Pakistan announces 5th-gen fighter and medium-altitude long-endurance UAV programs

[Thorough Pro]

Please post in english, not the indian version ...

Thing is that does Pakistan has money for such expensive 5th gen project. It starts with atleast $10 billion over a period of time. Pakistan's defence budget is too low. It will be war of attrition forced by India.


Pakistan has bought f16 yet it still produces JF17. Irony much.

India buys and produces its own too.

@mods can anyone shove this NG product of a gang rape back in his shithole?

listen madarsa educated arse
India is license producing f.16 lol
and you believe that India does not have tools for that? BS!

Secondly, there is enough research done on the technologies which are implemented and then system integrated. It was the government's decision not have it done due to budget allocation and priorities.

Your single university does not have modules on oxides in electronics and the research in your universities are still way behind than in Indian universities you think you can produce the technology and India cannot. Keep dreaming.

 

[messiach]

Sino-rus collaboration is extensive with Izotov group @ BCIAMD. With reg. to low pressure axis-flow compressors, nine-stage high pressure compressor, annular straight flow combustion chamber with 24 burners, single-stage cooled high load turbines of low and high pressure, we would need their assistance. Chinese collaboration is not enough.

and what would the russains do that the chinese cant ?
what about the j31 in the short term(2021-2025) and the tfx in the long term (2029-2035).
best of both, pakistan cant go for high tech russain kit other wise the indians will have a hissy fit.

 

[Blue Marlin]

Sino-rus collaboration is extensive with Izotov group @ BCIAMD. With reg. to low pressure axis-flow compressors, nine-stage high pressure compressor, annular straight flow combustion chamber with 24 burners, single-stage cooled high load turbines of low and high pressure, we would need their assistance. Chinese collaboration is not enough.

im talking in the aspects of the jet itself, not the engines, didn't you say the ws-13 has a thrust of 105kn?

and what is the izotov group theres no site. and based on what you've told me they need help with near enough everything except the main fan

so do you need russia only for the engines.

if thats the case then why not go for the tfx which has a kale/rr engine based on the ej-200 and the j-31 would be the back up with their ws-13 engines.

@messiach what would be the likely hood of pakistan going for the j-31 in the near term and the tfx in the long term?

 

[Blue Marlin]

Blue Marlin, SP izotov was designer general @ Klimov. Very well known. BCIAMD is baranov central institute of aviation motor D&D. Russian technical input will be required. 105KN is wrt to FC-1 not FGF.

ah ok thanks i think you should have said that from the get go.

so what thrust requirements wet and dry for the ngf? (next gen fighter as per your own acm)

what of the j31 and/or the tfx? what would they go for either/or both?

 

[messiach]

Blue Marlin, SP izotov was designer general @ Klimov. Very well known. BCIAMD is baranov central institute of aviation motor D&D. Russian technical input will be required. 105KN is wrt to FC-1 not FGF.

 

[khanasifm]

 

[khanasifm]

Reposted just out r fun hate the 'gif

 

[Zhukov]

Stop arguing with Indians and spoil the thread all of you.
No one can one Indians in troll fests.
Mods kindly close the thread or stop these butthurt trolls

 

[niaz]

Classification of the Generations of the fighter aircraft is a very loose & arbitrary term. Let us first define what is generally considered a 5th generation aircraft. In my view 5th generation fighter should have:

Composite materials & internal weapon bay to give it “Stealth”

Fully digitalised avionics & control systems and Radar.

Powerful engine with Thrust vectoring & super cruise.

Powerful air to air and air to ground systems.

Variable by pass turbo fan and / or directing engine exhaust over the fuselage to reduce infra-red signature of the engine exhaust.

Having access to the data on the shape of F-22 & F-35 from the pictures and the published data, it is quite possible that Sweden, Turkey, India and China may be able to design the body & wings of a 5th generation fighter. However, realistically speaking; design of a powerful high or variable by pass engine is beyond the capabilities of these countries except China. Only countries possessing sufficiently advanced aero-engine building capabilities are USA, UK, France and Russia. China is also fast catching up.

According to a write up on Turkish multi-billion dollar 5th Generation fighter in the July 2017 ‘Air forces Monthly’ it is mentioned that according to Turkish Aerospace Industries CEO Temel Kotil, they would need at least 5000 engineers (currently TAI has only2000). TAI has a long term agreement with Northrop Grumman to produce composite parts & sub-assemblies for F-35.

TAI have signed cooperation agreements with SAAB & BAE System for assistance for the air frame design & avionics. Engine would be either GE F414 or the Eurojet EJ200. Turkish Defence Industries Research & Development institute is working on new wvr & bvr missiles.

