p 17 & type 052c comparison

[tanlixiang28776]

what did you think when they started comparing 052C with P17s

Read the title of this page. Yeah you guys are good at lying to yourself alright.

 

[RISING SUN]

The commissioning of first P-15A is now scheduled in early 2013.

About the Delhi-class, I don't think it's fair to compare with 052C which is a stealth DDG while the
former isn't.

P-15 Delhi-class compares against earlier Type-052B and Type-051B I think.[/QUOTE]
Please provide a link for that. What I know is that it is delayed & it will be commissioned this month. Original date was 2010.
for second part I was talking to Chinese guy. There is nothing wrong in comparing. I didn't say that Delhi class was superior.

 

[Gessler]

Having far longer ranged sams is not a advantage? BMD capabilities are useless? Just because India lacks these things does not mean its useless. Both the US and Europeans View BMD and long range missiles as essential in a Fleet defense destroyer with their standard and aster missiles. BMD missiles require the highest reaction times in the world to deal with mach high hyper sonic aka mach 10 plus missiles. Dealing with missiles that can only go below mach 2 in terminal phase seems rather trivial compared to that

If you wanted to compare short range missiles the type 52D can quad pack them in its 64 VLUS so thats 256 short range missiles to your 64. Yeah you're not going to win a numbers war.

As for who would launch anti ship ballistic missiles the DF 21D is operational according to both Chinese, and US officials. So have fun with those pounding your ships with no BMD. Because BMD is completely useless apparently.

We only need on missile that surpasses the Brahmos here. Range wise the YJ 62 beats the Brahmos easily and as for the supersonic, or subsonic discussion the YJ 12 is a 400 km range supersonic missile that is operated by the chinese since 1999. Supersonic missiles are not exactly out of China's realm. The 2000 km range DH 10 is with full load and the 1000km range is the full load of the nirbhay. Compare apples to apples here. The thing is the P15B is going to incorporate these and they are nowhere to be seen as of this moment.

For Brahmos please keep the discussion on current systems. You do not see me bringing in some un deployed or unheard of Chinese missile into the argument. Its jarring to have to constantly compare things that do not exist to things that have been in service for years.

I'll admit that the P15A has a more helicopters but the AESA system located on four sides of the bridge of the type 52C are far larger and more cpable than the small ones on the structure mounted on the P 15A.

The 54 frigate used to have 4 630s as well and in the 54A they were replaced by two type 730s. The type 730 is a completely autonomous system with is own FCR while the AK 630s are linked single radar.

I have researched plenty and you have ignored some of the most important factors of a modern destroyer, namely BMD. You also like to compare non operational Indian projects to Chinese that that are a decade old. Yeah if I used those kind of arguments China would be more advanced than Aliens.\

Shipbuilding capability is one of the most relevant things when discussing a navy. The type 52C was operational in 2003 and the P 15A yet to be operational. The type 52D has been launched while the P15A has yet to be launched. We are discussing a ship you do not even have operational yet. Thats pretty generous already



This is the comparison the OP put out there. I merely complied with the topic.



Do not hide behind jokes. I'm fairly certain that because since the P 15A has its radar in a structure above the bridge that you thought the type 52C did as well.



Please just work with current facts. I really hate arguing hypotheticals. We can argue ifs to the end of time. And what does the weight of the ship matter when we're discussing weapon systems?

As for the SAM project the Barak 8 ship based system is 70 km. The air force ground based ones are 150 km. So basically yeah nothing to do with your ships.

I'm not underestimating anyone. I do research and present facts based on current facts.

As I've already said, you choose to read selectively.

First of all, the DF-21D is called "carrier-killer" for a reason. In a usual deployment scenario, it has a Circular Error Probable (CEP) of about 50meters. Which is just about the size of a normal AAC.
When a missile has a CEP of 50m, it means that 50% of missiles thus fired will hit within 50m of the target location. Now a warship like P-15A is gonna have a width much much lesser than that. So there's only about 50% as much chance that it'll hit as it would have hitting a carrier.

