Pakistan CANNOT "conquer Kashmir through war" : Hina Rabbani Khar
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SSGPA1
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Can India conquer Kashmir by force? The answer is NO. The best way to move forward is that India politicians and govt. take Indians in confidence and sincerely negotiate with Pakistan without any delay.
The realty remains that Kashmiris don't want to be part of India; they may chose Pakistan or complete independence from both Pakistan ad India.
The realty remains that Kashmiris don't want to be part of India; they may chose Pakistan or complete independence from both Pakistan ad India.
Aali Shafi
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We are living in a world where economic strength is an integral part for the development of a country. Therefore, a country whose main source of revenue generation is agriculture and man power won't prefer to indulge in unnecessary wars. From this prespective, neither India nor Pakistan can concur Kashmir with military force.
Jackdaws
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So you don't have a source. Ok.Confirming my point that you guys indeed live in delusional world.
Will it kill you to research it by yourself? Don't you want to change my perception about India and you?
http://cs.mcgill.ca/~rwest/wikispeedia/wpcd/wp/s/Sheikh_Mujibur_Rahman.htm
It all started with one by one movement resisting against Pakistan ideology until it reached to the point which already had Pakistan cornered eventually.
Jackdaws
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LOL - do you even know how to back up your comments? You said India was supporting Mujib since 1950. And now you reroute me to some wiki page? And even the Wiki page doesn't say India was backing him since 1950. You are clueless.Will it kill you to research it by yourself? Don't you want to change my perception about India and you?
http://cs.mcgill.ca/~rwest/wikispeedia/wpcd/wp/s/Sheikh_Mujibur_Rahman.htm
It all started with one by one movement resisting against Pakistan ideology until it reached to the point which already had Pakistan cornered eventually.
I never said India groomed him. I said he was groomed alright. Soon after Pakistan became independent, it didn't take him long to target Pakistani ideology right away one by one movement. Whether it is wikipedia or csu, it is historical record.
You are the one said India was backing since 1950. I didn't say anything about India. I am talking about Mujib-ur-Rehman. You are the one who involuntary added more information. Even today, it still sound like accusation to you. Well, it makes sense considering Indian role in 1971, naturally you appear to be very edgy on this topic.
Jackdaws
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LOL - you have no clue. No Indian is edgy about 1971 - we are quite proud to have liberated that part of the world. And you are dodging as usual. Read up some history from some real books. LOL. You clearly insinuated that India was grooming Mujib - in your words "Pakistan and India becoming independence nation is not the discussion here, but Azad Kashmir became part of Pakistan for the same tactical reason which later applied for Bangladesh started grooming Mujub-ur-Rehman in 1950, till 1971, and the reason the plan succeeded because they never stopped bleeding Pakistan until Pakistan is put to the corner due to geographical strategy that isolated Pakistan from all around" - so whom were you referring to here? Japan? LOL. It is okay to be wrong. It's just daft to not admit it.I never said India groomed him. I said he was groomed alright. Soon after Pakistan became independent, it didn't take him long to target Pakistani ideology right away one by one movement. Whether it is wikipedia or csu, it is historical record.
You are the one said India was backing since 1950. I didn't say anything about India. I am talking about Mujib-ur-Rehman. You are the one who involuntary added more information. Even today, it still sound like accusation to you. Well, it makes sense considering Indian role in 1971, naturally you appear to be very edgy on this topic.
I didn't insinuated anything. My point is straight forward. If anything, you jumped to the bandwagon quick naturally what you have felt as the question market. India did play role for 1971 which you even boast about it. I never said anything about India grooming Mujib-ur-Rehman. That is on you.
Tiger Genie
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Pakistani military has not won a single war and lost everyone that it started. how the heck are they gonna 'conquer' anything. They can't even get rid of jihadi terror networks inside Pakistan even after years of bombing their own country plus with the help of American drones.
Signalian
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In a terrain like LOC areas of Kashmir, PA doesnt hold much edge for an offensive. Defence of a particular location is easier than conducting an offensive due to tough mobility conditions. The major roads will be constant targets by enemy to hamper supply lines. PA already uses mules for supplying different posts.
