers, we did not have suicide bombers before these strikes.

There is a sharp difference between Afghan fighters and these militants in Pakistan/Libya/Syria. Even in the 80's, the Afghan Mujahideen did not target Soviet cantonments, because that is where civilian non-combatants were. These Al-CIAda militants blow up mosques and places of worship, they target markets and kill women and children(like Malala). Hitler got his troops to dress up as Polish soldiers and attack German posts, and Germany used that pretext to vilify and attack Poland. Just like that, Al-CIAda is a CIA outfit that operates outside the moral laws of Islam that Mujahideen(who are fighting for their freedom, and not just bombing and killing children) have always operated under.

Convincing you of this fact is not important. The facts are plain and obvious, for any unbiased reasonable person. Hypocricy is blindly believing what the mainstream western media says, and considering it "hypocricy and bad faith" to ever question it. Even the American alternative media and people like Alex Jones agree that the Al-Qaeda is a CIA outfit that magically appears in whichever country the US needs them to be.
 
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...........

These militant attacks on our bases are a consequence of US interference, just like the Malala incident. We DID NOT have these attacks AT ALL before US attacks. The link between the rise of militancy in Waziristan and drone attacks in Waziristan is painfully obvious,.......
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Very emotional but simpletons' analysis. Kenya embassy bombing, Islamabad Egyptian embassy bombing, the bombing that killed Azzam in peshawar, 1993 world trade bombing, and the list goes on. There are plenty of examples where Talbaboons killed 100s nay 1000s of civilians long before the fateful day of 9/11.

But you all will continue repeating Madrassah-Mullah propaganda, without ever reading the history of rabid terrorists from Qaida, the Talibaboons and others. you will keep on repeating, keep on regurgitating the same old $hit. The same old cr@p.

There are enough of examples to show a sane person that Wah@bi Jih@dis attacked civilians long before 2001. But you won't believe the reality. Such is the state of mind of so many Pakistanis and most of the Islamists.




...........

There is a sharp difference between Afghan fighters and these militants in Pakistan/Libya/Syria. Even in the 80's, the Afghan Mujahideen did not target Soviet cantonments, because that is where civilian non-combatants were. These Al-CIAda militants blow up mosques and places of worship, they target markets and kill women and children(like Malala). ......



Oh ho then f this "sharp difference". From Pakistani POV, Afghan fighters are the scum that are raping FATA and the b@stards born to such rapes are called Talibaboons. But you will consider those rapists as nicey nicey softy softy. Why?

What's wrong with you. Have you no patriotism, have you no shame?

Those so called Afghan fighters need to haul their @rses back to Afghanistan if they are that brave. Fing bravery as per your stance means they need to f Pakistan.

Just pathetic. pure pathetic.
 
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