Pakistan needs to replace China with Russia

[Mrc]

Russian weapons will ever b inferior to chinese they cannot spend on research as Chinese can

 

[JafarQureshi]

View attachment 624859

Seems like an old chart. India is no longer buying SU-30 while China bought other systems since.

What Russian weapons are being bought by China?
The US has imposed military sanctions on China for its purchase of fighter jets and missiles but what else is on the shopping list?

Keegan Elmer in Beijing and Liu Zhen in Beijing
Published: 2:49pm, 21 Sep, 2018

US slaps sanctions on Chinese military unit for buying Russian jets, missiles
21 Sep 2018

Here are some of the military items Russia sells to China:

SUKHOI SU-35

The US State Department said China received 10 Su-35 combat aircraft in December 2017, becoming the first foreign country to purchase Russia’s upgrade to its Su-27.


The Su-35 is powered by two AL-117S turbofan engines and fitted with thrust-vectoring nozzles enabling it to perform post-stall manoeuvres at low speeds.

The Su-35 also features a multifunctional radar capable of tracking up to 30 targets simultaneously.

Beijing again flexes military muscle, sending fighter jets, bombers around Taiwan

Beijing flexed its military muscle in May against Taiwan, flying Su-35 fighters with H-6K strategic bombers across the Bashi Channel between the self-ruled island and the northern islands of the Philippines.

S-400 AIR DEFENCE MISSILE SYSTEM

The State Department also said China bought an S-400 system this year, the first regimental set delivered as part of a contract signed in 2014.


As one of the world’s top air defence systems, the S-400 includes missiles with different ranges, from 40km to 400km, which can hit targets from altitudes of 10m to 30km to form a multi-layer full coverage of defence.


The S-400’s advanced radar capability improves detection of stealth aircraft and the ability to counter electronic jamming.

One S-400 system features 384 missiles and up to 72 launchers. It can track 300 targets at the same time and attack 36 at once. It can hit a target travelling at a maximum speed of 4,800 metres per second, or Mach 15.


Russia is also set to sell the S-400 to Turkey, which has raised concerns within Nato.

The highly versatile Ka-32A11VS helicopter, part of China’s military purchases from Russia. Photo: Alamy
KAMOV HELICOPTERS

China bought seven Kamov Ka-32A11VS multirole helicopters in 2016, and two more in 2017 from Russian Helicopters holding company. The contracts included training for Chinese pilots.

The multipurpose helicopters are suitable for a wide variety of missions, including firefighting, search and rescue operations, and patrolling.

The Ka-32 is a highly versatile craft, capable of carrying cargo inside its fuselage as well as externally. Its coaxial rotor allows it to make precise landings in mountainous terrain or dense urban environments.

China hits back at American sanctions over Russian fighter jet and missile purchases

It can also be equipped with a range of special equipment, such as water cannons for fire fighting, and performs well in the face of dense smoke or dust. It is also suitable for high altitude construction and cargo transport.

AL-31F ENGINES

China has also ordered 150 AL-31F turbofan engines from Russia. By the end of last year, 100 had been delivered, according to Sweden-based think tank SIPRI.

China placed this order primarily for its Shenyang J-15 “Flying Shark” carrier-based fighters, a made-in-China modification of the Sukhoi Su-27 “Flanker” fighter. The AL-31 series is the basic engine developed for the extensive Su-27 family.

China is believed to have built a few dozen J-15 fighters which are understood to be in service on-board the Liaoning aircraft carrier.

In addition, some AL-31FM engines have been fitted to early test types of the Chengdu J-20, a fifth generation stealth fighter.

Later versions of the J-20 have used home-made WS-10 engines but neither engine could fully meet the need for speed, manoeuvrability and stealth of China’s most advanced fighter jet.

China has also bought nearly 400 AL-31FN engines for its home-made Chengdu J-10 fighters and 10 AL-41F-1S engines have been ordered as spare parts for the Su-35 fighters.

