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Pakistani Roads, Motorways and Highways

People need to understand Pakistan doesn't build anything big from its own budget. We just don't have capacity to fund huge infrastructure projects and Bhasha is one such example and the reason its kept getting delayed. As no gov would want to spend money on project which will take 10-15 years to build. They can't think beyond 5 years and to show people what they have done by end of term.

Name me one big project which isn't being build with loan or private investment including motorways.

This is how Pakistan works. You take out loan to build something and then pay back with interest over decades. This cycle continues as current gov pay back previous gov loans and so on. With low tax revenues it then doesn't have much left to build big projects.

The reason we easily get billions of private investment and loans for motorway is because our domestic railways and aviation sector is in shambles. Most Pakistanis use roads. Easy to see why we get billions of $ in investment which they recover with toll fees.

Said this I do think Bhasha dam will be build with internal resources as its too important now, Pakistan cannot delay it anymore.
 
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No its not. dam should be priority you can produce expensive electricity but there is no alternate for water.

You are comparing apples to oranges.

just to give you example business community of Sialkot built their own airport.

Why was it built?

Secondly most people forget
1> we already had National Highway.
2> Motorway don't suit to most people because it is away from cities
3> Some people avoid Motorway due to cost factory (Fuel+Toll)

Those highways are not suitable for industrial or agricultural growth. Motorways are not built for our leisurely travels.

Motorways are always away from the cities, that is their whole point. Inter-city travel is catered to by other roads. Your point number 3 used to be a thing when M1 and M2 were new, not anymore.

it is interesting that while Govt is investing on Motorway from Lahore to Karachi but no one care about Existing Highway b/w Karachi-Lahore Road which is only four lane. time will reduce if Govt. add 2 more lane because most of the time HTV specially 16 wheeler block your Fast Lane.

As mentioned before as well, the existing highways are completely unsuitable for expansion since all of them were built on the older models of highways running through towns and cities which is exactly what a motorway isn't supposed to do.

Sir that's not my point of but rather harsh truth. if you are short of money will spend it on your basic need or spend it on luxury items.

Motorways are anything but luxury. They are essential to any regions industrial growth, which in Pakistan needs multiple steroid shots. The only thing worth mentioning that the PMLN has ever done is building those two motorways. Motorways bring industrial growth through out their length, create opportunities in regions which never had any, from agriculture to industry, everyone benefits from them. The cement industry throughout central to northern Punjab is a great example of what a motorway can do for an industry.

Sir according to your cost logic if some one had patient in house need transplant costing 3.5~4.5 Million & they also need car costing 2 Million then they should give priority to Car because its cheap rather then save the person life.

You are comparing apples and oranges again. If dams are the heart transplant then motorways are the medication that stops your body from rejecting that transplant. This is a severe lack of understanding of how motorways work within a given economy.



Sir you are 110% wrong. Did you ever in your life travel b/w Karachi Lahore on Car? I have & trust me its not the city which cause problem its each HTV Blocking your way for 5~15 Min.

I have. And you are again under the impression that these motorways are primarily there for leisure use. Those HTVs are what these highways and motorways are most important to. Your travel from Karachi to Lahore has a minuscule impact on the country's economy, if at all, and is not what those highways are essentially for. And take it from someone who has worked in supply chain in Pakistan and Canada; motorways are a life saver. So much so that I made my company bear the extra costs of having all our major suppliers in Karachi stock warehouses in Islamabad just for us. Why? The extra cost was worth the reliability of receiving our raw materials on time. I can also get you in contact with our reps in satellite locations whose daily mantra includes the moaning of how they need better connectivity in their region when their supplies take a day to travel the first 2000 KM and then two more to travel the next 500.

You do know we have Bypass?
And are you suggestion that we build limited access motorways through the middle of existing cities and then build bypasses? Take a moment to recognise the 4 very major and obvious flaws in this plan. After you're done with that ponder a little bit on why were those bypasses built? Why were they needed? Do you not see it?

And once you're done with all of the above please give us a rough idea of how many population centres does, say, the GT Road pass through on average in a 100Km stretch. We will then figure out how many bypasses need to be built on that 100Km stretch.

are you stating that GT Road, Multan Road & National Highway N-5 etc are for traveling in City?

You've lost us again. The obvious efforts to replace the GT Road, Multan Road and N-5 with motorways should be enough for one to understand that these highways built on the older models (ancient in the GT Road's case) just aren't cutting it. How is this not obvious?

