One man 'Putin': One 'Russian Force' against 30 EU-NATO States, US, Ukraine & Rest of World Allies| One aim: Fight Hybrid-Covert-Direct War alone|Hero

[Apollon]

Many a time space travelers from the above-standard Europe use the machinery built by the same below-standard Russia and go stay in the International Space Station largely built by below-standard Russia.

ISS was largely build by ESA and NASA. Most modules came up with Spaceshuttle

 

[jamahir]

ISS was largely build by ESA and NASA. Most modules came up with Spaceshuttle

Nevetheless the idea of the modular space station was from the USSR and the ISS was built by Russia's expertise.

 

[Apollon]

Nevetheless the idea of the modular space station was from the USSR and the ISS was built by Russia's expertise.

That is wrong as well. The idea was proposed by Wernher von Braun.

 

[jamahir]

That is wrong as well. The idea was proposed by Wernher von Braun.

Source please. And why didn't NASA follow the idea then ?

 

[Apollon]

Source please. And why didn't NASA follow the idea then ?

It did. Even did first connection in space.

He developed a circular, modular system. The modular concept survived

 

[Foinikas]

Well, North Korea is not a true Communistic society because not only is there a party system ( as against Communism's desire for the people to govern themselves directly ) the country is ruled by a family chain from grandfather to grandson which against is against Communist principles. But the country at least has Socialist principles, is a vehement opponent of Western Capitalist imperialism and will be an active part of a global people's movement in the near-future where people will call for a borderless humanity where the concept of Nation State has been abolished, militaries have been disbanded and a progressive, Communist political and socio-economic system will be applied to bring serenity and harmony within human society and humanity's relationship with Nature.

Juche ideology

 

[-=virus=-]

One man 'Putin': One 'Russian Force' against covert 30 EU-NATO Countries, USA & rest of World Allies | One Cause, Fighting Hybrid War alone

lol, I read that in movie guy voice. "this summer..."

 

[LakeHawk180]

Nevetheless the idea of the modular space station was from the USSR and the ISS was built by Russia's expertise.

Have you heard of Skylab?

 

[jamahir]

Even did first connection in space.

OK, accepted. However :

The Soviets carried out the first automated, uncrewed docking between Cosmos 186 and Cosmos 188 on October 30, 1967.

This was just one year after :

The first docking of two spacecraft was achieved on March 16, 1966 when Gemini 8, under the command of Neil Armstrong, rendezvoused and docked with an uncrewed Agena Target Vehicle.

He developed a circular, modular system. The modular concept survived

How do you know that the USSR wasn't thinking of modular space stations early on as well because it was the Mir which was the first modular space station ?

As for circular modular system why didn't that translate into an actual product in the "prosperous" USA ?

Juche ideology

I don't know much about Juche except that it calls for self-reliance and self-sufficiency. What else is your reference to it ?

Have you heard of Skylab?

Yes I have heard about the Skylab but we are talking about modular space stations. Skylab wasn't even the first space station. The first was the USSR's Salyut launched in 1971.

 

[Apollon]

OK, accepted. However :

This was just one year after :





How do you know that the USSR wasn't thinking of modular space stations early on as well because it was the Mir which was the first modular space station ?

As for circular modular system why didn't that translate into an actual product in the "prosperous" USA ?



I don't know much about Juche except that it calls for self-reliance and self-sufficiency. What else is your reference to it ?



Yes I have heard about the Skylab but we are talking about modular space stations. Skylab wasn't even the first space station. The first was the USSR's Salyut launched in 1971.

Because USSR lacked Wernher von Braun. They had german papers but lacked the genius. Thats why USA spaceprogram suceeded where Russia failed.

A circular rotating spacestation has many advantages but is very difficult to construct.

 

[jamahir]

Because USSR lacked Wernher von Braun. They had german papers but lacked the genius. Thats why USA spaceprogram suceeded where Russia failed.

The genius was Von Braun who was a German. Even "lacking" him the USSR succeeded much. From the first human in space to the first space station to being the most experienced in space operations. In the 1950s the USSR was studying a human mission to Mars involving a six-member one year stay there to be realized by the mid-70s. From this article :

Russian manned Mars expedition. Study 1956. This first serious examination in the Soviet Union of manned flight to Mars was made by M Tikhonravov.
AKA: Martian Piloted Complex. Status: Study 1956. Gross mass: 1,630,000 kg (3,590,000 lb). Specific impulse: 310 s.

His Martian Piloted Complex (MPK) would have a mass of 1,630 metric tons and land a crew on Mars on a 30-month expedition.

In Korolev's defense of the N1 draft project in July 1962 he stated that he first sketched out the N1 design in 1956-1957. The requirement at that time was to support a large manned expedition to Mars. This first serious examination in the Soviet Union of manned flight to Mars was initiated by M Tikhonravov's section of Korolev's OKB-1. The study group first considered a complete manned expedition to Mars. This followed the classic scenario worked out by Von Braun's group in their Mars Project of 1948. The Martian Piloted Complex would be assembled in low earth orbit. Using conventional liquid propellants, it would fly a Hohmann trajectory, enter Martian orbit, and a landing craft would descend to the surface. After just over a year of surface exploration, the crew would return to earth. It was calculated that the initial mass of the MPK would be 1,630 metric tons, and a re-entry vehicle of only 15 metric tons could be returned to earth at the end of the 30 month mission. At the planned N1 payload mass of 75 to 85 metric tons, it would take 20 to 25 N1 launches to assemble the MPK.

