Pakistan approves Hindu Marriage Bill after decades of inaction

[Apprentice]

The only news these days regarding Bangladesh and Pakistan is about how someone is kicking out or harrassing the others diplomats....or snapping of some ties. You really think the few Bengali supporters of Pakistan cricket team mean something (they really are not that many at all especially now that Bangladesh team has improved).

70% of Bangladeshis have favourable views of India....we dont need them to support us on absolutely everything or be part of India.....just enough cooperation and friendship to get things done for the greater good.

Most Indian muslims are loyal to India, Afterall their ancestors chose to stay in India when given the option of Pakistan.

I don't know where you get that idea that they aren't from. Why don't you do a poll open to even just Indian members here asking that question instead of distorting the opinions of a few?

The majority of Indian Muslims did not stay back because they chose India over Pakistan. In case you are forgetting the Muslim League's main support base was UP and Bombay. Look at the old photographs of Muslim League rallies in Delhi, Bombay and Calcutta and the sizes of these Muslim crowds. Even in Karachi and Lahore Muslim League didn't have that many crowds.

The reason Indian Muslims stayed back was because they did not want to abandon their properties and it was decided in 1947 by the leaders that there would be no population exchange.


In Punjab there was only a population exchange because of the communal violence therefore Punjab was made an exception.


My nanaboo's mamoo was a Kashmiri trader who settled in Calcutta. My nanaboo's family were wealthy Kashmiri businessmen who settled in Amritsar.

In 1947 all our relatives in East Punjab relocated to Pakistan due to the communal violence.

Our relatives in Calcutta stayed on in India. But they would visit Pakistan whenever they could. And had it been a Indo-Pak war they would tell us how Indian Muslims supported Pakistan and how they had to live in fear of Hindus.

During the 1950s and 1960s if anyone from the Indian Muslim middle class felt that he was not getting the economic benefits he wanted in India then he would migrate to Pakistan. Tens of thousands of Indian Muslims continued migrating to Pakistan each year throughout the 50s and 60s until our government placed extreme restrictions on further migration.

And your own Hindu co-religionists on this forum agree with me, here I will give you his quote.

I agree with you. The average Pakistani Punjabi or Sindhi Muslim are not as fanatic as most of Indian Sunnis. Having grown up in Kashmir among Muslim friends I can assure you about it.

There are many secular patriots as well. They are many but in comparison quite insignificant. Non Muslims are terrified of the Muslim majority areas of the cities. You need to go in there, mix with them, go to their mosques to understand what they really think. The support for Isis is huge s well. Shias and ahmedias are hated more than Hindus.

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

Special marriage acts are acts in which people belonging to different religions can marry without the need to convert. They wont be registered under Hindu, Muslim Marriage acts. In short even after marriage, husband will be an hindu, wife will be an Muslim. (In this scenario. )

You cannot compare India with Pakistan. Your country is multi-religious where you have vast majority of people belong to Christianity and Islam while overwhelming majority of Pakistani are Muslims so we did not felt the need for special marriage act when 95 to 97 percent population is Muslim..

secondly you are Hindus and Muslims only when you will live according to scripture of your religion but if you marry through special marriage act without Hindu or Islamic ritual then how such marriages will be valid according to religion Islam or Hinduism? If Muslim will do marriage with Hindu through special marriage act then he will do this by going against the teaching of his religion Islam which dont recognise the existence of such marriage which show that this route is for those who dont care any religion

It would be better if you give Muslim right to eat cow meat in secular India before giving them this special marriage act

Most Indian muslims are loyal to India, Afterall their ancestors chose to stay in India when given the option of Pakistan.

Many Muslims stayed in India because they had no others option or resources to move to Pakistan as it was not easy to migrate back then..see how many Indian Muslims voted for Muslim league in 1946 on a policy of creating an independent state of Pakistan

 

[Apprentice]

Many Muslims stayed in India because they had no others option or resources to move to Pakistan as it was not easy to migrate back then..see how many Indian Muslims voted for Muslim league in 1946 on a policy of creating an independent state of Pakistan

Also the leaders agreed that there would be no population exchange. Punjab became the exception due to violence

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

Also the leaders agreed that there would be no population exchange. Punjab became the exception due to violence

He is talking about Bengal where Muslim league won 113 seat compare to 86 of congress

 

[chhota bheem]

"It was unbecoming of us Muslims in general and the political leaders in particular. We were required to facilitate the legislation, not obstruct it. If we 99 per cent of the population are afraid of one per cent, we need to look deep inside what we claim to be and what we are," he said.

i was looking for a reasonable answer as to why a muslim cannt marry without converting.still waiting

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

You cannot compare India with Pakistan. Your country is multi-religious where you have vast majority of people belong to Christianity and Islam while overwhelming majority of Pakistani are Muslims so we did not felt the need for special marriage act when 95 to 97 percent population is Muslim..

