Pakistan became 25% poorer under PTI: PML-N

[Norwegian]

Imran Khan has clearly failed badly and lacks fundamental knowledge of economy.

Just look at our economy in 2018 and compare it with 2021, it looks like we have not attained any growth

4 percent growth in PTI is not real growth vs 5.6 percent artificial growth during PMLN?

 

[AZ1]

Doesn't matter anything unless no improvement in common people ..Inflation is on rise and real wages have been decreased ...people have suffer ..only elite class has gain ...those living in pakistan have to face this while expats continue to live outside
Anyhow we as a country will never progress since we betray our promise made at time of independence and unless it been rectified

 

[Norwegian]

Pakistanis are happy when shown fake growth number but the things that show actual growth such as exports or industry are pretty much at the same level where Musharaff left them.

Because Pakistanis only look for what they are shown and not what was done to achieve it. PMLN achieving 5.6 artificial growth vs PTIs 4 percent real growth is a big challenge for Pakistanis to understand.

The fact is If the ultimate measure of any growth is the well-being of its people, then hearing from my Pakistani relatives and friends has left me unsatisfied. There used to be upper, middle, and lower class people in Pakistan, but now inflation is breaking the backbone of the middle class, and those I know who could afford a car in Pakistan are finding excuses to switch back to motorcycles, and those who could afford motorcycles are finding it difficult to meet their household's basic monthly expenses.

So you want well being of Pakistanis on the back of overvalued PKR, that boost import consumption, ultimately leading to current very bad situation for all Pakistanis? Makes sense?

I don't want to start a debate about economic indicators, but even if you compare our "fake GDP" of $310 billion USD around 2018, we could have easily been around $370 billion USD by now

Why are you calculating GDP in dollars? Pakistani economy is calculated in PKR. If tomorrow our exchange rate goes up, it will show boost in GDP in dollars but real GDP in relative to PKR will remain the same.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1173923661985636352

 

[Norwegian]

but the fact is your "true" GDP is hardly managing around $280-290, and despite the rupee depreciation, we have not seen much growth in our exports, unemployment, or the lives of our people have not improved.

Yeah because Imran Khan has no Alladins lamp. Things take time to mess up and they take time to fix. You expected PMLNs 4 year mess up to be fixed in months of Imran Khan govt?

PTI regime forte is propaganda, and lots of it. They would have been Hitler's cheerleaders, Gorbals was a child Infront of them.
They lie over figures, they lie about people who don't agree with them.
Imran Khan is a compulsive liar, as is his army of spokesthings. They are a phsyops program, to destroy the country. Only bloodletting will purify the nation of this filth.
Pakistan is an immature state and people are like that too. They are being led to the slaughter like sheep.
I am posting between bans as the truth in Pakistan can't be aired. Anyone talking against the narrative created by the top brass nincompoops, the rabid dogs of PTI, the Mirzai lobby and their zio handlers is a traitor/liar/corrupt.
How can the economy be growing when unemployment is rising. Poverty is rising, inflation is the highest in history. The regime has borrowed more than any other in history. People are poorer, hungrier and totally despondent. The GDP is lower.
The public has humiliated the PTI regime in every bye election
All I can say is they plan, and Allah SWT plans and he is the best of planners.

Forgot to take your meds today?

Since 2018, our exports have been hovering around 24 billion USD

Again you are calculating in USD. In PKR, exports are going up.

 

[Norwegian]

Remittances have increased in Pakistan during the previous two decades, and this is nothing new. Although the devaluation in the value of the rupee aids in the incitement of overseas Pakistanis, remind me what credit to offer this current government for that?

This credit.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1385842128765468674

According to the FBR, Pakistan's tax collection in 2013 was 2254 billion rupees, and by 2018, it had risen to almost 3828 billion rupees. That's a 70 percent increase in just 5 years. Your attachment agreed that PML-N had done good job in it

PMLN increased tax collection on the back of imports. Again a fallacy on your part. There was no real improvement.

 

[syedtalhamaududi]

Yeah because Imran Khan has no Alladins lamp. Things take time to mess up and they take time to fix. You expected PMLNs 4 year mess up to be fixed in months of Imran Khan govt?

Forgot to take your meds today?