An H-6K bomber, powered by a Russian D-30 engine, during a PLA air force training exercise over the South China Sea in November 2017. Photo: Xinhua
D-30 ENGINES

The Soloviev D-30 (PS-30) is a Soviet Union era two-shaft low-bypass turbofan engine, used to power aircraft such as the Y-20 military transport and H-6K bomber.

The H-6K bomber, which entered service in October 2009, has a claimed combat radius of 3,500 kilometres with the D-30 engines.

Additional reporting by Teddy Ng

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/military/article/2165182/what-weapons-china-buying-russia

Russian weapons will ever b inferior to chinese they cannot spend on research as Chinese can

Money alone cannot create tech. There are rich countries like Saudi Arabia.

 

[TNT]

Is it time to replace China with Russia?

No doubt China has given us many technologies and weapon systems but they don't to it for the love of Pakistan rather to confront India.

Even if Pakistan does not buy any weapons from China, they will still consider India as their rival & enemy. So they is no risk of China selling any weapons to India.

On the other hand, Russia had been selling weapons to India for many decades now but this relationship is very weak today thanks to Modi who is anti-Russia. Today, Modi's India is primarily buying weapons from the US.

Hence, Pakistan buying weapons from Russia instead of China would break the Russia-India relationship permanently and we could get advanced weapons systems from Russia.

And you think half a century of trust and relations can be replaced? U think Pakistan can replace the amount of money India still gives to russia for weapons??
What kind of kiddish and delusional thread is this?

 

[JafarQureshi]

And you think half a century of trust and relations can be replaced? U think Pakistan can replace the amount of money India still gives to russia for weapons??
What kind of kiddish and delusional thread is this?

Russia approved engines for JF-17s even as India was buying SU-30s. Now they no longer have any major deals going. They only have some small deals for spares.

 

[Ahmet Pasha]

A very very good idea. This will help us diversify. Who knows friends today, enemies tomorrow??

Yes some of Russian big ticket items are maintenance heavy. But we can find other weapon systems we need from them. Like air defence, armor and helicopters for example.

Especially subsystems from them are another area we can explore with them.

It is time Pakistan focuses on the grass roots of Pakistani industry defence or otherwise. And stop being fixated with stop gaps.

HIT needs to get it's act together and start making quality products we can use at home, sell abroad and make money.

Is it time to replace China with Russia?

No doubt China has given us many technologies and weapon systems but they don't to it for the love of Pakistan rather to confront India.

Even if Pakistan does not buy any weapons from China, they will still consider India as their rival & enemy. So they is no risk of China selling any weapons to India.

On the other hand, Russia had been selling weapons to India for many decades now but this relationship is very weak today thanks to Modi who is anti-Russia. Today, Modi's India is primarily buying weapons from the US.

Hence, Pakistan buying weapons from Russia instead of China would break the Russia-India relationship permanently and we could get advanced weapons systems from Russia.

 

[Mughal-Prince]

You can blame Liaquat Ali Khan, he had a ready invitation to USSR and ditched it and went to US camp and until today we paying the price.

Read the facts from history that actually happen just don't jump over the wagon with the usual unauthentic bs from the disinformation library. The shortest thing I mention here is USSR either withdrew or used delaying tactics in order to lure India and they do it on purpose.

 

[ARMalik]

Is it time to replace China with Russia?

NO !

 

[JafarQureshi]

A very very good idea. This will help us diversify. Who knows friends today, enemies tomorrow??

Yes some of Russian big ticket items are maintenance heavy. But we can find other weapon systems we need from them. Like air defence, armor and helicopters for example.

Especially subsystems from them are another area we can explore with them.

It is time Pakistan focuses on the grass roots of Pakistani industry defence or otherwise. And stop being fixated with stop gaps.

HIT needs to get it's act together and start making quality products we can use at home, sell abroad and make money.

Russia is already helping us with MRO facilities for our JF-17 engines. S-400, Armata, Hypersonic Cruise Missles would good starters.

 

[Mrc]

Seems like an old chart. India is no longer buying SU-30 while China bought other systems since.

What Russian weapons are being bought by China?
The US has imposed military sanctions on China for its purchase of fighter jets and missiles but what else is on the shopping list?

