PAF to launch full scale exercise

[Falcon26]

In a limited conflict; the PAF can keep the IAF at bay.
In an all out war, after a week the PAF will cease to exist; but then the nuclear weapons will also be ready to go.

In previous conflicts, has PAF ever ceased to exist after a certain period. Where is this assumption based? And if the PAF ceases to exist after a week, what will be left of the IAF?

 

[Windjammer]

Roaring Thunder performing on Defence Day.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1056158177824809

I hope you do know that the Americans praise almost everyone for the sake of formality.

They do and they may have done this time as well, but
Who is talking about just the Americans here. !!!

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Fortune favors the brave. Bring it on PAF...

In previous conflicts, has PAF ever ceased to exist after a certain period. Where is this assumption based? And if the PAF ceases to exist after a week, what will be left of the IAF?

I think these are based on simulations. If Robert McNamara's mind failed no mortal is infallible..

 

[SQ8]

In previous conflicts, has PAF ever ceased to exist after a certain period. Where is this assumption based? And if the PAF ceases to exist after a week, what will be left of the IAF?

By Cease to exist, I mean being operationally effective. Previous conflicts had the following advantages:
1. Training and coordination of efforts being poor from the Indian side- very bad in 65 .. not so in 71

2. Less effective weaponry overall. Infact, in 65 the PAF took defeat from what was a near total destruction of the IAF's frontline force it could have achieved had the attacks actually gone as planned and not left half fulfilled due to dithering senior officers.

In 71, the PAF was not that present as it could be because it was preserving its combat aircraft for the planned counter offensive under Tikka Khan.

 

[fatman17]

in previous conflicts, the main issue was availability of munitions and spares for both the air force and army. not so anymore. with each defense deal we purchase additional spares. we are now much more self reliant esp. the army.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

By Cease to exist, I mean being operationally effective. Previous conflicts had the following advantages:
1. Training and coordination of efforts being poor from the Indian side- very bad in 65 .. not so in 71

2. Less effective weaponry overall. Infact, in 65 the PAF took defeat from what was a near total destruction of the IAF's frontline force it could have achieved had the attacks actually gone as planned and not left half fulfilled due to dithering senior officers.

In 71, the PAF was not that present as it could be because it was preserving its combat aircraft for the planned counter offensive under Tikka Khan.

I imagine the armed forces would also be hoping for a ceasefire within 1-2 weeks of the conflict starting, especially if they succeed in dishing a few noteworthy and bludgeoning attacks in the beginning. In internet arguments it's called "getting the last word."

 

[tarrar]

It is a good initiative from PaF, well done.

 

[SQ8]

I imagine the armed forces would also be hoping for a ceasefire within 1-2 weeks of the conflict starting, especially if they succeed in dishing a few noteworthy and bludgeoning attacks in the beginning. In internet arguments it's called "getting the last word."

Getting the last word is not going to go in our favour beyond day 3.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Getting the last word is not going to go in our favour beyond day 3.

The PAF's limitations is one reason why I think we should have - and definitely need to moving forward - make an investment in ground-based PGBs. Basically a <300km SLBM that is relatively lightweight (1500kg) but can carry a 500kg+ HE conventional warhead, and is relatively cheap to produce. Hundreds - if not 1000+ - of such things in our possession would give us a saturation strike capability, one that can function even when the PAF is tied into full-time air defence and air interdiction tasks. Via the LORA (real name), Israel is moving in this direction.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @Oscar

Hello Sir ; Just out of curiousity ; How much time it takes to make Missiles
in any factory

Google does nt provide any answer

We know that in case of aircrafts some 16 to 18 are made per year

 

[Viking 63]

Name the exercise Saffron Bandit 3 !!! hell with them !

 

[SQ8]

The PAF's limitations is one reason why I think we should have - and definitely need to moving forward - make an investment in ground-based PGBs. Basically a <300km SLBM that is relatively lightweight (1500kg) but can carry a 500kg+ HE conventional warhead, and is relatively cheap to produce. Hundreds - if not 1000+ - of such things in our possession would give us a saturation strike capability, one that can function even when the PAF is tied into full-time air defence and air interdiction tasks. Via the LORA (real name), Israel is moving in this direction.

It is not a bad idea except that it would require the equivalent launchers and that would be costly. A ballistic missile without warhead is around $250000 for a SRBM with its guidance; add to it the cost of a guided weapon like the LT-3 or some purpose developed item and it hits $300000, so a battalion of 50 would end up 15 million dollars. While much cheaper than an aircraft; this is 15 million you will never recover or reuse and in this case we have not even considered the cost of ancillary equipment and so on.

On the other hand, the idea of low cost UAV's on loitering missions carrying just this payload may not be a bad option. Or essentially a lycoming engine bolted onto a range extending fuselage that in theory should fly back.

https://defence.pk/threads/low-cost-autonomous-attack-system.384344/

 

[Rafael]

Getting the last word is not going to go in our favour beyond day 3.

Once we induct JFT in numbers, we should have 300-350 decent Bvr fighters with F16s as strike package. Dont you think its enough to deter IAF? This is just what is planned for now, we may see an additional platform once the Rafaels are here.

Besides, I think it will all depend on how many IAF is willing to loose. If PAF is taken down completely with 50-60% IAF fleet gone as well, it would be too expensive a war for them.

 

[mansoor raja]

Name the exercise Saffron Bandit 3 !!! hell with them !

Clear victory for Pakistan...

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

It is not a bad idea except that it would require the equivalent launchers and that would be costly. A ballistic missile without warhead is around $250000 for a SRBM with its guidance; add to it the cost of a guided weapon like the LT-3 or some purpose developed item and it hits $300000, so a battalion of 50 would end up 15 million dollars. While much cheaper than an aircraft; this is 15 million you will never recover or reuse and in this case we have not even considered the cost of ancillary equipment and so on.

On the other hand, the idea of low cost UAV's on loitering missions carrying just this payload may not be a bad option. Or essentially a lycoming engine bolted onto a range extending fuselage that in theory should fly back.

https://defence.pk/threads/low-cost-autonomous-attack-system.384344/

I was wondering about that. Isn't it theoretically possible to have the turbojet engines used on our LACMs function in a way where they could come back? I assume - because they are "engines" - there is some kind of fuel management and control system (as opposed to a rocket which just burns through the propellant).

One could theoretically use these engines to power a bomb truck UAV, though I imagine the munition itself would need to be a SOW in order to compensate for the reduced range of the UAV's engine (since the UAV would need to come back).