Secondly, you have again misunderstood my posts. I never said Barak doesn't have BMD capability. Do you know about the Barak-8ER? The Westerners often refer to it as the "mini-Aegis". It can be fitted aboard warships in the same VLS cell that would otherwise house the normal Barak-8. I believe that a usual P-15A will be fitted with 50-50 combo of these missiles, 32 anti-aircraft and 32 with BMD capability. Not to mention that almost every SAM long-range system in the world has limited BMD capability. Just like HHQ-9, the one that you think is an ABM.

There are no plans to procure S-400 LR-SAMs. Lockheed Martin's AEGIS is the combat management system that icnludes sensors like Raytheon's SPY-1 family of shipborne PESA radar. Compared to the SPY-1, the EL/M-2248 MF-STAR S-band AESA radar is a far more superior product and it is this radar which will go on board the Project 15A and 15B DDGs and the seven Project 17A FFGs, along with the Barak-8 MR-SAMs and Barak-8ER LR-SAMs.

The shipborne element of BMD will be available once the EL/M-2248 MF-STAR/Barak-8ER is commissioned on board the Project 15A and 15B DDGs.

TRISHUL: The BMD Challenge You can trust this guy. He's got the most
reliable set of insider info of any other Indian defence analyst. And FYI, the VLS cells housing the Barak-8 and Barak-8ER have already been installed on the P-15A several months ago.

HHQ-9 isn't the only one with BMD capability around. It has longer range yes, but Barak-VIII has much higher G-stress tolerence, maneuverability and resulting kill probability, making it a more effective system in the overall.

It's funny you think while 052D will get VLUS cells and P-15B (and even upgraded P-15A) won't get soon enough thereafter. I don't think anyone would have expected P-17 would turn out to be
superior to 054A until it came and proved itself. I think you should just wait likwise.

And i don't think all this "operational since years" thing bears the relevence in question, afterall, Im only comparing India's 1st-generation stealth DDG to its Chinese counterpart. 052D is China's 2nd-gen Stealth DDG, I'll wait until P-15B is launched and it's specs become available before debating over it.

About the BrahMos, you are again imagening things and ranting. Check my posts way back in Page 1. I have always been saying PJ-10 is 300km as of now. I am only telling that it's range restriction is not due to MTCR but due to the available OTHT capabilities of IN. It's range will be increased once OTHT is improved, that's what I said.

About the radar, you are again over-estimating Chinese stuff. According to many knowledgable persons, the MF-STAR AESA of P-15A is superior to the APY-1 radar that forms part of the US Navy AEGIS system. I'll leave it to you to figure if you think your 052C's AESA is superior to the USN AEGIS' radar.

And just to give you a realm of what's coming -

1. BrahMos-II Hypersonic (test-bed systems already lab tested at upto Mach 5.65), source - Wikipedia
May not have 300km range restriction. Top speed: - Mach 7

2. LRCM High-supersonic (both ASCM and ALCM versions in development)
Range: - 1,000km, Speed: - Mach 3.2-4.0

Can you tell me about China's future ASCMs under development? Just for the knowledge.

I'll present some more stuff tomorrow, I have some work now.

 

[patriot_indian]

No need for such comparison. Type 052C and D will distroy The indian frigate.

yaaaar u day dream and console yourself by saying all these nonsense . typical mentality . do it till the indian frigates fixes every thing . dont day dream too much its injurious for your hollow superiority and holllow ambitions.

 

[timetravel]

Wow the Indian ships are clearly better and more capable.. thanks to Indian members in this thread for all the information... anyone who reads this thread independently will know Indian ships are >> then CHinese ships.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

You are dumber than I thought. You are assuming that VLS aboard Indian ships can hold only 1 missile per cell & that too can not be reloaded. BTW Kolkata class has 80 cells not 64. 48 cell Barak 8 SAM & 32 Barak 1 SAM.
You haven't provided link for DH10 employed on Chinese naval ships.
BARAK missile-capability is very close to SM-2. So it may not be BMD but it can hold on its own.
There are total 3 missile under development 70,120,150 KM range. Which one is BARAK 8 is still not clear. Everyone is playing here by using deception others.
For GOD sake just provide a link of DH10 with your naval ships.