If an offensive is conducted by infantry in mountains and difficult cross country terrain, it will take hours and days to reach, fight and finally capture an enemy location on foot. The reinforcements and supplies will also come on foot either through mules or carried on backs of soldiers. The more time it takes to capture a location, the more casualties are expected which means formation strength reduced which needs to be kept in context for further offensives by this formation unless reinforcements are sent in time to it.
In absence of firepower from tanks, the major fire power assets are artillery and air support from aircrafts apart from heavy weapons carried by infantry. Considering that Pakistan Army Aviation doesnt have a dedicated ground attack aircraft whereas PAF may or may not show up, the use of gunships could be an option. However Gunships of PA are primary Anti tank assets so therefore the chances of them showing up in kashmir are slim.
The heavy weapons and the ammunition carried by infantry further slows it down. Crossing nullahs and other natural obstacles make use of 4X4 like jeep useless in some areas for troop transport/weapon carrying through cross country areas in mountains. This would further involve engineering equipment at some points like crossing river jehlum near LOC.
For a rapid offensive and advance in such terrain, the use of transport helicopters become a necessity.
PA doesnt have an air assault brigade with regular infantry troops for conducting air assault operations in a war. SSG is capable of both, air borne and air assault ops. PA has three independent infantry brigades and one of them could be converted to an air assault brigade.
Probably air lift company (150 troops) sized forces at different sectors of J&K for air assault ops, landing near strategic locations especially where enemy AD assets are not present and make the rest of journey on foot. This will atleast help in not exposing helicopters directly to enemy fire. Whereas the gunships will be directly exposed for their attack runs.
The air assault forces may hamper enemy rear HQ's or capture an important location but they will need to be linked up with the main offensive force before they could be surrounded by enemy and cut off. Therefore they should be part of a major assault force and should be used with proper schedule of the offensive. Sending them in too early or too late may achieve only losses.
Weather conditions, altitude, landing zones should be kept in mind while preparing such an offensive. for a company sized force, atleast 6-7 Mi-17 would be required which would need to air lift not only troops but weapons and ammunition like mortars, bazookas, SAM's etc.
PA has roughly 90+ Mi-17 in inventory. For conducting a battalion sized air assault operation, 30-35 Mi-17's will be required for air lifting the troops at same time. The drop zones could be separate. A large force like this assembled at one air base could also alert India of an imminent attack so the force can be air lifted from many locations with time synchronization, if applicable.
PAF cover could be necessary if IAF jets are reported to be scrambling for intercept in the area. though mountainous terrain has its radar evading advantages.But the altitude attained by helicopters will be the deciding factor if the mountain cover is used or not. In any case, the LZ's maybe few Km's inside LOC.
Once the first landings are made, the next landings may not be possible due to many reasons. Weather is big reason. IAF CAP's as well as IA moving shoulder-based SAM's into the area to intercept further flights of helicopters.
Even if the objective are met, and the main assault force on foot, links up with air assault forces few strategic locations are captured, the next objectives will become more difficult.
e.g. If URI is captured like this and Baramula is next. The use of PA helicopters inside IOK will be next to impossible with IAF CAP's as well as AD assets in alert, unless PAF provides air cover and conducts constant SEAD/DEAD missions. Even then PAF may not be able to target shoulder based SAM infantry on mountain peaks leading to Baramula.
The road leading to baramula will be filled with IA traffic so capturing the roads as well as the peaks and ridges overlooking the toad, will become the next task.
Further, IA will be conducting counter-attacks to recapture Uri so almost a Division sized force of PA will be required to hold Uri as well as conduct offensives towards Baramula. Supplying this huge force with ammunition, medical supplies, weapons and reinforcements will become necessary and a massive logistics line from inside Pakistan will be required and the available helicopters could be diverted to this cause instead of conducting further air assault operations.