Keegan Elmer in Beijing and Liu Zhen in Beijing
Published: 2:49pm, 21 Sep, 2018

US slaps sanctions on Chinese military unit for buying Russian jets, missiles
21 Sep 2018
View attachment 624861
Here are some of the military items Russia sells to China:

SUKHOI SU-35

The US State Department said China received 10 Su-35 combat aircraft in December 2017, becoming the first foreign country to purchase Russia’s upgrade to its Su-27.


The Su-35 is powered by two AL-117S turbofan engines and fitted with thrust-vectoring nozzles enabling it to perform post-stall manoeuvres at low speeds.

The Su-35 also features a multifunctional radar capable of tracking up to 30 targets simultaneously.

Beijing again flexes military muscle, sending fighter jets, bombers around Taiwan

Beijing flexed its military muscle in May against Taiwan, flying Su-35 fighters with H-6K strategic bombers across the Bashi Channel between the self-ruled island and the northern islands of the Philippines.

S-400 AIR DEFENCE MISSILE SYSTEM

The State Department also said China bought an S-400 system this year, the first regimental set delivered as part of a contract signed in 2014.


As one of the world’s top air defence systems, the S-400 includes missiles with different ranges, from 40km to 400km, which can hit targets from altitudes of 10m to 30km to form a multi-layer full coverage of defence.


The S-400’s advanced radar capability improves detection of stealth aircraft and the ability to counter electronic jamming.

One S-400 system features 384 missiles and up to 72 launchers. It can track 300 targets at the same time and attack 36 at once. It can hit a target travelling at a maximum speed of 4,800 metres per second, or Mach 15.


Russia is also set to sell the S-400 to Turkey, which has raised concerns within Nato.

The highly versatile Ka-32A11VS helicopter, part of China’s military purchases from Russia. Photo: Alamy
KAMOV HELICOPTERS

China bought seven Kamov Ka-32A11VS multirole helicopters in 2016, and two more in 2017 from Russian Helicopters holding company. The contracts included training for Chinese pilots.

The multipurpose helicopters are suitable for a wide variety of missions, including firefighting, search and rescue operations, and patrolling.

The Ka-32 is a highly versatile craft, capable of carrying cargo inside its fuselage as well as externally. Its coaxial rotor allows it to make precise landings in mountainous terrain or dense urban environments.

China hits back at American sanctions over Russian fighter jet and missile purchases

It can also be equipped with a range of special equipment, such as water cannons for fire fighting, and performs well in the face of dense smoke or dust. It is also suitable for high altitude construction and cargo transport.

AL-31F ENGINES

China has also ordered 150 AL-31F turbofan engines from Russia. By the end of last year, 100 had been delivered, according to Sweden-based think tank SIPRI.

China placed this order primarily for its Shenyang J-15 “Flying Shark” carrier-based fighters, a made-in-China modification of the Sukhoi Su-27 “Flanker” fighter. The AL-31 series is the basic engine developed for the extensive Su-27 family.

China is believed to have built a few dozen J-15 fighters which are understood to be in service on-board the Liaoning aircraft carrier.

In addition, some AL-31FM engines have been fitted to early test types of the Chengdu J-20, a fifth generation stealth fighter.

Later versions of the J-20 have used home-made WS-10 engines but neither engine could fully meet the need for speed, manoeuvrability and stealth of China’s most advanced fighter jet.

China has also bought nearly 400 AL-31FN engines for its home-made Chengdu J-10 fighters and 10 AL-41F-1S engines have been ordered as spare parts for the Su-35 fighters.

An H-6K bomber, powered by a Russian D-30 engine, during a PLA air force training exercise over the South China Sea in November 2017. Photo: Xinhua
D-30 ENGINES

The Soloviev D-30 (PS-30) is a Soviet Union era two-shaft low-bypass turbofan engine, used to power aircraft such as the Y-20 military transport and H-6K bomber.

The H-6K bomber, which entered service in October 2009, has a claimed combat radius of 3,500 kilometres with the D-30 engines.

Additional reporting by Teddy Ng

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/military/article/2165182/what-weapons-china-buying-russia



Money alone cannot create tech. There are rich countries like Saudi Arabia.