Not all VLS units are the same. The ones that hold the barak 8 and barak 1 are specifically designed for that missile. That is why they have a fixed amount for that ship. You can not put a barak 8 missile in a barak 1 cell or the other way around are they are completely different sizes and were not designed for that purpose. The VLU units on the type 52C is also like this as they can only hold the 200 km range HQ 9 missile. The one on the type 52D however is a much larger Universal VLU capable of holding one large missile or 4 small ones. The 52D also has 21 round hq 10 launcher - 15 km range ,in the back while the P 15A holds 32 12 km range barak 1

Barak 8 is 70 km while the sm 2 is a 190km proven BMD missile. These are not even in the same class of missiles and is nowhere near being comparable. i have no idea how you came to the conclusion that they are.

As for the constant personal attacks go ahead. I do not need to revert to such juvenile tactics to deal with the likes of you.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

As I've already said, you choose to read selectively.

First of all, the DF-21D is called "carrier-killer" for a reason. In a usual deployment scenario, it has a Circular Error Probable (CEP) of about 50meters. Which is just about the size of a normal AAC.
When a missile has a CEP of 50m, it means that 50% of missiles thus fired will hit within 50m of the target location. Now a warship like P-15A is gonna have a width much much lesser than that. So there's only about 50% as much chance that it'll hit as it would have hitting a carrier.

Secondly, you have again misunderstood my posts. I never said Barak doesn't have BMD capability. Do you know about the Barak-8ER? The Westerners often refer to it as the "mini-Aegis". It can be fitted aboard warships in the same VLS cell that would otherwise house the normal Barak-8. I believe that a usual P-15A will be fitted with 50-50 combo of these missiles, 32 anti-aircraft and 32 with BMD capability. Not to mention that almost every SAM long-range system in the world has limited BMD capability. Just like HHQ-9, the one that you think is an ABM.

Do you even understand what the whole point a modern fleet defense is for these days? Hmm could it be that it has to provide defense for the entire fleet that includes aircraft carriers.

The barak 8 meant for the P 15A is the 70 km version. The HQ 9 is still a 200 km range missile. If you want to compare then do so with on that is in the same class of missiles like the 50 km range HQ 16 which can be quad packed in the 64 VLU cells in the type 52D.

TRISHUL: The BMD Challenge You can trust this guy. He's got the most
reliable set of insider info of any other Indian defence analyst. And FYI, the VLS cells housing the Barak-8 and Barak-8ER have already been installed on the P-15A several months ago.

HHQ-9 isn't the only one with BMD capability around. It has longer range yes, but Barak-VIII has much higher G-stress tolerence, maneuverability and resulting kill probability, making it a more effective system in the overall.

It's funny you think while 052D will get VLUS cells and P-15B (and even upgraded P-15A) won't get soon enough thereafter. I don't think anyone would have expected P-17 would turn out to be
superior to 054A until it came and proved itself. I think you should just wait likwise.

Provide numbers instead of simply claiming for the sake of everyone. As for VLU the it simply stands for Vertical launch unit. P 15A has that. What it does not have is universal VLS like the ones on the 52D or the very common mark 41. When we describe the missile payload of a mk 41 ship or the 52D we simply give a number of cells on it and what can fit into each cell. Nobody actually knows the exact payload of that ship from an outsiders point of view. We know explicitly that the P 15A fits exactly 64 barak 8 type missiles and 32 barak 1 missiles. You don't think you can honestly jam a tomahawk type missile in a barak 1 cell right?

And i don't think all this "operational since years" thing bears the relevence in question, afterall, Im only comparing India's 1st-generation stealth DDG to its Chinese counterpart. 052D is China's 2nd-gen Stealth DDG, I'll wait until P-15B is launched and it's specs become available before debating over it.

