Myanmar strikes kill 32, mostly women and children: UN

[Sehnsucht]

there is clear opportunity cost to fighting Myanmar which is why it has not happened

Unlike Myanmar, Bangladesh has always focused on economic development instead of focusing on military. Our defense spending to GDP ratio is the smallest in the region at barely 1.2%.
This means we have ample room to rapidly increase military spending & still sustain our nation.
The same can't be said for Myanmar, as they already spend more than twice the percentage of GDP compared to Bangladesh, which is unsustainable for a war-torn, poverty-stricken country.
Unlike us,it is virtually impossible for them to ramp up defense spending without suffering serious economic consequences.In fact, if you'll notice, their military budget has been actually decreasing in the recent years.

Yup.

In all honesty, its unfortunate.

If BD were to engage in an "arms race" with Myanmar, they will both be losers.

Enriching those outside the region at the detriment of the common people in both nations.

But what Myanmar did was undeniably hostile.

And for that Bangladesh needs to address its military at this point unless there is regime change next door.

I guess one thing is clear, Bangladesh's friendship to all malice to none approach should no longer be valid.

I have posted this in earlier thread.I think it's relevant to this topic.

We have focused for far too long on the economy and only the economy.That's why militarily we don't have many cards to play without losing what we have achieved so far.In a war, our infrastructure, ports and centres of commerce would be the first thing to be targeted and we have done next to nothing so far to adequately protect them.So, now that our leaders have gotten a reality check, we're playing catch up with the rest of the region regarding military & firepower.Even though we could have at least ensured military superiority over at least Myanmar considering our economy that's more than 4X bigger.

It was a glaring mistake on the part of our civilian and military policymakers. "Friendship to all & malice to none" is a bullshit philosophy that no longer works in the present world.But what is done is done.

The good thing is, government & military top brass seem to have come to their senses after the Rohingya debacle.
That's why you see BA getting Kasirga MLRS & SAM system from Turkey, Apaches fom USA.BN taking measures to build warships ranging from LPCs to semi stealth corvettes to frigates and also starting the process to make anti ship missiles in house.BAF going for jets like EFT and Rafale.
Most importantly, they're diversifying their sources.No longer it is a free lunch for China & Russia.All three branches are now pivoting toward Western equipments, for better or worse.
These were unthinkable just a few years ago.

You'll also have to remember, geographically we're in an unfavorable position in the region.We don't have any borders with a reliable ally or a Muslim country.Both of our neighbours are threats to our sovereignty.Except for the sea in one side, we're effectively surrounded by enemies on all sides.

So we'll have to wait.We'll have to be patient, bide our time and play our cards right.It might seem like cowardice to some and leave bitter taste in the mouth for others.But it's the price we'll have to pay in order to survive in this hostile neighborhood surrounded by vultures.

As the situation is right now, in a war, Bangladesh has much more to lose than Myanmar.

 

[vishwambhar]

There is nothing Bangladesh can do to threaten Myanmar. The border with Myanmar is 270 km long. It is mountainous. It is easy to defend the border against numerically superior force.

Wars are expensive. it is not easy to conduct them

While I don't appreciate actions of Myanmar which is killing of women and children but why Myanmar needs to defend from Bangladesh in that 270 km mountains border???

In fact if war happens Myanmar with superior army and airforce will have a turkey shoot over Bangladesh.....now due to Corona issues Bangladesh will see further delays in modernization of its armed forces..... Myanmar too may suffer with delays but for NOW situation they are armed to teeth...

 

[UKBengali]

While I don't appreciate actions of Myanmar which is killing of women and children but why Myanmar needs to defend from Bangladesh in that 270 km mountains border???

In fact if war happens Myanmar with superior army and airforce will have a turkey shoot over Bangladesh.....now due to Corona issues Bangladesh will see further delays in modernization of its armed forces..... Myanmar too may suffer with delays but for NOW situation they are armed to teeth...

Superior army?

 

[vishwambhar]

Superior army?

Yes your only advantage was in navy and that too is now in favor of Myanmar with Kilo.... and once Myanmar destroys your vital targets such as military bases, industrial complex your navy will be helpless without supplies.....

 

[leonblack08]

Yup.

In all honesty, its unfortunate.

If BD were to engage in an "arms race" with Myanmar, they will both be losers.

Enriching those outside the region at the detriment of the common people in both nations.

But what Myanmar did was undeniably hostile.

And for that Bangladesh needs to address its military at this point unless there is regime change next door.