& for the record last patch of motorway Karachi - Hyderabad is not even motorway. it has population round along with you turn.

You mean the part where it connects to the city? Do you not see what you are saying?

Go through the following for a basic understanding of what proper roads can do for your economy.

http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/74747/10/10_chapter-3.pdf

https://assets.publishing.service.g...achment_data/file/212590/action-for-roads.pdf

The last one is particularly interesting as it shows how a country as small as England which already has an extensive network of Motorways covering pretty much all of its territory is still trying to improve them to benefit its economy.
 
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You need to know few things. Most of current motorway being build is from private investment. Part of it is with loan.

Problem with Bhasha dam is Pakistan government will have to finance whole $16b project from its own budget. No one is willing to give loan, forgot about private investment. But it still needs to be build.

What I'm saying is that not building motorways will not speed up Bhasha dam. One reason Pakistan public services are in shambles is because not many pay taxes.

1> Gov.t might not have 16 billion in any given day but they do have money.
2> For How Long this Basha Dam is pending?
3> How much loan both Govt(PPP & PML-N) took.
4> how much Govt run department
5> how much Govt run companies are costing to this country
6> How Much Metro + support(Pole+line+crossing etc) + its yearly subsidies+maintenance Cost?
PS: you not only need basha you need multiple dams & KB should be on priority(Canal,Quick, 500KVA line availbilty)

Karachi-Peshawar motorway will be completed in few years. Pakistan will likely continue to build more motorway but they will be much shorter. There is Quetta-Multan motorway planned and few others.

Once Karachi-Peshawar motorway is completed you are pretty much done with national roads thanks to shape of the country.
it will reduce traffic but it will never replace existing road.
Second you can't connect everything with motorway.
third not every one is like you and me we have people who travel on local instead of Dewoo for Lhr-Rwp because it cost Rs 500 only.

People need to understand Pakistan doesn't build anything big from its own budget. We just don't have capacity to fund huge infrastructure projects and Bhasha is one such example and the reason its kept getting delayed. As no gov would want to spend money on project which will take 10-15 years to build. They can't think beyond 5 years and to show people what they have done by end of term.

Name me one big project which isn't being build with loan or private investment including motorways.

This is how Pakistan works. You take out loan to build something and then pay back with interest over decades. This cycle continues as current gov pay back previous gov loans and so on. With low tax revenues it then doesn't have much left to build big projects.

The reason we easily get billions of private investment and loans for motorway is because our domestic railways and aviation sector is in shambles. Most Pakistanis use roads. Easy to see why we get billions of $ in investment which they recover with toll fees.

Said this I do think Bhasha dam will be build with internal resources as its too important now, Pakistan cannot delay it anymore.
Sir agree with most part but trust me motorway can't payback the loans. if you remember DURING m-2 time it was mentioned that Total revenue of NHA is less then yearly fixed interest of M-2 (2 Billion Rupee).
Dam is more profitable question is if Govt reduce its other cost and get loan and/or involve private sector(Share or profit for some period).
 
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You are comparing apples to oranges.
OK.

Why was it built?
What important is How? because they had money
For Direct Cargo Fight but most important was foreign buyer direct flight to city.

Those highways are not suitable for industrial or agricultural growth. Motorways are not built for our leisurely travels.

Motorways are always away from the cities, that is their whole point. Inter-city travel is catered to by other roads. Your point number 3 used to be a thing when M1 and M2 were new, not anymore.
Growth Industrial & Agriculture?
Textile your industry main backbone most unit closed or about too permanently closed other on & off and very few Large Group are showing growth. Reason High Power Generation cost not Motorway.
Agriculture Sector heavily depend on Canal water for which you need dam not Motorway.
Motorway is always away but who will improve existing Highway which are direct route.

As mentioned before as well, the existing highways are completely unsuitable for expansion since all of them were built on the older models of highways running through towns and cities which is exactly what a motorway isn't supposed to do.
If you remember they have bypass for major cities even small one and yes there are shops & homes here and there on the way but space is still there to add more lanes.