About the BrahMos, you are again imagening things and ranting. Check my posts way back in Page 1. I have always been saying PJ-10 is 300km as of now. I am only telling that it's range restriction is not due to MTCR but due to the available OTHT capabilities of IN. It's range will be increased once OTHT is improved, that's what I said.

About the radar, you are again over-estimating Chinese stuff. According to many knowledgable persons, the MF-STAR AESA of P-15A is superior to the APY-1 radar that forms part of the US Navy AEGIS system. I'll leave it to you to figure if you think your 052C's AESA is superior to the USN AEGIS' radar.

And just to give you a realm of what's coming -

1. BrahMos-II Hypersonic (test-bed systems already lab tested at upto Mach 5.65), source - Wikipedia
May not have 300km range restriction. Top speed: - Mach 7

2. LRCM High-supersonic (both ASCM and ALCM versions in development)
Range: - 1,000km, Speed: - Mach 3.2-4.0

Can you tell me about China's future ASCMs under development? Just for the knowledge.

I'll present some more stuff tomorrow, I have some work now.

The 52D is an improvement on the 52C hence they keep the same 52 designation. When the 55 comes out you can call that China's 2nd gen destroyer. But the whole point of semantics is rather irrelevant when we look at what is reality today. The type 52D has been produced before the P 15A.

I argue with what the PLAN currently possesses. The P 15B specs are as muddy as the type 55 ones, and the type 55 is likely to be produced earlier looking at the current pace of procurement. Like this i do not bring in any rumor missiles like the HN 2000 to compare with anyone and neither should you.

As for the business of new missiles in China they are generally not heard of until they have been deployed. Such was the case with the DH 10, and CJ 10. Also news of missiles are generally overshadowed by news of the J 20 and J 21 stealth fighters and carrier projects.

 

[RISING SUN]

1. Why exactly do you care about weight? I only put it their for a basic idea how large they are. We're talking about weapon systems here.

As for the radar i would not recommend using a Wikipedia article with no citations.

Type 346

There is specific belief that some of the technology may be derived from the Ukrainian ISKRA company’s IL-220U that employs the 1L259M 3D monopulse emitter used in the land mobile ZOO PARK-2 weapon location system, but so far this has been refuted by the Ukrainians.

So yeah the 346 has no association to the Ukrainian radar as stated by Ukrainians.

The 450 km range exceeds the 250 km max range of the P 15A by quite a bit. As for mini Aegis its ironic that the term is usually associated with missile defence systems capable of BMD something the P 15A lacks completely and is the focus of the type 52C.



When you completely take a ships CIWS as the ships APARs its a joke but when i make a mistake typing a huge page out you're going to call me out on it? Yeah i made a mistake and you outright lie about things like the P 15B being launched a few months ago. I think that's pretty fair.

I provided you the separate link & its not Wikipedia. Perhaps you didn't open it that's why you are claiming it as Wikipedia.
Another claim- refuted by Ukrainians. Please provide a link first.
As I said earlier you are ignoring Indian navy. 257 Kmts for RCS = 2m2 is what you are quoting(confused) & this is the range of 1 individual radar in Indian naval service ships. Range of P15 is greater than what you can imagine. & who said P15A doesn't have BMD capability. A single ship is never used in BMD environment. Barak can target many types of missiles. Only question is detection & tracking capability. India does have BMD capability.
& 052C has limited BMD capability.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

I provided you the separate link & its not Wikipedia. Perhaps you didn't open it that's why you are claiming it as Wikipedia.
Another claim- refuted by Ukrainians. Please provide a link first.
As I said earlier you are ignoring Indian navy. 257 Kmts for RCS = 2m2 is what you are quoting(confused) & this is the range of 1 individual radar in Indian naval service ships. Range of P15 is greater than what you can imagine. & who said P15A doesn't have BMD capability. A single ship is never used in BMD environment. Barak can target many types of missiles. Only question is detection & tracking capability. India does have BMD capability.
& 052C has limited BMD capability.