@Ulla
If an offensive is conducted by infantry in mountains and difficult cross country terrain, it will take hours and days to reach, fight and finally capture an enemy location on foot. The reinforcements and supplies will also come on foot either through mules or carried on backs of soldiers. The more time it takes to capture a location, the more casualties are expected which means formation strength reduced which needs to be kept in context for further offensives by this formation unless reinforcements are sent in time to it.
In absence of firepower from tanks, the major fire power assets are artillery and air support from aircrafts apart from heavy weapons carried by infantry. Considering that Pakistan Army Aviation doesnt have a dedicated ground attack aircraft whereas PAF may or may not show up, the use of gunships could be an option. However Gunships of PA are primary Anti tank assets so therefore the chances of them showing up in kashmir are slim.
The heavy weapons and the ammunition carried by infantry further slows it down. Crossing nullahs and other natural obstacles make use of 4X4 like jeep useless in some areas for troop transport/weapon carrying through cross country areas in mountains. This would further involve engineering equipment at some points like crossing river jehlum near LOC.
For a rapid offensive and advance in such terrain, the use of transport helicopters become a necessity.
PA doesnt have an air assault brigade with regular infantry troops for conducting air assault operations in a war. SSG is capable of both, air borne and air assault ops. PA has three independent infantry brigades and one of them could be converted to an air assault brigade.
Probably air lift company (150 troops) sized forces at different sectors of J&K for air assault ops, landing near strategic locations especially where enemy AD assets are not present and make the rest of journey on foot. This will atleast help in not exposing helicopters directly to enemy fire. Whereas the gunships will be directly exposed for their attack runs.
The air assault forces may hamper enemy rear HQ's or capture an important location but they will need to be linked up with the main offensive force before they could be surrounded by enemy and cut off. Therefore they should be part of a major assault force and should be used with proper schedule of the offensive. Sending them in too early or too late may achieve only losses.
Weather conditions, altitude, landing zones should be kept in mind while preparing such an offensive. for a company sized force, atleast 6-7 Mi-17 would be required which would need to air lift not only troops but weapons and ammunition like mortars, bazookas, SAM's etc.
PA has roughly 90+ Mi-17 in inventory. For conducting a battalion sized air assault operation, 30-35 Mi-17's will be required for air lifting the troops at same time. The drop zones could be separate. A large force like this assembled at one air base could also alert India of an imminent attack so the force can be air lifted from many locations with time synchronization, if applicable.
PAF cover could be necessary if IAF jets are reported to be scrambling for intercept in the area. though mountainous terrain has its radar evading advantages.But the altitude attained by helicopters will be the deciding factor if the mountain cover is used or not. In any case, the LZ's maybe few Km's inside LOC.
Once the first landings are made, the next landings may not be possible due to many reasons. Weather is big reason. IAF CAP's as well as IA moving shoulder-based SAM's into the area to intercept further flights of helicopters.
Even if the objective are met, and the main assault force on foot, links up with air assault forces few strategic locations are captured, the next objectives will become more difficult.
e.g. If URI is captured like this and Baramula is next. The use of PA helicopters inside IOK will be next to impossible with IAF CAP's as well as AD assets in alert, unless PAF provides air cover and conducts constant SEAD/DEAD missions. Even then PAF may not be able to target shoulder based SAM infantry on mountain peaks leading to Baramula.
The road leading to baramula will be filled with IA traffic so capturing the roads as well as the peaks and ridges overlooking the toad, will become the next task.
Further, IA will be conducting counter-attacks to recapture Uri so almost a Division sized force of PA will be required to hold Uri as well as conduct offensives towards Baramula. Supplying this huge force with ammunition, medical supplies, weapons and reinforcements will become necessary and a massive logistics line from inside Pakistan will be required and the available helicopters could be diverted to this cause instead of conducting further air assault operations.
@Ulla
eddie01
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Bilawal....
is she married? if not then we can sign her for next bollywood masala movie lol
Bilawal....
G0dfather
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Jawad iqbal
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Khalistan leader amajeet singh say they were a part of india and they will never accept india
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