We would not know how good the new fighter really is until the first prototype flies in 2023. F-22 program cost $66-billion, let us say that Turkish TFX program would cost half as much and Pakistan’s programme even half of that. Pakistan is not likely to get cooperation from BAE Systems, Northrop or Eurojet. Can Pakistan afford to gamble $15-billion on a program to build $150-million per unit fighter if it is not as good as F-22 or even J-31?

India has joined Russia PAKFA programme. China already as a near 5th generation fighter in J-20 and a full-fledged 5th generation J-31, why don’t we join these programmes instead of trying to design a new one? Call me a spoil sport but must we re-invent the wheel?

 

[cabatli_53]

If It is selected , Kale/RR engine will be more powerful than EJ-200 because Twin EJ-200 doesn't meet the power/weight requirement of Turkish authority for TF-X platform.

Engine to be developed will be produced in Turkey and to be exported abroad without any limitation.

I strongly believe Pakistan will be a part of Turkey's TF-X project. Pakistani new generation stealth fighter project is a clear indication of searching a partner country to join and I think The chance of TF-X which is in design phase at present, is really high...

 

[Muhammad Omar]

Classification of the Generations of the fighter aircraft is a very loose & arbitrary term. Let us first define what is generally considered a 5th generation aircraft. In my view 5th generation fighter should have:

Composite materials & internal weapon bay to give it “Stealth”

Fully digitalised avionics & control systems and Radar.

Powerful engine with Thrust vectoring & super cruise.

Powerful air to air and air to ground systems.

Variable by pass turbo fan and / or directing engine exhaust over the fuselage to reduce infra-red signature of the engine exhaust.

Having access to the data on the shape of F-22 & F-35 from the pictures and the published data, it is quite possible that Sweden, Turkey, India and China may be able to design the body & wings of a 5th generation fighter. However, realistically speaking; design of a powerful high or variable by pass engine is beyond the capabilities of these countries except China. Only countries possessing sufficiently advanced aero-engine building capabilities are USA, UK, France and Russia. China is also fast catching up.

According to a write up on Turkish multi-billion dollar 5th Generation fighter in the July 2017 ‘Air forces Monthly’ it is mentioned that according to Turkish Aerospace Industries CEO Temel Kotil, they would need at least 5000 engineers (currently TAI has only2000). TAI has a long term agreement with Northrop Grumman to produce composite parts & sub-assemblies for F-35.

TAI have signed cooperation agreements with SAAB & BAE System for assistance for the air frame design & avionics. Engine would be either GE F414 or the Eurojet EJ200. Turkish Defence Industries Research & Development institute is working on new wvr & bvr missiles.

We would not know how good the new fighter really is until the first prototype flies in 2023. F-22 program cost $66-billion, let us say that Turkish TFX program would cost half as much and Pakistan’s programme even half of that. Pakistan is not likely to get cooperation from BAE Systems, Northrop or Eurojet. Can Pakistan afford to gamble $15-billion on a program to build $150-million per unit fighter if it is not as good as F-22 or even J-31?

India has joined Russia PAKFA programme. China already as a near 5th generation fighter in J-20 and a full-fledged 5th generation J-31, why don’t we join these programmes instead of trying to design a new one? Call me a spoil sport but must we re-invent the wheel?

Exactly Pakistan Should join China and Turkey we should go for J-31 Short Term Project and TAI TFX long term project

 

[indianfighter1999]

Exactly Pakistan Should join China and Turkey we should go for J-31 Short Term Project and TAI TFX long term project

makes no sense, both planes are in same category.

 

[Muhammad Omar]

makes no sense, both planes are in same category.

LOL Do you even bother to read the first page??? yes we know both planes are in same category Pakistan is Looking for 2 5th Generation Planes

 

[Beethoven]

If It is selected , Kale/RR engine will be more powerful than EJ-200 because Twin EJ-200 doesn't meet the power/weight requirement of Turkish authority for TF-X platform.

Engine to be developed will be produced in Turkey and to be exported abroad without any limitation.

I strongly believe Pakistan will be a part of Turkey's TF-X project. Pakistani new generation stealth fighter project is a clear indication of searching a partner country to join and I think The chance of TF-X which is in design phase at present, is really high...

cabatli bhai aapke mou main ghee shakkar....its an expression commonly used by us in moments of happiness cant exactly translate it into english...a little help here guys

 

[The Diplomat]

Are we making a stealth drone or a stealth plane alongside a drone?
I'm kind of confused after reading this article.