Open Debate | Do Bangladeshis regard India as a 'savior' ?

[UKBengali]

Sigh.

Who was using PPP to measure military strength? Please go back and take a look at the post once more.

Anyways, PPP was not the main point of the post.

The most significant point is that the BD economy looks set to be the fastest growing of the 3 large South Asian countries this decade.

Stronger economy gives the option to create a stronger military.

 

[Zabaniyah]

The question for the thread is "Do BD consider India as savior in context of 1971". If you are grateful, it answers the question raised. You people are opining on the basis of your perception about India in "todays" condition, that's least helping the cause of fair polling.

Read:

Since the war is over and Bangladesh is now a free nation, i am interested in asking from the Bangladeshis on this forum, if or not today in 2013, they accept India as their 'savior' for invading in a domestic conflict of a sovereign nation, or not. What role does India play in the psyche and the history of Bangladesh for the Bangladeshi youth??

The OP didn't ask for your people's votes. And only that of Bangladeshis in this forum. Since when did you people become Bangladeshis? It's an anonymous defense forum like many in the vast world of the Internet. Why so insecure?

You may lick your lollipop or whatever you find lick-able. And what is this retard comment --- lollipop, licking, next what? Shoving?

The retarded move came from you people by manipulating the poll in the first place. Now that's trolling beyond pathetic.

And hence the pun.

Many of the ruling folks are misusing history for their own benefit. And frankly, you guys just don't fit in.

But nonetheless, one can acknowledge that many Indian jawans died for their country. But that's history. Then why bother recalling ghosts of the past? To feel more appreciated among your neighbors? Come now.

The "owner" of this forum has repeatedly said this is an international forum with pakistani content. Cant you comprehend that?

Sure. But there was a reason why I had asked.

We are here because we are interested in defence. Where can we find more defence enthusiasts then a war/terrorism ridden country and that too happen to be hostile one?

Got 2 cent or just 1?

Well, one of your countrymen here said that no "self-respecting" Bangladesh would ever enter a Pakistani forum. Why not read before shooting off from your mouth?

And hence my inquiry. Suffice to say, that is the same reason why Bangladeshis come there. And not because we are "Jamaties".

Call it two cases of stupidity on part of your countrymen here. This is a classic case.

 

[mb444]

dumbest thread in this forum ever.... India a friend.....hilarious

 

[kalu_miah]

Anyways, PPP was not the main point of the post.

The most significant point is that the BD economy looks set to be the fastest growing of the 3 large South Asian countries this decade.

Stronger economy gives the option to create a stronger military.

Bangladesh by itself can never match India even with a stronger economy, unless it does two things:
1. Go Nuclear like Pakistan or at least have the ability to produce in short notice like Japan, after acquiring nuclear power generation technology
2. Be part of a large alliance of nations

Bangladesh needs to minimize its economic integration and dependence with India and increase its economic integration with these allied nations. That is the only long term way to defeat India's dream of hegemony in South Asia and Bangladesh.

 

[Zabaniyah]

dumbest thread in this forum ever.... India a friend.....hilarious

No please, let them be

 

[PoKeMon]

Read:


The OP didn't ask for your people's votes. And only that of Bangladeshis in this forum. Since when did you people become Bangladeshis? It's an anonymous defense forum like many in the vast world of the Internet. Why so insecure?



The retarded move came from you people by manipulating the poll in the first place. Now that's trolling beyond pathetic.

And hence the pun.

Many of the ruling folks are misusing history for their own benefit. And frankly, you guys just don't fit in.

But nonetheless, one can acknowledge that many Indian jawans died for their country. But that's history. Then why bother recalling ghosts of the past? To feel more appreciated among your neighbors? Come now.



Sure. But there was a reason why I had asked.



Well, one of your countrymen here said that no "self-respecting" Bangladesh would ever enter a Pakistani forum. Why not read before shooting off from your mouth?

And hence my inquiry. Suffice to say, that is the same reason why Bangladeshis come there. And not because we are "Jamaties".

Call it two cases of stupidity on part of your countrymen here. This is a classic case.

What pathetic post of yours is this?

Why are you shooting your tantrums on each and every indian just because some indian said something to you? Gone berserk?

Did I participate in polling? I am simply counter arguing the logic and post of you and your fellow countrymen. Is it prohibited?

And regarding why recalling history --- Cant you see the intentions of OP here? He simply is looking for the solace for genocide and defeat which attached to them in 1971.