Again you are calculating in USD. In PKR, exports are going up.
View attachment 751417

Hi Mirzai, spreading bull as usual. Watch the video, simple people are suffering. Not everyone can have a sugar daddy like you and niazi

 

[Norwegian]

I have to leave right now, but can you prove it to me? From what I recall, Pakistan's debt was roughly 66 billion dollars in 2012. Due to repayments prior to the election, it had dropped to roughly 60 billion dollars, and a new loan was obtained in 2013 following the creation of a new government. By 2018, it was around $90 billion USD, and as far as I know, it was approximately $115 billion USD following years of PTI rule. These data may be slightly off because I don't have time to double-check them, but I am confident that they are quite near to reality. Your figures don't add up since they were produced by a PTI supporter and not from the IMF/World Bank or the Government of Pakistan's website.

Lowest debt growth under PTI vs PMLN:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1398916298160197632

Hi Mirzai, spreading bull as usual. Watch the video, simple people are suffering. Not everyone can have a sugar daddy like you and niazi

People were not suffering under your favorite Nawaz Sharif?

Pakistan was never on the edge of bankruptcy

Keep lying.

Pakistan's debt policy has brought us to the brink. Another five years of the same is unsustainable

PTI has been dealt a tough hand but we can't afford to see the party fail.

www.dawn.com

‘Bankrupt’ Pakistan Grid Adds to Khan’s Economic Quandary

Pakistan’s energy distribution system has already collapsed.

www.bloombergquint.com

Why Is Pakistan Going Bankrupt?

To put it simply, in Pakistan - debt is soaring, the Current Account Deficit is widening, reserves are dangerously low, and the currency has been devalued four times in just eight months.

www.thequint.com

 

[syedtalhamaududi]

Lowest debt growth under PTI vs PMLN:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1398916298160197632

People were not suffering under your favorite Nawaz Sharif?

Let them vote, PTI keep on loosing any bye election. Elections in Azad Kashmir are likely being postponed as PTI will have there backside kicked

 

[Norwegian]

though I strongly believe that nations do not go bankrupt in the first place.

Believe?

For the first time, Lebanon defaults on its debts

Restructuring will be a struggle. Fixing the country’s rentier economy will be even harder

www.economist.com

Let them vote, PTI keep on loosing any bye election. Elections in Azad Kashmir are likely being postponed as PTI will have there backside kicked

Great for your party then.

PTI, has claimed that they are accepting loans to pay off past obligations, but this is just a partial truth; the reality is much different.

 

[Norwegian]

highest in five year term of PMLN which was understandable as it was the election year.

So you admit your economic management was to win next elections. Patwari

Capacity payment will be more because we are producing more electricity. Simple.

Lol. Where are they buyers? There is no demand. Idiot.

they took a functional economy and dismantled it

Keep lying.

Pakistan's debt policy has brought us to the brink. Another five years of the same is unsustainable

PTI has been dealt a tough hand but we can't afford to see the party fail.

www.dawn.com

‘Bankrupt’ Pakistan Grid Adds to Khan’s Economic Quandary

Pakistan’s energy distribution system has already collapsed.

www.bloombergquint.com

Why Is Pakistan Going Bankrupt?

To put it simply, in Pakistan - debt is soaring, the Current Account Deficit is widening, reserves are dangerously low, and the currency has been devalued four times in just eight months.

www.thequint.com

 

[SecularNationalist]

Pakistan became 25% poorer under PTI: PML-N
Party says country's ability to service its debt has further weakened

View attachment 750438

The PML-N on Thursday maintained that the country had become 25% poorer because of the “flawed” economic policies of the ruling PTI and its ability to service the debt had further weakened.

At a pre-budget seminar addressed by all those who were at the helm of economic affairs from 2013 to 2018, the PML-N also opposed levying of new taxes, increase in electricity prices and recommended lowering the power tariffs for farmers.
“Pakistan’s ability to service its debt has further weakened as its debt has increased to an all-time high of nearly nine times more than the tax collection,” said Miftah Ismail, PML-N’s last finance minister.

View attachment 750439
He added that during the PML-N’s time, the debt-to-tax ratio was at the lowest level of 6.5 times.
“This government has increased our debt burden more in its first three years than any government in its full term in history.”
The former finance minister claimed that in less than three years, the PTI government had added 54% to the national debt in comparison with what was added to it in 71 years.

View attachment 750440
“The PTI is adding Rs4.747 trillion debt per year and building nothing. Had the PML-N’s policies continued, the size of the national economy would have been $368 billion and the per capita income $1,775 at the end of the fiscal year 2020-21.”
Miftah said when the PML-N left in 2018, the size of the Pakistani economy was $313 billion.