Motorways are anything but luxury. They are essential to any regions industrial growth, which in Pakistan needs multiple steroid shots. The only thing worth mentioning that the PMLN has ever done is building those two motorways. Motorways bring industrial growth through out their length, create opportunities in regions which never had any, from agriculture to industry, everyone benefits from them. The cement industry throughout central to northern Punjab is a great example of what a motorway can do for an industry.
Motorway will give temporary boast to sector related to its Constructions & materials.
what you forget its nothing new we already had road not as good as motorway but roads are there.
Pls Explain Textiles industries in Lahore/Faisalabad closed. Reason Cost of doing business (Electricity) is too high. When there was no Motorway b/w Fsb-Lhr & Karachi this sector show huge boom. Will your Motorway Give them Boost?
Pls Explain Agri sector How will you replace Water with motorway??? Will your motorway help crop grow faster or very less water?

You are comparing apples and oranges again. If dams are the heart transplant then motorways are the medication that stops your body from rejecting that transplant. This is a severe lack of understanding of how motorways work within a given economy.
Lol! no dam no cheap electricity meaning most industrial unit closed. your logic of few hours or max 24 hour early delivery will change nothing.
motorway logic works when you have no main roads but you already have highway although only 4 lane. which should be 6 lane minimum. like GT road which is much wider.
I have. And you are again under the impression that these motorways are primarily there for leisure use. Those HTVs are what these highways and motorways are most important to. Your travel from Karachi to Lahore has a minuscule impact on the country's economy, if at all, and is not what those highways are essentially for. And take it from someone who has worked in supply chain in Pakistan and Canada; motorways are a life saver. So much so that I made my company bear the extra costs of having all our major suppliers in Karachi stock warehouses in Islamabad just for us. Why? The extra cost was worth the reliability of receiving our raw materials on time. I can also get you in contact with our reps in satellite locations whose daily mantra includes the moaning of how they need better connectivity in their region when their supplies take a day to travel the first 2000 KM and then two more to travel the next 500.
i shared may experience because when i say road has a capacity its true because i have seen it with my own eyes.
HTV occupied Fast Lane or Car Lane because that Road do not have Middle Lane which they can use while overtaking.
you are not alone i am also one of those who prefer motorway but whats important is not me or you or people you deal with who trust me are in number but are small one in this markets segment.
Trust me Situation is not good in Pakistan & problem is Expensive energy.
And are you suggestion that we build limited access motorways through the middle of existing cities and then build bypasses? Take a moment to recognise the 4 very major and obvious flaws in this plan. After you're done with that ponder a little bit on why were those bypasses built? Why were they needed? Do you not see it?

And once you're done with all of the above please give us a rough idea of how many population centres does, say, the GT Road pass through on average in a 100Km stretch. We will then figure out how many bypasses need to be built on that 100Km stretch.
No Sir you misread. i am not saying built. i am only pointing that Bypass already exist for Cities & even small one.
No Sir you misread. i am not saying built. i am only pointing that Bypass already exist for Cities & even small one.
No you don't because they have very few Shops or houses and not many people cross.
80-100Km speed is ok whats not is 5~10KM speed because of HTV. Reduce speed SIgn is only few and small patches but that is not the problem.
Existing Lhr-Khi Road has space what it needed is two more lane. You should also think about common man Suffering due too those 4 lane. Like you and me they also are citizen of this country.

No you don't because they have very few Shops or houses and not many people cross.
80-100Km speed is ok whats not is 5~10KM speed because of HTV. Reduce speed SIgn is only few and small patches but that is not the problem.
You've lost us again. The obvious efforts to replace the GT Road, Multan Road and N-5 with motorways should be enough for one to understand that these highways built on the older models (ancient in the GT Road's case) just aren't cutting it. How is this not obvious?
Existing road still has potential(Space) i am talking about Lhr-Khi Road & they genuinely need more lane due to congestion. Motorway will help people like you & me. But fact is most people who travel b/w Lhr-Khi are neither like you & me. This Road will still have more traffic then Motorway.

You mean the part where it connects to the city? Do you not see what you are saying?

Go through the following for a basic understanding of what proper roads can do for your economy.

http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/74747/10/10_chapter-3.pdf

https://assets.publishing.service.g...achment_data/file/212590/action-for-roads.pdf

The last one is particularly interesting as it shows how a country as small as England which already has an extensive network of Motorways covering pretty much all of its territory is still trying to improve them to benefit its economy.
I pointed that magical motorway part from Karachi to Hyderabad which is more like GT road then Motorway because its just the name change.
Sir it will improve economy if you have industry. You industry is suffering due to energy crisis motorway will not help.
 