Secondly you dont brag about something you did good. If someone feels grateful, its good enough, if not, good for them. By opening such thread OP makes sure that some Indian comes and boast of indian help to BD and then in return attracting BD posters to feel oppressed and thus acting ungrateful and non-pragmatic.

I am sure majority of BD people especially the older generation who has seen the things at ground in 71 are grateful to India for her help. New generation has some differences but that should not undermine the past, but work should be done to balance things again.

 

[Zabaniyah]

What pathetic post of yours is this?

What's pathetic is that you (not you as in YOU) manipulated the poll to suit your agenda here. And of-course, YOU are entitled to your opinions.

And honestly, Bangladeshis don't care what you people think of our history and now - As in this thread.

Thank you.

(And in case you were wondering, I didn't participate in the poll).

 

[UKBengali]

Bangladesh by itself can never match India even with a stronger economy, unless it does two things:
1. Go Nuclear like Pakistan or at least have the ability to produce in short notice like Japan, after acquiring nuclear power generation technology
2. Be part of a large alliance of nations

Bangladesh needs to minimize its economic integration and dependence with India and increase its economic integration with these allied nations. That is the only long term way to defeat India's dream of hegemony in South Asia and Bangladesh.

Of course BD can not realistically match India dollar for dollar and bullet by bullet.

My point is that BD will get relatively much more stronger to India as BD finally recovers from it's history.

India is not a very strong country anyway for it's size and a stronger BD will be just one more headache for the wannabe hegemon.

I think there is a realistic chance of a BD that is a lot more prosperous than India(up to 2x in GDP/capita), in the future just like Sri Lanka is now so that would make BD even more powerful relative to India.

 

[Zabaniyah]

Of course BD can not realistically match India dollar for dollar and bullet by bullet.

My point is that BD will get relatively much more stronger to India as BD finally recovers from it's history.

India is not a very strong country anyway for it's size and a stronger BD will be just one more headache for the wannabe hegemon.

I think there is a realistic chance of a BD that is a lot more prosperous than India(up to 2x in GDP/capita), in the future just like Sri Lanka is now so that would make BD even more powerful relative to India.

It'll take time, no doubt. Bangladesh has potential.

We just need to get rid of those "people" if you know what I mean. But to be honest, if there'd be any south Asian country that'd become developed, that'd be Ceylon.

 

[Saiful Islam]

At the end of the day, my people got their freedom, it was the qadr of Allah SWT. Sooner or later Bangladesh would have gained independence, like some of you said India speeded up the process, BUT I do not thank India, a mushreek, Israel affiliated country.

 

[Bang Galore]

The more pertinent question is why was China able to grow at 10% a year for last 3 decades and India can only manage 6-7%?

Simply India is not governed efficiently - my theory is that it is a mish-mash of different ethnicities and there is
no real "common-good" that all Indians can agree on.

Most Indians would agree that India is not governed effectively. The reason is not as simple as you suggest, the Chinese people don't get a vote, Indians do and like all voters don't take a long term view of things. That is simply one of the issues with democracy but it is not relevant to this discussion unless BD regularly starts to post double digit growth.

Indian military is about as powerful as it will get relative to BD

BD, on the other hand, is now in a position that it can spend sufficient resources that it can be much more
than a push-over for India

BD is not considered a threat, it's military strength is not relevant. If considered one, the response will be different & contrary to your belief, the sheer size of India vis-a-vis BD makes it a formidable opponent.

Let me use statistics to illustrate this point:

http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/weo/2013/02/weodata/weorept.aspx?sy=2003&ey=2013&scsm=1&ssd=1&sort=country&ds=.&br=1&pr1.x=34&pr1.y=9&c=513,534&s=NGDPD,GGX_NGDP&grp=0&a=

In 2003, BD had an economy of 55 billion dollars and total government spending was 14% of GDP. That means that
that the BD government spent 7.7 billion dollars in 2003
In 2013, BD had an economy of 140 billion dollars, actually it is really over 150 billion dollars when the 2005 base
year is taken into account, and total government spending is set to be 17% of GDP. That means that
the BD government should spent 24 billion dollars

You see, in a decade BD government spending has gone up by 200% or tripled.

In 2003, India had an economy of 620 billion dollars and total government spending was 29% of GDP. That means that that the Indian government spent 176 billion dollars in 2003
In 2013, India had an economy of 1760 billion dollars, and total government spending is set to be 28% of GDP. That means that that the Indian government should spent 448 billion dollars

You see, in a decade Indian government spending has gone up by 154%

So BD government has 200% more to spend and the Indian government has only 154% more to spend from 10 years ago. Even keeping the same proportion of government spending on defence, BD will gain relatively more than
India.