Yes and that one was based on conjecture that the Ukrainians denied in the article i posted.

Type 346

257 km for a target that is a 4 times larger than a clean f 16 which is 1m1. This is the range stated by elbis to be the radar range of. I do not need to imagine what the P 15 range is. In fact I generally like to base my opinion on hard data something you should try yourself sometime. For the P 15 BMD capabilities it is solely based on the rumor that it will receive the barak 8ER a missile that may or may not be on the P 15A. So your only ballistic missile defence is base on a missile you MIGHT get. I'm sure barak can target many many missiles. That doesn't give it unlimited capabilities or range. Far from it the ship based barak is limited to 70 km and possible ballistic missile defence.

No even with the proper detection and tracking a missile with a 70 km missile range does not go 200 km. Thats basic physics right there.

India has yet to produce a BMD with a success thresh hold over 80% never mind actually deploying any.

52C has terminal BMD and thats where its limited. Full capability BMDS require ranges of over 800 km to intercept missiles midcourse, a capability demonstrated only by the US and China.

 

[RISING SUN]

Not all VLS units are the same. The ones that hold the barak 8 and barak 1 are specifically designed for that missile. That is why they have a fixed amount for that ship. You can not put a barak 8 missile in a barak 1 cell or the other way around are they are completely different sizes and were not designed for that purpose. The VLU units on the type 52C is also like this as they can only hold the 200 km range HQ 9 missile. The one on the type 52D however is a much larger Universal VLU capable of holding one large missile or 4 small ones. The 52D also has 21 round hq 10 launcher - 15 km range ,in the back while the P 15A holds 32 12 km range barak 1

Barak 8 is 70 km while the sm 2 is a 190km proven BMD missile. These are not even in the same class of missiles and is nowhere near being comparable. i have no idea how you came to the conclusion that they are.

As for the constant personal attacks go ahead. I do not need to revert to such juvenile tactics to deal with the likes of you.

Oh my GOD,how much I will have to explain to this poor guy. Where did I said that it can hold both missiles. Let me say it again I said it has that much cells. It is not known whether these cells can hold 1 or more than 1 missile in 1 cell. And when I say more than missile then I mean no of missile in 1 cell, not types of missiles in same 1 cell. Understood?

For 2nd part do you have comprehension problem mate? I said it is closer & you understood comparable. It will move it closer to medium range naval systems like the RIM-162 Evolved Sea Sparrow or even the SM-2 Standard. Very well.
RIM-66 Standard is a medium range surface-to-air missile (SAM) originally developed for the United States Navy (USN)operational range is 40 to 90 nmi (74 to 170 km), Flight ceiling 24,400 m (80,100 ft), Speed Mach 3.5.
BARAK 8 Operational range 70km MR-SAM Naval variant, Flight ceiling 16000m Speed 3M.
See the data. Moving closer.
If You are acting like a boy,what can I do for it. 1st read carefully.

Yes and that one was based on conjecture that the Ukrainians denied in the article i posted.

Type 346

257 km for a target that is a 4 times larger than a clean f 16 which is 1m1. This is the range stated by elbis to be the radar range of. I do not need to imagine what the P 15 range is. In fact I generally like to base my opinion on hard data something you should try yourself sometime. For the P 15 BMD capabilities it is solely based on the rumor that it will receive the barak 8ER a missile that may or may not be on the P 15A. So your only ballistic missile defence is base on a missile you MIGHT get. I'm sure barak can target many many missiles. That doesn't give it unlimited capabilities or range. Far from it the ship based barak is limited to 70 km and possible ballistic missile defence.

No even with the proper detection and tracking a missile with a 70 km missile range does not go 200 km. Thats basic physics right there.

India has yet to produce a BMD with a success thresh hold over 80% never mind actually deploying any.

