New Version of JF-17 (JF-18)

[All-Green]

I read the title and hoped to discover a new design concept but it is the same old JF-17 wish list.

Now i completely understand that we are all excited and want to improve the quality of this plane but we are really not being productive here in expecting major design changes in a small and agile fighter which is supposed to be an easy to maintain, high operational readiness and cost effective design concept.
JF-17 is a fighter which can be operated from small airbases with small maintenance teams to support it and this shall keep it operational even in face of enemy air superiority and loss of any major bases.

Nothing wrong with another design but it should not be called an upgraded JF-17 because it shall really deviate from the lower cost, ease of maintenance and high value for money we have sought in JF-17.

We should at least give JF-17 a chance before deliberating upon the twin engine concept, changed tail configuration, enhanced length etc.

I am sure once the JF-17 squadron is fully operational and PAF have additional parameters available for study they can make enhancements that can further optimize the JF-17 platform into something much more potent.
Mind you, even in its current configuration it is a good bird.

JF-17 needs to be inducted in large numbers and high cost changes would really dictate otherwise.
JF-17 in its current form is quite advanced compared to what we have so why are we hesitant in accepting its basic credentials for what it is supposed to... the future workhorse of PAF!

I feel most of this has been discussed in JF-17 thread at length, maybe we should merge this in the JF-17 thread?

 

[Luftwaffe]

With respect i previously posted a post regarding JF-17 in JF-17 thread and i asked for input from Sir MuradK and MasterKhan and other respected senior members and i posted that JF-17 future version/block the feasible potent design will be based on F-16 Blk52+blk60 thought blk60 is more expected/ some input designs features from Gripen because the only design that appeals the needs of PAF..thought proposed twin tail design is not impossible but that also makes considerable time and program in future could delay due to design parameters related to a heavy twin tail Fighter Jet...i am hopeful Pakistan will put blk 60 F-16 in mind to base its JF-17 next block/version and will bring drastic changes to design and thus looks more feasible and a design that already matured and understood.

 

[Luftwaffe]

KTX1980 kid did you get a chunk of J-17 airframe in dinner?

 

[adnan1479]

This was the design of a future jf-17 which was sent to the PAF chief almost 10 years ago - - - Complete with a larger engine, dual missile launchers, conformal tanks, wingtip ECM pods, twin tail fins, IRST and full internal avionics.
The drawing below shows a notional future knife-fight with israeli f-15s over the golan heights. the picture is titled "Masters of Golan"
(I apologise for the poor quality but this is a photo of the drawing. the scanned image was too big to upload)

 

[Corzair]

You could always use paint.net or gimp to reduce the size of the scan
to something more manageble

Looks cool though

 

[Quwa]

Good stuff, I hope we one day see such a design roll out.

 

[SEAL]

For these changes and new projects, we need another factory like PAC and also need huge amount of money.
i mean
PAC: is doin its job
PAC(1): lets say navel version of JF-17 (F-18hornet type) or stealth bomberz.

 

[Manticore]

With respect i previously posted a post regarding JF-17 in JF-17 thread and i asked for input from Sir MurakK and MasterKhan and other respected senior members and i posted that JF-17 future version/block the feasible potent design will be based on F-16 Blk52+blk60 thought blk60 is more expected/ some input designs features from Gripen because the only design that appeals the needs of PAF..thought proposed twin tail design is not impossible but that also makes considerable time and program in future could delay due to design parameters related to a heavy twin tail Fighter Jet...i am hopeful Pakistan will put blk 60 F-16 in mind to base its JF-17 next block/version and will bring drastic changes to design and thus looks more feasible and a design that already matured and understood.

.
i completely agree... if jf17 can go upto the specs of block 52 or even touch block60 than it is a great feat in itself.. remember the j10 is still not equevalent to block60 yet.
...
the benchmark has always been f16 because of its design/manouverability / less maintance/1engine/ paf's 30 year experience with it etc.

...

for a double enjined /5th gen jet ,the design has to be radicly differernt.. you cant make a fifth generation jet out of jf17 with just adding twin engines and someother tweaks.

Fot that reason [5th gen requirement]we can get into the jxx programme..

...
remember twin enjines have there own problems
as they would affect the number of jet u can buy by 50percent...
the maintainance nightmers are another thing[ask india for that matter]

... i dont want to sound sarcastic but if paf double enjine white elephant jets gets downed it would have more devestating affects in terms of both quality and quantity[as u would buy less of other multirole jets and divert all your expenses for the double enjined jet]

a balance is required in terms of lightweight - medium - heavy category jets

 

[Myth_buster_1]

This was the design of a future jf-17 which was sent to the PAF chief almost 10 years ago - - - Complete with a larger engine, dual missile launchers, conformal tanks, wingtip ECM pods, twin tail fins, IRST and full internal avionics.
The drawing below shows a notional future knife-fight with israeli f-15s over the golan heights. the picture is titled "Masters of Golan"
(I apologise for the poor quality but this is a photo of the drawing. the scanned image was too big to upload)

this is nothing but fanboy art and this type of crap are never presented to officials i mean come on a IDAF F-15 when you are presenting a concept to PAF top brass??
a rip off of JF-17 PT-1 (which is really bad).
it should have had 4 hard points on each sides, DSI, LRX, J-10b type nose, and hornet type slanted rudder (notice the rudders are way too much slanted on the painting).

 

[mughaljee]

Brothers, Fellows, Yaar,
listen ,
I am also keen to make more advance rather then J-17. OK till now i know we can not yet built a new one, but we can now think about a new one. Those ideas will be helpful for the builders.
i also believe they also read this forum.


always regards

 

[Zarbe Momin]

If responsible people read this forum then upgrades should be on JF-17 in form of more hard points, avonics, CFT and engin.

 

[Zarbe Momin]

Eurojet EJ200 is the best option for JF-17 if Eurojet Turbo GmbH and concerned countries ready to sell to Pakistan.

 

[Arsalan]

well you people are talking about a completely nwe plane. this is not going to happen that easily in the current and i think we dont need it at present.

the upgraded F16 along with the J10z will be good enough

for the JF17 a few upgrades may be both helpfull nad possible.
first of all it is built keeping in mind the possibilities for upgrades, a more poerfull engine to increase its spped and use of more compositee materials in the air frame seems to be the best possible upgrades for the block 2

for big leap forward we may try it in five to ten years, using the experience of JF17 and building an entirely new plane!!

what do you people suggest!

 

[Luftwaffe]

Exactly my point Antibody if US is stretching its F-16 to block 60/70 proposed for IN then i am sure in a few years time we can bring out JF-17s to that level rather then completely changing its outfit delaying and other problems associated with Twin tail twin engine...Lets leave that to JXX..if F-16 blk 52+ can give hard time to SU-30s i believe block60+ F-16s based JF-17 can neutralized it completely design+ superior avionics/radar/better engine..

 

[Manticore]

personally i think paf would upgrade 200 jf17block2 to somewhere inbetween f16 block40/52.. and keep only this block2 jf17 and sell block1jf17 to sudan/somalia whatever...
.
fc20 i think is a better design and i think paf would like to upgrade it and take its number higher rather than investing and radically changing jf17 design.
.
.
50jf17 block1.. 200jf17 block2...60f16[block 40-52].... rest fc20s.... perhaps add 2squadrond of rafale if without it the french dont offer the jf17upgrades