BD still is spending maybe 1/3rd less of it's GDP on defence as India does and so the scope is there for BD to rachet up military spending in the future more than India

More fuzzy logic. Percentages are not relevant when we are talking about military strength, the total outlay is what is important. BD can only ratchet up military spending in percentage terms, will never be able to match India in actual outlay. That disparity is huge & will get even more pronounced.

 

[Sriram]

dumbest thread in this forum ever.... India a friend.....hilarious

True... I find that almost insulting

 

[my2cents]

@Loki

The history of proxy warfare between India and Pakistan goes back to the Kashmir invasion and it will remain that way. We are a small state, if we don't keep them in check, it would mean giving in to their hegemonic control that they so crave to have.

While Sri Lanka and Pakistan has stood against the Indian desire for control of S.Asia, it has become vital for Bangladesh as a major nation in S.Asia to do the same. If they decide to do that Pakistanis even today are more likely to stand with you than with an Indian.

Just big words and no substance. If proxy war is going to make us notice you, yes we noticed you alright. But you will always remain an irritant and we made sure that you are not going to change our way of life by liberating your other half. Go sulk in your cave and see your dear friends Sri Lanka or Bangladesh for that matter will endorse your ways.

 

[UKBengali]

More fuzzy logic. Percentages are not relevant when we are talking about military strength, the total outlay is what is important. BD can only ratchet up military spending in percentage terms, will never be able to match India in actual outlay. That disparity is huge & will get even more pronounced.

Your analytical abilities think that I am talking about BD matching India dollar for dollar and bullet for bullet.

All I am talking about is RELATIVE strength.

I guess that you do not want to argue with numbers as like a lot of people on this forum you simply
have no clue about mathematics and statistics and can only talk with words

The numbers PROVE that BD is gaining relative to India.

The only reason why Indian GDP/capita is slightly higher than BD now is due to the extra 24 year head-start that
it had in independence.

The chances are that over the next few decades that BD will become a wealthier country than India. I simply cannot
fathom a multi-ethnic state ever matching a unitary one for economic development.

 

[Bang Galore]

Your analytical abilities think that I am talking about BD matching India dollar for dollar and bullet for bullet.

All I am talking about is RELATIVE strength.

I guess that you do not want to argue with numbers as like a lot of people on this forum you simply
have no clue about mathematics and statistics and can only talk with words

The numbers PROVE that BD is gaining relative to India.

The only reason why Indian GDP/capita is slightly higher than BD now is due to the extra 24 year head-start that
it had in independence.

The chances are that over the next few decades that BD will become a wealthier country than India. I simply cannot
fathom a multi-ethnic state ever matching a unitary one for economic development.

Forget about my analytical abilities, be happy that you don't have to worry about that. There is someone utterly clueless about how military strength works & it's not me. Whether or not there is a chance that BD will become a wealthier nation (I'm assuming you mean per capita), it doesn't change much on military balance. Singapore is wealthier than China, does not mean it can be a military match. Your own figures show it if you have the capacity to comprehend it.

In 2003, BD had an economy of 55 billion dollars and total government spending was 14% of GDP. That means that
that the BD government spent 7.7 billion dollars in 2003
In 2013, BD had an economy of 140 billion dollars, actually it is really over 150 billion dollars when the 2005 base
year is taken into account, and total government spending is set to be 17% of GDP. That means that
the BD government should spent 24 billion dollars

You see, in a decade BD government spending has gone up by 200% or tripled.

In 2003, India had an economy of 620 billion dollars and total government spending was 29% of GDP. That means that that the Indian government spent 176 billion dollars in 2003
In 2013, India had an economy of 1760 billion dollars, and total government spending is set to be 28% of GDP. That means that that the Indian government should spent 448 billion dollars

The figures you quote suggest that GoB had an increase in its budgetary allocation (from 2003 to 2013) of16.3 billion dollars.. During the same period, you say that India has a budgetary difference of 272 billion dollars. Military strength will be decided by the sheer volume of weaponry available & there is no way with that kind of a difference in funds, that BD will ever pose a serious threat.

As for your thesis on multi-ethnic states being inherently less capable, keep telling yourself that. Whatever floats your boat. Move on.