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1> Gov.t might not have 16 billion in any given day but they do have money.
2> For How Long this Basha Dam is pending?
3> How much loan both Govt(PPP & PML-N) took.
4> how much Govt run department
5> how much Govt run companies are costing to this country
6> How Much Metro + support(Pole+line+crossing etc) + its yearly subsidies+maintenance Cost?
PS: you not only need basha you need multiple dams & KB should be on priority(Canal,Quick, 500KVA line availbilty)

1. Not at all, after giving money to provinces, defence budget and debt serving. Federal is not left with much.
2. Because for reasons I stated above gov have desperately tried everything to build Bhasha dam with loan. Now once that option not possible because of Indian lobby in WB. That means Pakistan will have to build dam with its own resources without taking loan.

Metro etc are provincial projects.


it will reduce traffic but it will never replace existing road.
Second you can't connect everything with motorway.
third not every one is like you and me we have people who travel on local instead of Dewoo for Lhr-Rwp because it cost Rs 500 only.

You can connect cities with motorways. They will reduce travel time by half between all major cities of Pakistan, that is huge improvement.


Sir agree with most part but trust me motorway can't payback the loans. if you remember DURING m-2 time it was mentioned that Total revenue of NHA is less then yearly fixed interest of M-2 (2 Billion Rupee).
Dam is more profitable question is if Govt reduce its other cost and get loan and/or involve private sector(Share or profit for some period).

As I said above motorways are being build with private and some loans. Not building them will not speed up Bhasha dam. People need to understand this.
 
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Narowal Link Road To Sialkot - Lahore Motorway

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Gentlemen I hope Pakistan keeps constructing more motorways. As it is Pakistan is the class leader in high volume/high speed motorway network in South Asia. The motorways of Pakistan will go on to revolutionize Pakistan. In another two decades we will see the change they will bring to Pakistan.
 
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Gentlemen I hope Pakistan keeps constructing more motorways. As it is Pakistan is the class leader in high volume/high speed motorway network in South Asia. The motorways of Pakistan will go on to revolutionize Pakistan. In another two decades we will see the change they will bring to Pakistan.
The reason for this -

  1. They act like arteries. They nourish and connect the areas they pass through and connect them with country/globe
  2. They will create node points along the network which will in time develop into towns/cities of tomorrow.
  3. Think of GT road. Think of all the towns/cities that are strung along it.
  4. They will bring virgin land/regions to forefront of economic activity.
  5. They will diffuse development across Pakistan.
  6. They will connect/bring people together.
  7. They will create new economic corridors along their path.
Just give time and economic forces to play out. Motorways of Pakistanb are harbingers of change. I hope and expect multitude of industrail trading estates to take root along the node points created by the motorway network and many a Chinese company will establish operations along the way to connect Pakistan with the economic miracle that is China.

Pakistan needs to focus on law/order, education and creating a business friendly environment. Success will sure follow.
 
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The reason for this -

  1. They act like arteries. They nourish and connect the areas they pass through and connect them with country/globe
  2. They will create node points along the network which will in time develop into towns/cities of tomorrow.
  3. Think of GT road. Think of all the towns/cities that are strung along it.
  4. They will bring virgin land/regions to forefront of economic activity.
  5. They will diffuse development across Pakistan.
  6. They will connect/bring people together.
  7. They will create new economic corridors along their path.
Just give time and economic forces to play out. Motorways of Pakistanb are harbingers of change. I hope and expect multitude of industrail trading estates to take root along the node points created by the motorway network and many a Chinese company will establish operations along the way to connect Pakistan with the economic miracle that is China.

Pakistan needs to focus on law/order, education and creating a business friendly environment. Success will sure follow.

Especially if all government have to do is provide land in case of private investment. From top of my head Swat motorway, Sialkot-Lahore, Karachi-Hydrabad-Sukkur are on BOT basis.


National Highway Authority (NHA) Awards Five BOT Projects Worth 373 Billions
"Among the ongoing Build, Operate & Transfer (BOT) projects include 136 km Karachi-Hyderabad Motorway (M-9), which is almost complete, 91 km Lahore-Sialkot Motorway (M-11), and about 300 km Hyderabad-Sukkur Motorway (M-6)."
https://www.urdupoint.com/en/pakistan/national-highway-authority-nha-awards-five-331907.html

If NHA can continue to attract private investment to build world class motorways then it will be stupidity to refuse them. Price of land is very small part of overall cost, maybe 10-15% at best.
 
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Updates 10/6/2018.
Hazara Expressway .. E-35
Mansehra.

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HAZARA EXPRESSWAY (E-35)

Shahkot, Abbottabad.

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It will be very soon through a six lane expressway.

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