MPK Mission Summary:

• Summary: First Soviet study for a manned Mars expedition.
• Propulsion: LOX/Kerosene
• Braking at Mars: propulsive
• Mission Type: conjunction
• Split or All-Up: all up
• ISRU: no ISRU
• Launch Year: 1975
• Crew: 6
• Outbound time-days: 270
• Mars Stay Time-days: 360
• Return Time-days: 270
• Total Mission Time-days: 900
• Total Payload Required in Low Earth Orbit-metric tons: 1360
• Mass per crew-metric tons: 226
• Launch Vehicle Payload to LEO-metric tons: 75
• Number of Launches Required to Assemble Payload in Low Earth Orbit: 25
• Launch Vehicle: N1

---

Family: Mars Expeditions. Country: Russia. Launch Vehicles: Mars tactical rocket, N1, N1 1969. Propellants: Lox/Kerosene. Agency: Korolev bureau. Bibliography: 206.

---

---

1956 During the Year - .

• Martian Piloted Complex (MPK) - . Nation: Russia. Related Persons: Hohmann, Korolev. Spacecraft Bus: TMK. Spacecraft: MPK.
  This first serious examination in the Soviet Union of manned flight to Mars was initiated by M Tikhonravov's section of Korolev's OKB-1. The Martian Piloted Complex (MPK), would be assembled in low earth orbit. Using conventional liquid propellants, it would fly a Hohmann trajectory, enter Martian orbit, and a landing craft would descend to the surface. After just over a year of surface exploration, the crew would return to earth. It was calculated that the initial mass of the MPK would be 1,630 tonnes, and a re-entry vehicle of only 15 tonnes could be returned to earth at the end of the 30 month mission. At the planned N1 payload mass of 75 to 85 tonnes, it would take 20 to 25 N1 launches to assemble the MPK.

I think the design was complex but it would have become simplified by the 70s.

A circular rotating spacestation has many advantages but is very difficult to construct.

But why was it difficult for the "prosperous" USA ?

 

[Apollon]

The genius was Von Braun who was a German. Even "lacking" him the USSR succeeded much. From the first human in space to the first space station to being the most experienced in space operations. In the 1950s the USSR was studying a human mission to Mars involving a six-member one year stay there to be realized by the mid-70s. From this article :

I think the design was complex but it would have become simplified by the 70s.



But why was it difficult for the "prosperous" USA ?

Russia never got powerful rocket engines. Their rockets have many weaker engines which are prone to fail. Saturn V had 5 engines where russian N1 had 28...all N1 exploded

Russia lost the space race in late 60th and never got back on track.

A rotating spacestation is still difficult even today. Its basicly the next level.

 

[jamahir]

Russia never got powerful rocket engines. Their rockets have many weaker engines which are prone to fail. Saturn V had 5 engines where russian N1 had 28...all N1 exploded

Firstly, it was the USSR not just Russia. Secondly, look at the configuration of the SpaceX Super Heavy / Starship complex :

Thirty-three sea-level variant Raptor engines will power the Super Heavy booster, while the Starship spacecraft contains six Raptor engines, three optimized for sea‑level and three optimized for vacuum.

The Super Heavy booster has five more engines than the N1 had. So SpaceX has come back to something the N1 had decades ago.

And contrary to your "Russia never having powerful rocket engines" Elon says that the Russian RD-180 engine is a very good engine. But as I understand one simplification in rocket engines is in using electric pumps instead of the chemical-reaction-based turbopumps and the first commercial rocket that uses this is the Electron from the company Rocket Lab and the engine is called Rutherford and is 3D printed. I believe the electric pump will be the method in the next generation of chemical propulsion rocket engines. But I wanted to counter your statement that Russian rocket engines are not good.

Russia lost the space race in late 60th and never got back on track.

How ?

A rotating spacestation is still difficult even today. Its basicly the next level.

So you say that rotating space station was difficult for "prosperous" USA but you also will discredit the USSR's human, year-long -stay-on-Mars mission that was planned for launch by the mid-1970s ?

 

[Foinikas]

I don't know much about Juche except that it calls for self-reliance and self-sufficiency. What else is your reference to it ?

Well basically the North Koreans and I think it was Kim Jong-Il,decided to make their own communist ideology,different from Marxism-Leninism,Stalinism and Maoism,although basically it has many elements of those ideologies and theories,but they added some traditional Korean and their own stuff in to make something a bit different and say it's a distinct ideology. I think it's an immitation of Stalinism,but hey,who can argue with the Dear Leader? If he says jump,they have to ask how high.

 

[Apollon]

Firstly, it was the USSR not just Russia. Secondly, look at the configuration of the SpaceX Super Heavy / Starship complex :

The Super Heavy booster has five more engines than the N1 had. So SpaceX has come back to something the N1 had decades ago.

And contrary to your "Russia never having powerful rocket engines" Elon says that the Russian RD-180 engine is a very good engine. But as I understand one simplification in rocket engines is in using electric pumps instead of the chemical-reaction-based turbopumps and the first commercial rocket that uses this is the Electron from the company Rocket Lab and the engine is called Rutherford and is 3D printed. I believe the electric pump will be the method in the next generation of chemical propulsion rocket engines. But I wanted to counter your statement that Russian rocket engines are not good.



How ?



So you say that rotating space station was difficult for "prosperous" USA but you also will discredit the USSR's human, year-long -stay-on-Mars mission that was planned for launch by the mid-1970s ?

Russia did not even land rovers on mars. As for engines, back then there were much more moving parts. That makes it more possible to break. Having 5 super powerful engines was less risky in those times than 28 less powerful. You know what i mean?