52C has terminal BMD and thats where its limited. Full capability BMDS require ranges of over 800 km to intercept missiles midcourse, a capability demonstrated only by the US and China.

In which post you posted link for Ukrainians denying themselves?

 

[RISING SUN]

A missile that has been in service since 1997 with news channels showing it intercepting BM is not tested. My My what standards you have. As for limited capability it means it has terminal phase interception unlike the midcourse ones China is currently testing.

The Nirbhay is stated to be 1000 km full load. Lets leave it at that.

For CIWS Chinese use a missile and gun approach with new ships like the 52D equipped with a type 730 and a 21 round hq 10 - 15 km CIWS missile launcher.

Just provide a link which says interceptor took off from ship & destroyed the target. I will be more than happy to know this. In reality I am not against china(if you leave our fight aside).

 

[tanlixiang28776]

Oh my GOD,how much I will have to explain to this poor guy. Where did I said that it can hold both missiles. Let me say it again I said it has that much cells. It is not known whether these cells can hold 1 or more than 1 missile in 1 cell. And when I say more than missile then I mean no of missile in 1 cell, not types of missiles in same 1 cell. Understood?

You have no idea what you are talking about in relation to universal VLS units. If it cannot hold both types of missiles then it can not possibly be universal never mind having the ability to be quad packed. Thats the very concept of a universal vls that you are trying to prove is on the P 15A. This is not the case. The reason we know that the P 15A has exactly 64 barak 8, 32 barak 1, and 16 brahmos is that its vls are unique to the missile it contains. IF the P 15A had universal units as in your imagination then we would get a the number of cells it has and what missiles it can hold and how many per cell.

For 2nd part do you have comprehension problem mate? I said it is closer & you understood comparable. It will move it closer to medium range naval systems like the RIM-162 Evolved Sea Sparrow or even the SM-2 Standard. Very well.
RIM-66 Standard is a medium range surface-to-air missile (SAM) originally developed for the United States Navy (USN)operational range is 40 to 90 nmi (74 to 170 km), Flight ceiling 24,400 m (80,100 ft), Speed Mach 3.5.
BARAK 8 Operational range 70km MR-SAM Naval variant, Flight ceiling 16000m Speed 3M.
See the data. Moving closer.
If You are acting like a boy,what can I do for it. 1st read carefully.

The current SM 2ER is 190 KM max range, and the current barak 8 shipbased is 70 km. Moving closer would be the difference between a 70 km missile and 100 km missile. Not when the difference is close to a factor of 3. Comparisons cannot be based on such loose descriptions.

In which post you posted link for Ukrainians denying themselves?

Type 346

"There is specific belief that some of the technology may be derived from the Ukrainian ISKRA company’s IL-220U that employs the 1L259M 3D monopulse emitter used in the land mobile ZOO PARK-2 weapon location system, but so far this has been refuted by the Ukrainians."

this is the third time I have posted this. It seems your the one lacking reading comprehension

Just provide a link which says interceptor took off from ship & destroyed the target. I will be more than happy to know this. In reality I am not against china(if you leave our fight aside).

HHQ 9 is an updated version of the HQ 9 that uses an solid state AESA radar for tracking.

The AESA on the type 52C is larger than this.

 

[RISING SUN]

Indians have a laughable mindset that completely ignores actual facts and like to pull in things that are from the future to compare with others past. This kind of comparison is laughable at best and actually quite pathetic when you think about it.

India has yet to actually launch a single P 15A when China has 6 type 52C with the first launched since 2003. The type 52D has also been launched

Lets not simplify armament and actually compare with full facts. Now what and idea that is.