I guess one thing is clear, Bangladesh's friendship to all malice to none approach should no longer be valid.

In the 80s, Bangladesh actually had a clear upper hand with latest hardwares purchased from China by the Ershad government. The standoff at that time prevented mass rohingya exodus like the one in 2015. Because the Burmese had to stand down.

Subsequent democratic governments with their meek foreign policy completely neglected the armed forces procurement. and eventually the Burmese gained an upper hand in terms of hardware. For decades, our main tanks, frigates were the ones purchased during the Ershad era. Whereas the Burmese continued to pile up.

The good news is, we started seeing a resurgence since the 2007 military caretaker govt. The 2015 standoff was a perfect wake up call and we have seen some reactionary measures after that.

Bangladesh doesn't need to get into an arms race. But at the Very least, we need to spend enough to protect our economic interests.

You can't afford to be friendly in a neighborhood of crazies.

Yes your only advantage was in navy and that too is now in favor of Myanmar with Kilo.... and once Myanmar destroys your vital targets such as military bases, industrial complex your navy will be helpless without supplies.....

You should write a novel on all your fantasies regarding Bangladesh.

Be sure to include a chapter on "strategic allies".

 

[Homo Sapiens]

It was a glaring mistake on the part of our civilian and military policymakers. "Friendship to all & malice to none" is a bullshit philosophy that no longer works in the present world.But what is done is done.

Those bozos thought, Bangladesh is just like another Switzerland surrounded by European Union.

geographically we're in an unfavorable position in the region.We don't have any borders with a reliable ally or a Muslim country.Both of our neighbours are threats to our sovereignty.Except for the sea in one side, we're effectively surrounded by enemies on all sides.

This is what I am also saying for a long time, our geography do not allow us to cultivate the feminine national characters we are now cultivating. I do not know whether it is the result of 30 years long female lead rule we are undergoing which is unique in the world. Bangladesh seems like an anomaly among the Muslim countries. Almost all the Muslim countries in the world has a muscular image, they are militarily strong relative to their size and has an active foreign policy. It is only Bangladesh, the country with 3rd largest Muslim population and 8th largest economy among the Muslim world, playing a weakling. We have a bullsh!t motto regularly lip serviced by our leaders, ''friendship to all, malice to none.'' As if Bangladesh is an EU country!

We need a right balance between economic development and military spending. High military spending is not a drag on economic development if macro-economic policy remain robust. South Korea, Taiwan, Singapore rapidly developed despite high military spending because their macro-economic policy was sound. Vietnam is also following the same path, high GDP growth and high military spending.

 

[Homo Sapiens]

In fact if war happens Myanmar with superior army and airforce will have a turkey shoot over Bangladesh.....now due to Corona issues Bangladesh will see further delays in modernization of its armed forces..... Myanmar too may suffer with delays but for NOW situation they are armed to teeth...

Yes your only advantage was in navy and that too is now in favor of Myanmar with Kilo.... and once Myanmar destroys your vital targets such as military bases, industrial complex your navy will be helpless without supplies.....

Myanmar does not have superior army than Bangladesh. Burmese army has more foot soldiers apparently(many of them are forcefully recruited including a large percentage of child soldiers), but their level of professional training is questionable, poorly equipped with mostly obsolete weapons. Moreover, most of them are engaged in quelling dozens of ethnic rebellions all over Myanmar where they suffers heavy casualties against rag-tag militias. It is yet to be seen, how effective that army would be against a conventional force half the size, yet relatively superior in training and equipments. Bangladesh army also are not engaged in suppressing any internal rebellion, so they would get a free hand to resist Burmese forces.

Myanmar also does not have edge over Bangladesh in navy, despite acquiring a rust bucket kilo sub from India. That rust bucket is even inferior in quality that BN's refurbished Ming class Submarine. Bangladesh also has better surface fleets.

Now, air force is the one where Myanmar has a clear edge over Bangladesh. And it will give Myanmar an initial success in case of any hypothetical sudden military hostility with Bangladesh. But if the conflict drags on like Iraq-Iran war, then Myanmar will start loosing and even may teared up into multiple parts due to re-energized ethnic insurgency getting a boost from conventional war.