secondly you are Hindus and Muslims only when you will live according to scripture of your religion but if you marry through special marriage act without Hindu or Islamic ritual then how such marriages will be valid according to religion Islam or Hinduism? If Muslim will do marriage with Hindu through special marriage act then he will do this by going against the teaching of his religion Islam which dont recognise the existence of such marriage which show that this route is for those who dont care any religion

It would be better if you give Muslim right to eat cow meat in secular India before giving them this special marriage act


Many Muslims stayed in India because they had no others option or resources to move to Pakistan as it was not easy to migrate back then..see how many Indian Muslims voted for Muslim league in 1946 on a policy of creating an independent state of Pakistan

U want majority to respect the sentiments of Muslims but at the same time wants the minority to offend the majority? Kya logic hei. ? THis is our country, our rules. I asked for a clarification in Pakistani law, and it was clearly or unambigiously explained to me people from other religion cannot marry as per their wishes. End of story.

Everything doesnt revolve around religion. I have said many times in this forum. If a situation arises btw my religion or my country, I will chose my country. How many Pakistani Muslims can even say that?

Moreover its not as if all Muslims (including u) live according to the code of the book. So we care jack if "Islam" or "Hindu" doesnt recognise this marriage, and this is reason for SMA.

I myself was obvious to this law, until recently one friend (gal Hindu) got married to a Muslim. She refused to convert and so was her family. The boy's family was obviously against this. The boy and the girl got married under SMA, without considering both the religions. Now what religion their kids will be, its their decision to make.

Moreover IUML, spoke only for the rights of Pakistani, Bengali and UP muslims. It never considered the sentiments of Muslims south of UP and Gujarat, who were so against the very idea that they consistently lost in Muslim majority areas. The idea was for 5-6 states alone, and it was.

 

[Apprentice]

Everything doesnt revolve around religion. I have said many times in this forum. If a situation arises btw my religion or my country, I will chose my country. How many Pakistani Muslims can even say that?

Religion comes first for Muslims. Pakistan was created so we could be Muslims first. If we hadn't put our Muslim identity first then we would never have made Pakistan because we were 'Indians' nationally.

Moreover its not as if all Muslims (including u) live according to the code of the book. So we care jack if "Islam" or "Hindu" doesnt recognise this marriage, and this is reason for SMA.

Yes most of us fail to live according to our laws. But this infraction of marrying outside the religion is extremely serious and even most non-practising Muslim families don't recognise inter-religious marriage.

Moreover IUML, spoke only for the rights of Pakistani, Bengali and UP muslims. It never considered the sentiments of Muslims south of UP and Gujarat, who were so against the very idea that they consistently lost in Muslim majority areas. The idea was for 5-6 states alone, and it was.

Wrong. The Muslim League was extremely popular in Bombay (which included Gujarat) and in Madras too. Hyderabad at that tioe was a separate Muslim ruled princely state which had high links to both the Muslim League and Pakistan.The areas the Muslim League had the least popularity in was Punjab and the NWFP, both of which ultimately ended up becoming Pakistan.

 

[LeGenD]

Yes, only the non-Muslim has to convert, not the Muslim, in order for the marriage to be legal. I thought non-Muslims and Muslims were suppose to be equal citizens in Pakistan?

I guess it's called Islamic Republic of Pakistan for a reason. Muslims are supreme and non-Muslims must live in dhimmitude.

What exactly is your problem?

Muslims are not supposed to marry non-Muslims, period.

Non-Muslims are treated well in Pakistan. Do not worry about them.

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

Religion comes first for Muslims. Pakistan was created so we could be Muslims first. If we hadn't put our Muslim identity first then we would never have made Pakistan because we were 'Indians' nationally.



Yes most of us fail to live according to our laws. But this infraction of marrying outside the religion is extremely serious and even most non-practising Muslim families don't recognise inter-religious marriage.



Wrong. The Muslim League was extremely popular in Bombay (which included Gujarat) and in Madras too. Hyderabad at that tioe was a separate Muslim ruled princely state which had high links to both the Muslim League and Pakistan.The areas the Muslim League had the least popularity in was Punjab and the NWFP, both of which ultimately ended up becoming Pakistan.

If religion comes first for Pakistanis, I am sorry, then you (or the other guy) has no right to question the marriage laws of India. Note that I did not "question" laws of Pakistan, but an clarification which blowed up into a big debate which I did not intend to.

Secondly if a Muslim marries according to an SMA, according to Indian laws, after age of 18, no-body can do jack. Not even their families. The law is especially good for inter religious marriages in India. So whether Muslim law accepts or not, it really doesnt matter to Indian laws. We are not Saudi or Pakistan. We are atleast secular in name.