“Pakistan is poorer today by 25% due to the economic policies of the PTI,” he added.
The former finance minister further claimed that after three years, Imran Khan had reduced the size of economy by $296 billion or by 5.5% even as the country's population had increased by 7.5%.
View attachment 750441
“There is a direct reduction in the income and purchasing power of Pakistanis by 13%. This is the first time in our history that our GDP in dollars has reduced even after three years.”

Miftah said despite the high demand and inflation in the past three years, the PTI’s tax collection has remained stagnant and has decreased in terms of percentage of GDP.
“The PTI has tripled inflation, increased food inflation more than five times than what it was during PML-N’s tenure, and substantially reduced economic growth,” Miftah claimed.
View attachment 750442
“After three years, even if we believe PTI’s controversial numbers, they have reduced real rupee GDP on a per capita basis.”
The tax-to GDP, which was 13% of the GDP when the PML-N government left with revenues doubling during its tenure, has now fallen to 10.9%. The taxation structure has also become more regressive as indicated by a higher share of indirect taxes.
“The fiscal deficits in the years under Imran Khan have been the highest ever in Pakistan’s history -- 9.1% and 8.1% -- and this year we will again unfortunately incur a budget deficit of over 8% of GDP,” Miftah said.
View attachment 750443
PML-N President Shehbaz Sharif claimed that the PTI government was misleading the public since the start of its tenure.
View attachment 750447
“Even the State Bank has contested the PTI’s growth rate of 3.9%,” the former Punjab chief minister added.
“The government's statistics have already become a subject of debate. This 'figure fudging' has come on top of the government's dismal performance and major failures.”
View attachment 750445
Dr Ayesha Pasha, former finance minister of Punjab, said the PTI government had claimed improvement in the economy and the sales of automobiles and motorcycles but the fact of the matter was that these indicators were still lower than what the PML-N had left behind.

“Tractors sales are down by 30.3% down, cars by 35% and motorcycles by 10% in fiscal year 2021 compared with 2018,” she added.

Former planning minister Ahsan Iqbal claimed that the country’s perception was damaged because of statements of Prime Minister Imran Khan.

“Foreign investors have stopped making investments. Pakistan’s core problem is political instability,” he added.
“The opportunity to attract Chinese investment in special economic zones has been lost.”
Former commerce minister Khurram Dastgir blamed the "mismanagement" of the PTI government for the increasing unemployment and poverty in the country.

“The cost of one kilogramme of sugar, one kilogramme of cooking oil, one kilogramme of moong pulse and one kilogramme of wheat flour was Rs347 in May 2018 that has now increased to Rs680 -- an increase of 96%,” he said.
“In three years, 20 million more people have slipped below poverty.”

Today the number of unemployed is around 8.5 million and the rate of unemployment is around 15%, which is the highest in the country's history, according to the PML-N paper.

Real wages for unskilled workers have fallen by 18% over the last three years. Federal and provincial public development spending in relation to GDP has also almost halved to 2.5% of the GDP only, further contributing to job contraction.

The main reasons for this incredible increase in prices, especially of food items, are the constant and large increases in the price of power and gas, the printing of money, and the largest budget deficits in Pakistan’s history, according to the PML-N.

PML-N Assistant General Secretary Bilal Kayani said the PTI had promised to end any addition to the power sector circular debt. "But despite raising power tariffs on an average of by over 60%, the circular debt today is both the highest in history and also rising at the fastest pace in history," he added.

He further noted that the circular debt would exceed Rs2.8 trillion, which is an increase of about 1.7 trillion in three years or almost Rs50 billion per month.

Miftah warned that after 40% devaluation, there would be only 1% increase in exports against what they were in the tenure of the PML-N -- that too in its third year.

Dr Ayesha Pasha said the government had not been able to finalise a deal with the IMF.

“A budget presented without the IMF agreement would lose its sanctity, increasing the chances of a mini-budget,” she added.
Former Privatisation Commission chairman Muhammad Zubair pointed out that the change of four finance ministers, five finance secretaries, five FBR chairmen, four chairmen of the Board of Investment, four economic affairs ministers and four industries ministers suggest that the prime minister was unsatisfied with the performance of his economic team.

Pakistan became 25% poorer under PTI: PML-N | The Express Tribune

Party says country's ability to service its debt has further weakened

tribune.com.pk

And Pakistan became culturally and morally corrupt under the PML (N) governments. The long term damaged they caused looks irreversible. Look who is talking.

 

[Enigma SIG]

Looking at the corruption index and job losses, hyper inflation and increased poverty it's the whole Pakistani nation at least 25% poorer, apart from the ones living in 300 Kanal houses in Islamabad and paying next to zero tax.
You must be a lucky one

Jati Umra jhugggi hai? Practice before you preach.