Lack of money certainly cannot create ground breaking tech either

 

[JafarQureshi]

Lack of money certainly cannot create ground breaking tech either

Lack of Money? Russia is a resource and tech rich nation. They have the biggest gas resources in the world.

 

[Figaro]

Lack of Money? Russia is a resource and tech rich nation. They have the biggest gas resources in the world.

LOL ... please look at the current economic landscape. Look at the price of oil and natural gas and tell me that Russia's economy is not suffering. And please tell me how is Russia "tech rich"? They don't have a single technology company I've heard of other than their arms companies and a social media company called Vk.

Indian hardly spends anything on new Russian weapons. Whatever they have been spending are on spares for the weapons that they had already bought in the past. All their new weapons like Apaches, Chinook, P8, MH-60, C-130, C-10, M777, Scorpene, Rafale, Phalcon, Barak, Spike, Heron etc. are all from the US, Israel and France.

If we put enough money to build the relationship, Russia will support us. We need to show seriousness by diverting our funds from China towards Russia.



Why not. I am hopeful that it would happen.

Russia will never support Pakistan over India no matter how much money it throws towards Russia. If Russia starts supporting India, India would quickly move much closer to the United States and the Russian defense industry and various economic sectors would immediately begin to suffer. You seem to have forgotten that the Indians have been friends with the Russians since the Cold War ... during that time Pakistan was sending fighters to fight Russia/former USSR. A long lasting friendship like this is bound to last for a while and certainly India has the money to continue this friendship going (Russia is a super opportunistic country after all).

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

Russians are not anti-Islam. They support Iran & Syria. Also, they are selling S-400 to Turkey and building Turkstream pipeline through Turkey. They are also selling us engines for our JF-17s.

Find some Russians and ask them what they think of Muslims and esp Turkey and Pakistan. Prepare to get your eyes opened.

Iran and Syria are countries which are part of the problem and not the solution. Iran specifically is unfriendly towards Pakistan.

At the end of the day, It is Pakistan which can give both Russia and China access to the Arabian Sea. We should not under sell our importance.

Russia tried to gain access by force, they failed. They actively interfered in BD formation and in trying to overtly invade us.

Pakistan is a potential regional adversary of Russia. Our expanding influence in Central Asia means they will have less. It will mean Islamization of those countries. Iran's decreasing role in Afghanistan is not seen positively by them either.

 

[Beast]

Is it time to replace China with Russia?

No doubt China has given us many technologies and weapon systems but they don't to it for the love of Pakistan rather to confront India.

Even if Pakistan does not buy any weapons from China, they will still consider India as their rival & enemy. So they is no risk of China selling any weapons to India.

On the other hand, Russia had been selling weapons to India for many decades now but this relationship is very weak today thanks to Modi who is anti-Russia. Today, Modi's India is primarily buying weapons from the US.

Hence, Pakistan buying weapons from Russia instead of China would break the Russia-India relationship permanently and we could get advanced weapons systems from Russia.

Its not a matter of u want to improve military r/s with Russia but a matter of Russia not interested to further improve with Pakistan. Tell me, how many billion of money u have compare to India when comes to buying Russia arms? Russia military r/s with India is not as rosy as past but India still significantly contributed a great portion of military purchase for Russia defence industries. Until pakitsan economy hit a trillion. Russia will not give a hood about building further military r/s with Pakistan. So far what Russia sold u is either thru Ukraine or non essential weapon like few Mi-35 which Russia will as bait to further remind India that they can sell weapons to Pakistan for buying too many American weapon.

 

[Mrc]

Lack of Money? Russia is a resource and tech rich nation. They have the biggest gas resources in the world.

Like it or not future is china and not Russia. I m sure Russian gas reserves are a fraction of Arab oil reserves. So are arabs the future??

They are not tech savvy as Chinese are

 

[Beast]

How so? Have you not noticed how Russia is fighting in/for Syria?

Yup, like refusing to fire s-300 missile and happily allow Israel to raid Syria Assad at will...

No wonder Assad is angry at Russia.