Indian DDG P15A not launched

16 brahmos 300 km antiship missiles
64 barak 8 70 km mid range missiles
32 barak 1 12 km missiles
4 30 mm guns
1 100 mm guns

Chinese type 52C 6 complete

8 yj 62 400 km antiship missiles
48 200 km range longe range missiles
2 30 mm guns
1 100 mm gun

Chinese type 52D 1 complete 2 building

64 Universal VLS units that can hold any mixture of the following missiles

HQ 9- 200 km range surface to air missile also capable of terminal phase ballistic missile interception- one per cell
HQ 16- 50 km air to surface missile - can be quad packed
YJ 62- 400 km range antiship missle- one per cell
DH 10- 4000 km cruise missile- one per cell
CJ 10- 2000 km cruise missile- one per cell
ASROC type torpedos- one per cell
YJ 83- 200 km supersonic antiship missile- one per cell
Main gun is the 70 caliber 130mm PJ 38 capable of firing PGMs and normal rounds
CIWS include a 7 barrel type 730 and a 21 round, 15 km range HQ 10 mount

Yep we're freaking delusional comparing ships that are out and have massively larger arsenals with ones that are still not launched

In which Zombiland are you living mate?
India launched its P15A ships way back and you are saying it is still not launched.
Name Laid down Launched
INS Kolkata 27 September 2003 30 March 2006
INS Kochi 25 October 2005 18 September 2009
INS Chennai 21 February 2006 1 April 2010
So 1st ship was launched in early 2006 and last ship in mid 2010.
Any doubts?

 

[tanlixiang28776]

In which Zombiland are you living mate?
India launched its P15A ships way back and you are saying it is still not launched.
Name Laid down Launched
INS Kolkata 27 September 2003 30 March 2006
INS Kochi 25 October 2005 18 September 2009
INS Chennai 21 February 2006 1 April 2010
So 1st ship was launched in early 2006 and last ship in mid 2010.
Any doubts?

None are in service. That is what i'm saying. While the 52C has been since 2003

I apologize for using launched. The day a ship is fully operational is when its commissioned, which none of the P 15A are. The first type 52C was commissioned in 2003. Also why does it take from 2006 to 2012 to commission? Most ships take this size take 1 to 2 years

 

[RISING SUN]

You have no idea what you are talking about in relation to universal VLS units. If it cannot hold both types of missiles then it can not possibly be universal never mind having the ability to be quad packed. Thats the very concept of a universal vls that you are trying to prove is on the P 15A. This is not the case. The reason we know that the P 15A has exactly 64 barak 8, 32 barak 1, and 16 brahmos is that its vls are unique to the missile it contains. IF the P 15A had universal units as in your imagination then we would get a the number of cells it has and what missiles it can hold and how many per cell.




The current SM 2ER is 190 KM max range, and the current barak 8 shipbased is 70 km. Moving closer would be the difference between a 70 km missile and 100 km missile. Not when the difference is close to a factor of 3. Comparisons cannot be based on such loose descriptions.




Type 346

"There is specific belief that some of the technology may be derived from the Ukrainian ISKRA company’s IL-220U that employs the 1L259M 3D monopulse emitter used in the land mobile ZOO PARK-2 weapon location system, but so far this has been refuted by the Ukrainians."

this is the third time I have posted this. It seems your the one lacking reading comprehension



HHQ 9 is an updated version of the HQ 9 that uses an solid state AESA radar for tracking.

The AESA on the type 52C is larger than this.

Oh again. Let me say it more correctly. I said that cell in P15 A can hold 1 or more missiles. And when I say this I mean in BARAK 1 cell only barak type of missile,it can hold 1 or 2-3 BARAK 1 no one knows it. I never said it is universal system which you think I am saying.

I never stated SM 2ER at all. You are imagining it. I gave missile name. You can check it on appropriate place. & I didn't compare it. I said capability of BARAK is moving closer to those two missiles.

& I ma asking 3rd time that please give me a link where Ukrainians are themselves claiming. You have given me link where same thing is written what you are saying that Ukrainians are refuting. But where the hell are those Ukrainians in the link? Link only says they are saying but where are they saying. There is no mention of that.

I know about HQ 9. I want to know about HHQ 9 launch. Give me a damn link which states the successful launch of HHQ 9 from naval platform. And please if possible in English language.