 

[xyxmt]

A few questions, just as a layman, without any bias or anything:

1. How was the PMLN keeping the value of Rupee high?
2. What is the effect of higher imports than exports on our foreign exchange reserves?
3. What effect on the rupee does these imports and their payments have?
4. How does that effect on the Rupee affect inflation, cost of raw materials (even for exports etc.), and on payments that have to be made to IPPs?
5. What can the govt do to finance the said import bill (from where do we get the dollars to pay for imports)?
6. Under what conditions did IPPs invest in Pakistan (rate of return, interest etc.)?
7. How will we re-pay those loans, interests and rate of returns?
8. How PMLN would have dealt with Covid?
9. Is there any way to control the spread of Covid other than lockdowns?
10. What effect does the said lockdown have on the economy?
11. PMLN achieved good growth in its tenure, which sector led the growth? was there any increase in exports or export based industries?

Sincere questions, hope you will take out the time to provide well researched answers, without trolling. Thanks in advance.

1. by injecting $23 billion in open market in 2016 and 2017
2. they don't and they did not care as long as import number are counted in the GDP.
3. The effect of rupee by 23 billion higher imports than export was eliminated by foreign loans.
4. more Dollar loans to inject more dollars in open market to keep rupee artificially low keeping essential commodity prices down.
5. foreign loans

11. good growth always have something to show on the ground, the only thing PMLN govt have to show is metro train project and 600km (approx) motorway construction

 

[syedtalhamaududi]

Jati Umra jhugggi hai? Practice before you preach.

He doesn't preach, preaching is done by Shaitan's chella, ik

 

[Hyde]

View attachment 751419View attachment 751420

I already said the same thing

PPP blamed Musharraf's government for overselling commodities in 2008, leaving them with no foreign reserves and forcing them to seek assistance from the IMF.

PPP was criticised by the PML-N for taking an IMF loan and requiring another IMF programme to repay the loans taken out by PPP.

PTI slammed PML-N for taking loans that they had to repay, leaving them with no alternative but to deal with the IMF once more. Regardless of the reasons, we have been returning to the IMF, and the next government will almost certainly do so again.

4 percent growth in PTI is not real growth vs 5.6 percent artificial growth during PMLN?

It is a remarkable achievement, given that we had expected a growth rate of only 1.5 percent. However, in terms of dollars, Pakistan's current GDP is lower than that of 2018, which is sad, and Pakistan is likely the only emerging market in South Asia where there has been little growth in the last three years.

Yeah because Imran Khan has no Alladins lamp. Things take time to mess up and they take time to fix. You expected PMLNs 4 year mess up to be fixed in months of Imran Khan govt?


Again you are calculating in USD. In PKR, exports are going up.
View attachment 751417

I don't expect anything to be fixed overnight. It's been over three years since the PTI came to power, and fixing a four-year mess in three years should have been a simple task for Imran Khan, who believes he is an expert in everything.

I bring up the dollar figures because even the Prime Minister's tweets, which you posted, reference growth and investment in dollars. The reality is that the Pakistani rupee has no value in the international market, and when doing business with the rest of the world, you buy and sell in USD. We could make trillions in Pakistani rupees, but if the rupee loses value, it will be worthless; Pakistan may have a 1000 trillion rupee economy, but it will still be weak; but, if it has a ten trillion dollar economy, it will be very powerful.

PMLN increased tax collection on the back of imports. Again a fallacy on your part. There was no real improvement.

Actually, under the PML-N's term the total number of tax payers increased whereas during the PTI's rule, the overall number of tax payers surprisingly went down. I presume you are referring to indirect taxation, which is significantly levied on Pakistani citizens, and while this is true, we must focus on growing our tax net and eliminating exemptions wherever possible.

Last, I'd like to emphasise that we should not assume that because Party A is a decent party, Party B must be the devil. Except for a handful, we are all Pakistanis, including PML-N workers and leaders... We all want to see a successful Pakistan, but I'm more interested in comparing who was worse than who; most people have political affiliations, so they're comparing performances to see who is better than who.

For me, I am open to switching to any party if I discover one, as I am still looking for the proper leadership, and I will most likely vote for smaller, lesser-known parties in the next election. I'm not sure I've ever been satisfied with the performance of the PPP, PML-N, or PTI, but if PTI can pull off a miracle by 2023 and better the lives of ordinary Pakistanis, I'll gladly vote for them.