Pakistan Navy interested in J-11Bs

[Donatello]

How many engines does J-11B have ?

If PAF cannot maintain twin engine, how can PN afford to do it with the least possible budget ?

Or perhaps China is actually helping Pakistan develop it's own version of J-11b known as J-11x that will have only 1 engine, better performance, fuel efficiency (because it's 1 engine less), and reduced RCS (almost 5th gen)

PN is getting budget increases every year now. If PN can afford the 6 Subs with Chinese, they sure can afford a squadron of J-11s.......If PAF get's J-10s with the same engines as in J-11s or similar types.....the maintenance costs will come down...

 

[Xracer]

Or perhaps China is actually helping Pakistan develop it's own version of J-11b known as J-11x that will have only 1 engine, better performance, fuel efficiency (because it's 1 engine less), and reduced RCS (almost 5th gen)

hahahaha very funnyi am gona die laughing

 

[Avatar]

We have had and mantained twin engine aircraft such as A-5 nothing new... and as per my thinking PN was in talk about J-11 no soild source of info or deal as of yet to my knowledge if their is then great hope we do get a few SQ's for the navy simple as that. You guys always talk about budget stop worrying about what we can afford or not Pakistan does buy arms so it has the funds for it.We shall have to see what happens with the J-11 news.

J-11b's are definitely a good choice for PN given the situation. However is there really need to invest in them, given that war is not imminent in the near future ? These aircraft will be obsolete when 5th gen fighters are introduced, so it is wiser to save for 5th gen and invest this money in education so your future generations can afford more 5th gen fighters when a war is more likely.

 

[PakShaheen79]

I think Pakistan Navy must have its own aviation wing instead of some dedicated squadrons of PAF. It would help them integrate them in doctrine. J-11B is certainly a deadly machine ( as all the Flankers are) but with given economic conditions and the amount of weapon system already in pipeline, I don't think it will be in PN service anytime. Till then, integrate C-802/3 and Exocet on Thunders!

 

[ANG]

China's J-11 Fighter Jet Modernization Program ~ ASIAN DEFENCE NEWS

China's J-11 Fighter Jet Modernization Program

J-11B is the new version of the J-11, J-11B is a 4.5-generation multirole version which uses more Chinese components, including radar, engine, and missiles. The chief program engineer for J-11B is Mr. Guo Dianman. China is interested in reducing its reliance on foreign technology for both cost reasons and a desire to improve its domestic research and design. It is reported that one regiment of J-11B are currently in service.

In May, 2007, the existence of J-11B was finally acknowledged by the Chinese government for the first time when the state-run Chinese TV stations first aired the report on J-11B in PLAAF service. According to the Chinese report, which is agreed by some western sources such as Jane's Information Group, the J-11B is superior to Su-27SK in the following areas.

1) The wide adoption of composite material (mainly carbon fiber) for the surfaces, reducing the weight of the aircraft for more than 700 kg, while the life of the composite part is increased over 10,000 hours in comparison to the original part built from steel.

2) Redesigned air inlets of engine intakes to reduce the radar cross section, this coupled with the adoption of composite material, and application of radar absorbent material has reduced the radar cross section (RCS) of 15 square meters of Su-27SK to just >3 square meters of J-11B.

3) Full air-to-surface / sea capability is added and J-11B is able to launch various precision guided air-to-surface and air-to-sea munitions.

4) Certified to be equipped with WS-10 (will be upgraded to WS-10A in the future) turbofan engine, which is claimed to be cheaper to operate than AL-31F.

5) Incorporation of on-board oxygen generating system (OBOGS): With the exception of Su-35 and Su-37, J-11B is the first of the Su-27 family to incorporate such technology. Due to the adoption of western style design features such as fully digitized computerized controls and solid state micro-electronics, Chinese claimed that the domestic OBOGS is superior than the analog system Russia offered to China.

6) Improved radar. The new radar is able to track 8 targets at the same time, and engage 4 of the 8 tracked simultaneously. When used against large surface target such as a destroyer, the maximum range of the radar was in excess of 350 km. The range against aerial targets was not disclosed, but it would be definitely much shorter, as in all radars. The Chinese official report claims that the radar is better than the 147x/KLJ-X radar family, but stop short of identifying the exact type. Contrary to many erroneous comments by many domestic Chinese sources, which mistakenly claimed that the radar had adopted a passive phased array antenna, the official claims of many Chinese governmental sources such as technical journals and publications have revealed that the radar still adopted a slotted planar array antenna.

7) Fully digitized solid-state avionics has replaced the analogue one in Su-27SK. In the mid-2007, the Chinese governmental television station CCTV-7 released news clips of Chinese pilots in the cockpits of J-11B, with the LCD of glass cockpit of J-11B clearly visible, despite that the official report itself only claimed replacing the original avionics with domestic Chinese fully digitized solid-state avionics, and nothing of EFIS or glass cockpit was mentioned. In comparison to the earlier EFIS on J-11A, the most obvious difference is that LCD MFDs on J-11B are aligned in a straight line, instead of the middle one being slightly lower. The arrangement, appearance and layout of MFDs and EFIS of J-11B are similar to the general design concept of the west.

8) Missile Approach Warning System.

Professor Wang also revealed in the same interview that the J-11B will be equipped with domestic engines and J-11B is aerial refueling capable.

J-11BS is the tandem twin seater version of J-11B, J-11BS under development, reportedly as the Chinese version of Su-30MK2/3. It is rumored that the letter S stands for Shuangzuo, meaning twin seater in Chinese.

