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Pakistan to stick with RD-93 engine for JF-17, say PAF officials

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Pakistan to stick with RD-93 engine for JF-17, say PAF officials | IHS Jane's 360

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Pakistan to stick with RD-93 engine for JF-17, say PAF officials
Reuben F Johnson, Dubai - IHS Jane's Defence Weekly
18 November 2015
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A Pakistan Air Force JF-17 Thunder making the type's first European display at the Paris Air Show on 15 June. Source: IHS/Patrick Allen
The Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) has no plans to replace the JF-17 fighter's Klimov/Sarkisov RD-93 powerplant despite Chinese suggestions otherwise, according to Pakistan Air Force (PAF) officials.

While several, non-specific statements have been made by representatives from Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC) during the past few months, a PAC senior representative recently told IHS Jane's , "We are completely satisfied with this Russian-made engine.

"When we designed the JF-17 we evaluated a number of design alternatives and we determined that the RD-93 in this single-engine installation is absolutely right for this application," he said. "We worked extensively with the people from Klimov bureau in St Petersburg [Russia] and this engine turned out to be an ideal solution."

PAC representatives added that the next step is to establish a full-scale servicing and overhaul facility for the RD-93 at their plant in Kamra.

"What does this tell you?" asked one programme officer rhetorically. "If the situation was as it has been portrayed at times - that we are just utilising the RD-93 as a temporary solution until the Chinese can 'save' us with their own new engine - then we would not be expending the resources to set up this overhaul base. For us, changing to another engine would not make any sense and would be disruptive and cause a huge expense for the JF-17 programme."

PAF officials told IHS Jane's at the 2015 Dubai Air Show that improvements to the JF-17's design and the reliability of the RD-93 have attracted a number of interested parties.

"The experience at [the Paris Airshow in] Le Bourget brought about 11-12 countries that approached us with some interest in a JF-17 acquisition," said one of the officials. "Out of all of those there are today some four or five customers that we regard as being serious prospects in the near term." PAC representatives declined to name any of those countries, however.
 
Hi.

That tells you that the RD93 is the right engine for his aircraft and it was the right engine from day one. The issue about the power are not technical in nature but just for the armchair bandits----blowing bubbles.

This is not a race of who is faster from 0 to 60---but the race is for endurance---utility---availability---ease of servicing and reliability.

Young pakistanis must learn and realize that in weapons of war---you do not go out for glittery and shinny stuff--but you go for the known and proven---.

This is not a dash for a 100 meters race---but this is sustenance for a marathon---so your utility needs to be suitable for the marathon.

We also find out that the smoke issue is also secondary---and there is no big deal about it----it was just a drama created by the critics who could not find anything else wrong with it.
 
Hi.

That tells you that the RD93 is the right engine for his aircraft and it was the right engine from day one. The issue about the power are not technical in nature but just for the armchair bandits----blowing bubbles.

This is not a race of who is faster from 0 to 60---but the race is for endurance---utility---availability---ease of servicing and reliability.

Young pakistanis must learn and realize that in weapons of war---you do not go out for glittery and shinny stuff--but you go for the known and proven---.

This is not a dash for a 100 meters race---but this is sustenance for a marathon---so your utility needs to be suitable for the marathon.

We also find out that the smoke issue is also secondary---and there is no big deal about it----it was just a drama created by the critics who could not find anything else wrong with it.
Sir
Isn't smoke screen is issue in WVR fight as it make aircraft easy to find?
Also will RD93 be able to power AESA in block 3 and will be able to lift further payload in the form of more weapons,fuel and EW pods?

I believe this decision is taken to keep the overall price of air craft low by compromising it's performance......
 
Any chance of increase in thrust?

@MastanKhan

No. What the Article tells you is :

That we are just utilising the RD-93 as a temporary solution until the Chinese can 'save' us with their own new engine - then we would not be expending the resources to set up this overhaul base. For us, changing to another engine would not make any sense and would be disruptive and cause a huge expense for the JF-17 programme

Which means, RD93 is the ONLY Solution , as of now, though... its not the BEST Solution ( due to "Huge expense for the JF-17 programme" )... As the Plan was to get the Chinese Engine.

