Pakistan air force superiority over Indian air force in all wars?

[TalkToMe:D]

Normally I refrain from commenting in these kind of threads because their is no point. The discussion is endless and members do keep on commenting the whole day and at the end of day they still hang on to their original positions.

For Indians they won all the battles and for us we won all the battles.

However most of you people perhaps actually do not know what really happened. I belong to a family who was serving in all three branches of the military and took active part in all the wars so far.

To put it in simple terms the truth is somewhat different than what Indians and Pakistanis are generally told. Stop creating threads which normally do not add to the value of forum and move on with your lives.

Just keep in mind that not all Pakistanis want to destroy India and not Indians want to destroy Pakistan. At the end of the day they are just human beings trying to improve their own life.

By the way where were you all geniuses when the action was taking place?

Great post

 

[S.Y.A]

indian army never halted pakistani advance in akhnoor, it stopped because of change of command, our dear maj gen yahya khan was able to persuade ayub khan to remove the then commander, a qadiyani by the way, and make him commander, he halted the advance at once

 

[killerx]

this thrread should be closed to much troll

 

[EzioAltaïr]

I know this thread has been quite for a long time, but after reading so many ignorant posts from both Pakistanis and my fellow Indians, I just had to post.

1965: Pakistan had F-86 Sabres as their main aircraft, along with F-104 Starfighters. We had mainly Folland Gnats, with too many defects. Though we held our own, the Pakistanis gained partial air superiority, they downed 30 of our planes, and we lost 30 more in accidents. We downed 17 Pakistani planes, and they lost 2 in accidents. But the sheer numerical superiority meant that even if we had lost 100 planes, we still wouldn't be grounded. Overall, Pakistani Air Force did better, but failed to ground us, and we destroy our capabilities. And our Canberras still bomber targets deep inside Pakistan.

1971: A totally different story. Gnats were now HAL Ajeets, we had more Hawker Hunters, HF 24 Maruts, and MiG 21s. Pakistan launched pre-emptive strikes on our airbases, and we lost 10-20 aircraft there. Once formal war started, our Air Force grounded yours within 3-5 days, 20 IAF planes downed, 75 PAF planes (Pakistanis claim similar figures such as the 65 War 120-20, etc, but no. Our Air Force grounded the PAF), proof: it played no part in the Battle of Longewala (ok granted, it was out of your fuel range, but...), and the Tangail Airdrop. No fuel range excuse here, we cut right through to the bridges and got our Paratroops there, facing no resistance in the air, and this was right over Bangladesh.

 

[RiazHaq]

Even in 1971, Pakistanis inflicted heavy damage on Indian military.

"This airforce(the PAF), is second to none"
"The air war lasted two weeks and the Pakistanis scored a
three-to-one kill ratio, knocking out 102 Russian-made Indian jets and losing thirty-four airplanes of their own. I'm certain about the figures because I went out several times a day in a chopper and counted the wrecks below." "They were really good, aggressive dogfighters and proficient in gunnery and air combat tactics. I was damned impressed. Those guys just lived and breathed flying. "

(General (Retd.) Chuck Yeager (USAF) , Book: Yeager, the
Autobiography).

In 1965, Pakistanis really whipped India's rear end.

"Pakistan claims to have destroyed something like 1/3rd the Indian Air Force, and foreign observers, who are in a position to know say that Pakistani pilots have claimed even higher kills than this; but the Pakistani Air Force are being scrupulously honest in evaluating these claims. They are crediting Pakistan Air Force only those killings that can be checked from other sources."

Roy Meloni,
American Broadcasting Corporation
September 15, 1965.

1965 War, the Inside Story by R.D. Pradhan:

In Chapter 8 titled "Of Cowardice and Panic", the author describes the cowardice of Maj. Gen. Niranjan Prasad, the Indian general commanding officer in Lahore sector. When the general was fired upon by Pakistani forces, he "ran away". "On learning that, Lt. Gen. Harbakash Singh and the corps commander drove in a Jonga to the battlefront. Army commander found that the enemy (PAF) air attack had created a havoc on G.T. Road. (Indian) Vehicles were burning and several vehicles of 15 Division abandoned on the road, the drivers having run away, leaving some of the engines still running. Maj. Gen. Niranjan Prasad was hiding in a recently irrigated sugar cane field. As described by Harabakash Singh: "He (Prasad) came out to receive us, with his boots covered with wet mud. He had no head cover, nor was he wearing any badges of his rank. He had stubble on his face, not having shaved." Seeing him in such a stage, Harbakhash Singh asked him: "Whether he was the General Officer commanding a division or a coolie? Why had he removed badges of rank and not shaved? Niranjan Prasad had no answer."


Haq's Musings: Demolishing Indian War Myths about Pakistan

 

[Machoman]

Why we always talk about 1965, 71 etc. Talk present and future my friend....

 

[ejaz007]

I know this thread has been quite for a long time, but after reading so many ignorant posts from both Pakistanis and my fellow Indians, I just had to post.

1965: Pakistan had F-86 Sabres as their main aircraft, along with F-104 Starfighters. We had mainly Folland Gnats, with too many defects. Though we held our own, the Pakistanis gained partial air superiority, they downed 30 of our planes, and we lost 30 more in accidents. We downed 17 Pakistani planes, and they lost 2 in accidents. But the sheer numerical superiority meant that even if we had lost 100 planes, we still wouldn't be grounded. Overall, Pakistani Air Force did better, but failed to ground us, and we destroy our capabilities. And our Canberras still bomber targets deep inside Pakistan.

1971: A totally different story. Gnats were now HAL Ajeets, we had more Hawker Hunters, HF 24 Maruts, and MiG 21s. Pakistan launched pre-emptive strikes on our airbases, and we lost 10-20 aircraft there. Once formal war started, our Air Force grounded yours within 3-5 days, 20 IAF planes downed, 75 PAF planes (Pakistanis claim similar figures such as the 65 War 120-20, etc, but no. Our Air Force grounded the PAF), proof: it played no part in the Battle of Longewala (ok granted, it was out of your fuel range, but...), and the Tangail Airdrop. No fuel range excuse here, we cut right through to the bridges and got our Paratroops there, facing no resistance in the air, and this was right over Bangladesh.

Your statement is not entirely correct.

For example in 1965 Indian Airforce had Mig-21 and Hawker Hunters in addition to other fighters. In 1965 PAF performed verywell and really gave IAF a headache.

In 1971 IAF only managed to ground PAF in East Pakistan. In West Pakistan PAF remained active. From military point of view 16 fighters based in East Pakistan against around 200 or so fighters of IAF plus the naval air arm this was bound to happen. If for some reasons IAF had failed to ground if these fighters than you did not deserve to have an airforce.

Rest every one can create his or her own history.

 

[EzioAltaïr]

Your statement is not entirely correct.

For example in 1965 Indian Airforce had Mig-21 and Hawker Hunters in addition to other fighters. In 1965 PAF performed verywell and really gave IAF a headache.

In 1971 IAF only managed to ground PAF in East Pakistan. In West Pakistan PAF remained active. From military point of view 16 fighters based in East Pakistan against around 200 or so fighters of IAF plus the naval air arm this was bound to happen. If for some reasons IAF had failed to ground if these fighters than you did not deserve to have an airforce.

Rest every one can create his or her own history.

I know very well that we had those aircraft in 1965 as well. Bur our mainstay was still the Gnat. And though they gave us a headache, they failed to achieve significant results.

1971: Nope, I'm sure both sides were grounded. Evident from the fact that several recon and bombing flights were led right into the heart of Pakistan, and there was no resistance.