The existence of J-11BS is officially acknowledged by the Chinese government in 2007, and a large model of J-11BS was revealed public on June 9, 2007 during the opening ceremony of the new aerospace museum of the Harbin Institute of Technology at the 20-year anniversary of the establishment of its school of astronautics, where it is displayed. Some sources outside China have claimed that the successful development of J-11BS is one of reasons that China lacks the enthusiasm on purchasing Su-30MK3, but the Chinese government appears to be rather cautious with official reports only claiming that the project is very promising, instead of declaring it is successful already.

J-11C is the aircraft carrier version of J-11B, J-11C under development, reportedly as the Chinese version of Su-33. The first mock-up of J-11C was displayed in public at air shows and defense exhibitions in China in late 2002, and the mock-up is shown to be able to be armed with all currently available Chinese anti-ship missiles, as well as air-to-air missile including PL-12.

 

[Battle Axe]

I think It would be better to modify 2 Sq of Thunder for PN. That will be enough for providing a modest support on sea...

 

[ANG]

Hi, I think a two seater version of the J-10B would be a better idea that the JF-17. The Indian Ocean is a massive expanse of water and would require long distance and long loitering time patrols by any airborne platform to be effective. Also the JF-17's weapons load and radar range is much smaller than the J-10s.

Also please remember, the JF-17 would be tangling with Naval LCAs, MiG-29Ks, Sea Harriers, maritime Sepecat Jaguars and potentially IAF Su-30s. Two squadrons of JF-17s would not last that long. Also the IN surface ships have deadly SAM systems on them also.

The J-10 or J-11B would be better suited for the PN maritime attack role.

 

[SBD-3]

Hi, I think a two seater version of the J-10B would be a better idea that the JF-17. The Indian Ocean is a massive expanse of water and would require long distance and long loitering time patrols by any airborne platform to be effective. Also the JF-17's weapons load and radar range is much smaller than the J-10s.

Also please remember, the JF-17 would be tangling with Naval LCAs, MiG-29Ks, Sea Harriers, maritime Sepecat Jaguars and potentially IAF Su-30s. Two squadrons of JF-17s would not last that long. Also the IN surface ships have deadly SAM systems on them also.

The J-10 or J-11B would be better suited for the PN maritime attack role.

A JF-17 armed with Antiship,BVR,ARMs would do the perfect harm for any invading force, leave the deep sea operations to subs.

 

[ANG]

Hi, okay fine, good point. But I hope it is a two-seater JF-17, I like that version.

 

[Penguin]

Hi, I think a two seater version of the J-10B would be a better idea that the JF-17. The Indian Ocean is a massive expanse of water and would require long distance and long loitering time patrols by any airborne platform to be effective. Also the JF-17's weapons load and radar range is much smaller than the J-10s.

Also please remember, the JF-17 would be tangling with Naval LCAs, MiG-29Ks, Sea Harriers, maritime Sepecat Jaguars and potentially IAF Su-30s. Two squadrons of JF-17s would not last that long. Also the IN surface ships have deadly SAM systems on them also.

The J-10 or J-11B would be better suited for the PN maritime attack role.

Why bother with whole indian ocean: all Pakistan needs is use of SLOCs and they don't spann the whole Indian ocean.

 

[saad.94]

Is j-2x real???? i mean wheres official source?

 

[Tshering22]

Hi, I think a two seater version of the J-10B would be a better idea that the JF-17. The Indian Ocean is a massive expanse of water and would require long distance and long loitering time patrols by any airborne platform to be effective. Also the JF-17's weapons load and radar range is much smaller than the J-10s.

Huh!?

But you won't be anywhere near the Indian Ocean geographically anytime. Your Navy's core area of operation is the northern Arabian Sea. And since you don't operate an aircraft carrier, getting anywhere beyond your operational zone would be futile as you'd overshoot your area of interest.

So what's the point of getting a long range maritime jet?

Also please remember, the JF-17 would be tangling with Naval LCAs, MiG-29Ks, Sea Harriers, maritime Sepecat Jaguars and potentially IAF Su-30s. Two squadrons of JF-17s would not last that long.

INS Vikramaditya would be patrolling off coast Mumbai-Gujarat area which is quite distant from the water borders that we have established. It is unlikely that your jets would be ever engaging any of the jets you mentioned. The Jaguars and Su-30MKI strike unit for the Navy (commanded by IAF) are conventional; they cannot operate from carriers and this means that they will be deployed ONLY in the times of conflict or intended aggression. These jets would be based on firm land and won't be active until a threat is expected.

This is of course, during peacetime.

The J-10 or J-11B would be better suited for the PN maritime attack role

Both the jets would be unnecessary IMO. If I think from your perspective, I can estimate that there would be a need for a strong strike aircraft in Naval role that is land-based. This means, your jets can take off with weapons, deliver the required payload in areas of conflict, and return to re-arm and re-fuel (irrespective of which mode).

Unless you operate an aircraft carrier which is totally unfeasible for your geographical waters, getting a J-10 or a J-11 with the more powerful WS-10 engine (compared to RD-93 mid-engine category) would mean higher operating cost per hour and lower rate of sorties and the logistical headache for your Navy to train and hire J-11/J-10 specific engineers; a role that has till now never been assigned in your military.

In short, for coastal defense you guys should be doing very well with JF-17s dedicated for maritime roles but under PAF command rather than a separate Navy wing and without a carrier.

 

[Penguin]

Guy, shall we not revive a thread that died last year?

 

[PakShaheen79]

I think it was just another rumor coming from Pakistan Defense Rumor mill a.k.a Pakdef. Everyone by now must know that PN will be operating Thunders with C-802AK missiles for anti-ship role.

Everything about J-11 and J-10 written is rumors and have no official confirmation.

 

[ghauri05]

pakistan surely need this aircraft but the question is when?we still have not recieved j-10b and 50 jf-17which china promised to
give to pak as as soon as possible. but even it has taken almost 1 year