p2prada
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60% of the Gripen is American parts as well...
Time to reconsider Rafale ?
LOL yeah.
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60% of the Gripen is American parts as well...
Time to reconsider Rafale ?
Opinion: Gripen hard to beat in Indian MMRCA contest
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While there is no shortage of fighter aircraft procurement programmes currently under way, the most eagerly anticipated contest is undoubtedly India's medium multirole combat aircraft (MMRCA) requirement for at least 126 aircraft.
The six contenders have now submitted their proposals: Boeing's F/A-18E/F Super Hornet, Dassault's Rafale, Eurofighter's Typhoon, Lockheed Martin's F-16, Russian Aircraft Corporation's (RAC's) MiG with the MiG-35 and the Saab JAS 39 Gripen. Arguably each aircraft stands a fighting chance of securing the lucrative USD10 billion contract.
India continues to have a close relationship with Dassault, which supplied the Indian Air Force (IAF) with Mirage 2000 fighters in the 1980s. However, given the IAF's emphasis on future upgrades for its MMRCA aircraft, the lack of operators of the Rafale is likely to be seen as a significant issue.
The Rafale and the Typhoon could also struggle with the issue of cost. Both are relatively large twin-engined platforms, which will significantly increase operating costs compared with the single-engined MiG-21 fleet it will replace.
The MiG-35 is seen by many as a strong contender. India has a very close relationship with Russia, which has provided the majority of its equipment over the past 30 years. However, over the past year India's relationship with Russia with regards to arms contracts has soured.
The two US contenders seem well placed in terms of price and capability as India seeks to establish closer military bonds with Washington. However the F-16 is hindered by the fact that Pakistan already operates the type. Furthermore the aircraft is already being phased out by the US Air Force.
The Boeing Super Hornet does not suffer from these issues. However, one unresolved issue with regards to both US platforms is the authorisation of technology transfer.
Saab holds a strong hand with the Gripen. The aircraft is single engined, which will keep operating costs low, upgrades are already being defined under the Gripen Demonstrator programme and acquisition costs are highly competitive.
Image: The aircraft selected as India's MMRCA will replace its MiG-21s (pictured) (Patrick
Well, I guess I'm a Rafale fan now. I like the way France responded in that link you gave earlier, they are really trying to differentiate themselves from the rest of the pack in a good way.
I'm going on a separate tangent here but if India rejects the Mig 35 would that result in strained Pak-Fa cooperation? That would leave India in a precarious position, no F-35, no Pak FA.
Interesting though Janes doesn't really justify the title in this article, I think all the contenders have the same chance as the Gripen because India will look at more factors than just cost at this critical evaluation stage.
Isn't Rafale very expensive?.
I like the idea of this thread and believe that this question should be taken seriously
Within the next 5 years India will be operating 4.5-5 gen aircraft as their front line fighters, all packing AESA, BVR, with top of the line engines and avionics, helmet mounted sights and thrust vectoring or super cruise.
This is worrying because our F-16 will be hard pressed to match a Rafale or Typhoon, even the Super Hornet would cause serious problems with its radar, and our F-16 will lose its advantage due to sheer numbers alone.
I don't want to compare the JF-17 yet to a Block 60 F-16 or a modified Gripen, so we need a serious deterrent...J10 or FC-20 is basically a legacy era F-16, what's the point of buying them? They have never been tested in battle and China only has 100 of them while the F-16 has proven itself and there are more than 4,000 flying around in the world today.
We need to evaluate real aircraft in a similar manner in a similar schedule as the MRCA program otherwise the balance in air power will be completely with India if it isn't already due to the SU-30 threat.
I am against purchasing 2-3 squadrons of FC-20. Maximum amount of capital should be reserved for our next front line fighter, or the expenditure can be shifted to JF-17 program instead.
My personal choice would be Eurofighter if India doesn't choose it. If they were to choose it I would go with Gripen NG. Let j10 develop and mature into what it was supposed to be, and once it has, let it be incorporated amongst the Typhoon or Gripen squadrons. Having the right fighter planes is much more important than any other equipment issue in the entire military.
Scrap the J-10 plans and the JF-17 program and use the funds for 2nd hand Falcon OCUs and the above.
why scrap the J-10 when we dont even know what PAF variant is gonna be like?
why scrap JF-17 for 100 odd high hours clock F-16s? Current 32 PAF F-16 and 14 ex-PAK/USN f-16 is a vise decision to give them MLU. PAF is only interested in very few hours clocked airframes like in the recently released F-16's case. the upgraded F-16 will have only 25 max years of service. and lol do you want us to go through US strings attached with F-16s? If their was no JF-17 or FC-20 program for PAF the US would have probably made us do 10 times more of the dirty work for them then now what we are doing.
In response to that I can ask you: When is the PAF variant approaching IOC?
Do you know the technical and operational parameters of the PLAAF variant of the J-10 or for that matter does Pakistan? How does a J-10 compare to Falcon MLU/OCU variants in battlespace application?-by that I'm talking situational awareness/networking, a DEMONSTRATED BVR capability behind all the Chinese hype about the SD-10 which has apparently on begun limited trials and most importantly are the Chinese going to give Pakistan full access to the supply management chain for the J-10 with regards for full servicibility of the radar unit, EW Suite and sensor suite? ?
Why do you think Jordan ordered 25year+ Falcon airframes and continue to order after numerous Pakistani and Chinese presentations re: the JF-17 on the parameters of life cycle cost, purchase price, customisation and integration?
The JF-17 and J-10 cannot be "plugged in" to AEW assets the PAF has and even when a datalink solution is found it will lag behind full Link 16 Block III standards found now on Western designs. Lack of bandwith means you might as well use GCI when up against your particular peer adversary.
#1 Despite several instances of fratricide the IAF is improving Information dominance across the board in particular the linkage between the MIG-21BM and MKI assets via Elbit M-II for "sharing" targeting information for BVR. In other words you have a "swarm" of expendable Bisons capable of AA-12 BVR shots linked to Phalcon AWACS, Green Pine Search Radar and MKI shooters ALL able to "see" deep within Pakistan-indeed as far as the Western Iranian border/Iraq.
#3 The induction of about a hundred-two hundred MRCA (I bet Super Hornet) able to be directly plugged into that grid and you think the J-10 and JF-17 are the answer?
like i said. we dont even know PAF J-10 variant but from various source it is suppose to have European avionics and possibly radar with some structural improvements. the technical detail still remains classified so you shouldn’t jump to conclusion that FC-20 sucks simply because its chinese made. i am only going to stick to PAF ACM words that FC-20 will be a more advance fighter then current J-10and F-16 block 52.
dont compare Jordan with pakistan ASR. the RJAF fly less so they will be ok with high clocked airframes while PAF will be not. your assumption of RJAF rejection of JF-17s over 2nd hand F-16s is wrong. PAF has just recently inducted 2nd hand F-16s and plans for more in the future but i see no reduction in JF-17 orders or total rejection over F-16. Jordan is still very much interested in jF-17s and so are most of arab states.
well thats your assumstion but PAF is working on block 2 JF-17 and FC-20 for data linking Erieye as well as ZDK-03.
their is no dough of IAF superiority over PAF in BVR scenario but that gap will be enormously shortened in 1-2 years, but i am sure PAF still today has counter measures.
now thats what i call being ignorant. Iraq does not even border pakistan let alone Phalcon detecting as far as 600km+ in PAK western borders. dont for get the long range SAM factors.
no FC-20 and JF-17 are not the answer to 4.5 generation MRCA as a matter of fact even F-16s are not the answer to super hornets but it will work for PAF.