 

[vishwambhar]

Myanmar does not have superior army than Bangladesh. Burmese army has more foot soldiers apparently(many of them are forcefully recruited including a large percentage of child soldiers), but their level of professional training is questionable, poorly equipped with mostly obsolete weapons. Moreover, most of them are engaged in quelling dozens of ethnic rebellions all over Myanmar where they suffers heavy casualties against rag-tag militias. It is yet to be seen, how effective that army would be against a conventional force half the size, yet relatively superior in training and equipments. Bangladesh army also do not engaged in suppressing any internal rebellion, so they would get a free hand to resist Burmese forces.

Myanmar also do not have edge over Bangladesh in navy, despite acquiring a rust bucket kilo sub from India. That rust bucket is even inferior in quality that BN's refurbished Ming class Submarine. Bangladesh also has better surface fleets.

Now, air force is the one where Myanmar has a clear edge over Bangladesh. And it will give Myanmar an initial success in case of any hypothetical sudden military hostility with Bangladesh. But if the conflict drags on like Iraq-Iran war, then Myanmar will start loosing and even may teared up into multiple parts due to re-energized ethnic insurgency getting a boost from conventional war.

The rust bucket Kilo is a front runner submarine of Indian navy which is one of the most powerful navies in Asia....

The rust bucket submarine Kilo can fire Klub S missiles and will start eating up Bangladesh superior surface fleet in no time once deployed....

The rust bucket submarine Kilo is so deadly that even NATO has given it a codename BLACKHOLE

Bangladesh submarines though silent are not equipped with cruise missiles.... what's the use when you can only hide silently but unable to cause a dent in enemy navy??? Once Bangladesh navy badly damaged and Myanmar airforce takes out Bangladesh airforce defending mountainous borders from BD army advance will be very easy task for Myanmar army....

 

[Homo Sapiens]

The rust bucket Kilo is a front runner submarine of Indian navy which is one of the most powerful navies in Asia....

The rust bucket submarine Kilo can fire Klub S missiles and will start eating up Bangladesh superior surface fleet in no time once deployed....

The rust bucket submarine Kilo is so deadly that even NATO has given it a codename BLACKHOLE

Bangladesh submarines though silent are not equipped with cruise missiles.... what's the use when you can only hide silently but unable to cause a dent in enemy navy??? Once Bangladesh navy badly damaged and Myanmar airforce takes out Bangladesh airforce defending mountainous borders from BD army advance will be very easy task for Myanmar army....

We have dedicated anti-Submarine helicopters to take care of that rust bucket. One single rust bucket sub can not game change the entire war theater.
@Ronin

 

[Sharma Ji]

How and from where are they sourcing arms in the Rakhine/Arakan region ?

 

[UKBengali]

Does BD even need "high" military spending when it is facing off a country 5 times poorer?

Currently BD spends 1.5% of GDP(when arms imports are taken into account) on defence and even this level and planned acquisitions would make BD military in all sectors(air-land-sea-underwater) superior to the Barmans in just 5 years.

The only question is just how much more powerful BD wants to become over this impoverished, multi-ethnic mess of a state? If it wants to sort out the Rohingya issue favourable to it then it needs to increase this amount quickly to say maybe 2%. As otherwise it's only option is to keep the Rohingya forever.

 

[LeGenD]

Thread moved to appropriate section.

 

[ebr77]

Does BD even need "high" military spending when it is facing off a country 5 times poorer?

Currently BD spends 1.5% of GDP(when arms imports are taken into account) on defence and even this level and planned acquisitions would make BD military in all sectors(air-land-sea-underwater) superior to the Barmans in just 5 years.

The only question is just how much more powerful BD wants to become over this impoverished, multi-ethnic mess of a state? If it wants to sort out the Rohingya issue favourable to it then it needs to increase this amount quickly to say maybe 2%. As otherwise it's only option is to keep the Rohingya forever.

May be we could keep them until we find a solution but until then let's make them productive . Let's use these readymade labors . This way they can earn and who knows maybe one day become something .
And of course we can use this chip in world forum and get many benefits . Such as trade preferences , discount on weapons . Etc

 

[donkeykong]

The Chinese United Wa State Military is in Burma. They are allied with the Myanmar government.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Wa_State_Army

China gives more military aid to Wa State army than Myanmar itself

 

[Tagaung]

Bombing campaign with airforce.

There are plenty of targets like power stations that BAF could take out if it had the capability.

Have the capability to make Yangon go dark and the savages would stop

Dear Idiot,

To do a bombing campaign, one has to have a bomber . not only that, one might need at least 1 advenced squardon of fighters for escort.

Bangladesh has neither of those. BAF has no bomber and only 8 outdated mig-29s.