Shortage of Funds = The Engine has to be CHEAPEST.

"We are completely satisfied with this Russian-made engine." is like they are counting on the Bird in Hand rather hoping for 2 in the Bush. Good Thinking.

What surprised me, that Chinese Engine ( I iguess they mean the over all cost , retrofits and MLU costs ) is costlier.
You better keep your hatred in check, otherwise the repercussions, will NOT be nice.

Good day!
 
Any chance of increase in thrust?


You better keep your hatred in check, otherwise the repercussions, will NOT be nice.

Good day!

Next version (RD-93MA?)is under development or so I believe, with increased thrust and lower life cycle cost. Expected to complete development by 2018 and probably will power Block3 which will be coming out at the same time. Since we are talking 250 birds for PAF and AVIC forecasts another 300 exports worldwide, huge number has got Europeans interested as well. They would love EJ200 to have a slice of 500+ fighters over next 20 years. Not a small number to ignore if you factor in post sale support and parts.
 
I am only interested in a Pakistani made RD-93 engine. It will be the best thing happen to this program after the first flight of JF-17 Thunder.

Russians will surely help Pakistan in engine manufacturing or overhauling facility. Pakistan International Airlines had a jet engine maintenance and overhauling facility in good old days, don't know the current status. We need to manufacture jet engines, turbines, piston engines and other high tech mechanical and electrical equipment in Pakistan. It will surely help us to move ahead.
 
It makes sense considering Pakistan is in talks over RD93 repair facility with Russia. Maybe replacement would be enhanced RD93MA instead of replacement with Chinese version.
 
The focus seems to be more in interesting the Russians to open a maintenance facility so that Russia can be pulled closer...besides..I doubt there are any other deliverable options available..The ej200 ..The Europeans aren't going to let chinese engineers anywhere close to thier product. ..and for the chinese engines. .hmm.

The funny part on this article was that pac designed the plane and that they "worked" extensively with the Russian engineers from klimov.
 
i guess pakistan thinks the ws-13 is no good for the jf-17. if this is the case then whats going to happen when it comes to the j31? i hear the tfx is a good proposal, featuring ej200 engines.
 
The focus seems to be more in interesting the Russians to open a maintenance facility so that Russia can be pulled closer...besides..I doubt there are any other deliverable options available..The ej200 ..The Europeans aren't going to let chinese engineers anywhere close to thier product. ..and for the chinese engines. .hmm.

The funny part on this article was that pac designed the plane and that they "worked" extensively with the Russian engineers from klimov.
Just Like BRAHMOS my friend or license produced "Indigenous" Subamrines ...! If India does it then its JV when Pakistan does then its funny part..How insecure :rofl::rofl:
 
@Khafee @MastanKhan @Windjammer @Oscar @araz @Horus guys this question might sound stupid but i am just curious to know..

lets suppose we redesign the JF-thunder for block-4 ( lets Assume ) , and as many people complained that PAF does not have double engine fighters , so can we use two RD-93 Engines , and transform the JF into a double engine fighter ?
i mean if Russians agree on a long term deal of providing these Engines to Pakistan than we can redesign the Fighter and make it a double engine fighter .. by using 2 RD-93's ? is that possible ?

If yes than what could be the possible hurdles ? and if no than why not ??
will using 2 RD-93's will increase the Capabilities of JF ? for example maneuverability and thrust ?
 
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@Khafee @MastanKhan @Windjammer guys this question might sound stupid but i am just curious to know..

lets suppose we redesign the JF-thunder for block-4 ( lets Assume ) , and as many people complained that PAF does not have double engine fighters , so can we use two RD-93 Engines , and transform the JF into a double engine fighter ?
i mean if Russians agree on a long term deal of providing these Engines to Pakistan than we can redesign the Fighter and make it a double engine fighter .. by using 2 RD-93's ? is that possible ?

If yes than what could be the possible hurdles ? and if no than why not ??
will using 2 RD-93's will increase the Capabilities of JF ? for example maneuverability and thrust ?

Then that would be JF-19

You would need new fuselage, new wings, in other words totally new design. From drawing board to squadron, a minimum of 5 ~ 7 years.

Doesn't sound very viable.
 
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