It wasnt popular in Madras nor in Bombay and failed to win a single seat it stood elections alone. Being metropolitan cities they were more "visible". That's it. I do not remember any South Indian Muslim leader migrating to Pakistan.

 

[Apprentice]

It wasnt popular in Madras nor in Bombay and failed to win a single seat it stood elections alone. Being metropolitan cities they were more "visible". That's it. I do not remember any South Indian Muslim leader migrating to Pakistan.

This just shows your lack of knowledge.

We even have a road in Karachi named after a Muslim League leader from Bangalore.

 

[Scavenger]

He has already answered it. Pakistan has scrapped any form of civil marriage right from its founding.

The typical Pakistani will complain about his perception of India "reality" when his country does not even offer anything of the same on a purely legal (theoretical) basis for its citizens.

Every small step for Pakistan in a legal direction away from this paranoia towards Hinduism (and minorities in general) is a big achievement for them....it is yesteryears news for India.

In fact India should scrap provision of Muslim law (or laws based by religion) all together and have a common law applicable for every citizen.

Indeed, it is literally astounding that Pakistan does not give these basic human rights to its people by law at the very least if not in practice.
The basic right that humans can exercise in all civilized nations - That two people(be of any caste/creed/religion) can choose to get married.

If this is what it means to live under Islam, then thank the God for keeping us away from it.

 

[Umair Nawaz]

How different marriage act for Hindus like Christians and Sikhs already have will change your life style? And you have to bring something to prove that non-Muslims are burden to economy.



Same thing which Sikhs were/are doing in India.

that thing which that hindu MNA had said will ie Muslim-Hindu marriages. And my post was in reaction of that. Pakistan will never be allowed to become a country like india.

 

[45'22']

What if a Muslim converts? Also NADRA doesn't allow Muslims to change their religion on ID. What will happen then?

There will be honour killings

If a Hindu or Christian wishes to marry a Muslim, simply convert.
How is this oppressing?
Oppression is not letting them marry. But they can marry, simply convert.

What if a muslim wants to marry a hindu/christian/buddhist....
Is he/she allowed to convert?
If not then its oppression because you are having different rules based on religion

How different marriage act for Hindus like Christians and Sikhs already have will change your life style? And you have to bring something to prove that non-Muslims are burden to economy.



Same thing which Sikhs were/are doing in India.

What are the sikhs doing?what is their demand regarding marriage?
can you elaborate

for us this is unnatural too

Maybe for you.....but there are people who want to do inter religion marriages without changing religion
Dont you think the current law is unfair for them?

Civil Union has no legal recognition in Pakistan

whats the minimum age requirement for marriages in Pak?
Is polygamy and polyandry still legal in Pak according to the Islamic law?

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

U want majority to respect the sentiments of Muslims but at the same time wants the minority to offend the majority? Kya logic hei. ? THis is our country, our rules. I asked for a clarification in Pakistani law, and it was clearly or unambigiously explained to me people from other religion cannot marry as per their wishes. End of story.

Everything doesnt revolve around religion. I have said many times in this forum. If a situation arises btw my religion or my country, I will chose my country. How many Pakistani Muslims can even say that?

Moreover its not as if all Muslims (including u) live according to the code of the book. So we care jack if "Islam" or "Hindu" doesnt recognise this marriage, and this is reason for SMA.

I myself was obvious to this law, until recently one friend (gal Hindu) got married to a Muslim. She refused to convert and so was her family. The boy's family was obviously against this. The boy and the girl got married under SMA, without considering both the religions. Now what religion their kids will be, its their decision to make.

Moreover IUML, spoke only for the rights of Pakistani, Bengali and UP muslims. It never considered the sentiments of Muslims south of UP and Gujarat, who were so against the very idea that they consistently lost in Muslim majority areas. The idea was for 5-6 states alone, and it was.

I dont think you got the point. You said people dont want to convert and want to stay as Hindu or Muslim thatswhy they chose special marrige act rather than muslim or hindu marrige act. I said they cannot stay as Muslim at the cost of going againt their own religion which dont recignise such marriges as valid lol

Its not me or x, y z who are giving their personal verdict on such marriages or making such marrige as invalid but its their own God or religious scripture which say if you believe in oneness of God then you cannot marry with Mushrik i.e some one who believe in many Gods or associate partners with God. If religion would be dear to such people then they would never make their God angry for a girl lol it seem they prefer love for girl over love for God..their choice but silly to say that they wanted to stay on their religion by going against their scripture..i am talking from muslim perspective as have no clue whether a hindu girl can marry muslim boy through hindu marrige act or how Hinduism view such marriage..

You call youself Indian first like many others because for most of you indian nationalism is same as Hindu nationalism

 

[Sugarcane]

What are the sikhs doing?what is their demand regarding marriage?
can you elaborate

Demand for separate Sikh Marriage Act raised - Daily Post India