Musharraf 're-arrested' over Lal Masjid operation.

[SQ8]

a strange thing as the guy musharraf upholded the constitution more so and strengthened democracy by freeing the media, by introducing the local government its strange but true dear

technically musharraf was appointed by the civilian government so musharraf decisions do represent 140 million pakistanis and time proved it as well

musharraf took action when shareef abandoned the constitution and ordered to kill musharraf by not allowing his pane to land in Pakistan, this was the blunder made by nawaz shareef and not Musharraf so i don't hold against musharraf for his actions at all

it was the need of time and the economy was sinking too just like today


so in short musharraf's decision got more approval of the pakistanis then say sharif's deciions now a day

Umm, NO. He was not appointed Chief executive by the people of Pakistan. Wrong approach.

His stopping Nawaz Sharif's dream of becoming Ameer-ul-Momineen may have been ethically correct until he kept the powers. Had he left right after deposing Sharif and announcing elections. One could say he was a moral icon.. but his stay, plunging us into the WoT without consulting, and the farce referendum of 2002 have him no better than NS.

The only way he will redeem himself is to stay and fight his trials to walk free. Will NS and the CJ allow that? Will it lead to a clash with the Army again? Only time will tell.

 

[batmannow]

Umm, NO. He was not appointed Chief executive by the people of Pakistan. Wrong approach.

His stopping Nawaz Sharif's dream of becoming Ameer-ul-Momineen may have been ethically correct until he kept the powers. Had he left right after deposing Sharif and announcing elections. One could say he was a moral icon.. but his stay, plunging us into the WoT without consulting, and the farce referendum of 2002 have him no better than NS.

The only way he will redeem himself is to stay and fight his trials to walk free. Will NS and the CJ allow that? Will it lead to a clash with the Army again? Only time will tell.

3rd grade pakistani politicians, & 3rd grade damocratic suppoters?
with 3rd grade meaning less political correctionists?
what ever you hve written in your post seems like, god has spoken his words?
& by not lunching the democracy after deposing NS was his only sin?
while peoples of pakistan were distributing sweets on the streets, in reality?
considering the situation after the takeover, he done the right thing , showing pakistanis that, this country canbe run by, not going crouptly democratic, giving them the confidence that they can live further?
but as usual you go offtopic!
its just democracy phobia, inside your middle class mind? even though living in a constitution less country, which accepts everything as its constitution said, by the QUEEN?
you are just inspired , because of thier social system, which is so dreamy?
come back to topic, instead of bieng gods voice & teaching the rullers how to rule, jst pay attention to your studies, get a degree to get a high payed job, is that what,s the end you are heading for, while telling others what the mistakes they hve done, durring thier rule on a country? too funny, & funny?
let me tell you, it take a lot more then that, in PAKARMY specially joining the SSG ?
where from musharaf belongs?
those guys are prepared for the worst ever situation they can get, in defending thier country with minimam of money paid to them, but they still do that,cause the love the country?
even some of them, have to take the bullets & give up thier lives?
not becauss they were paid good?
the SSG shaheeds, in LAL MASJID are just there with thier, never ending commitment to show to the nation, whenever the enemy thinks they can takeover pakistan on the name of religion or damocrazy,SSG will punish them sending them to hell, they belong?
musharaf is proud , man being the top commander, he will remain higher in the hearts & minds of patriots!
forever!

 

[SQ8]

3rd grade pakistani politicians, & 3rd grade damocratic suppoters?
with 3rd grade meaning less political correctionists?
what ever you hve written in your post seems like, god has spoken his words?
& by not lunching the democracy after deposing NS was his only sin?
while peoples of pakistan were distributing sweets on the streets, in reality?
considering the situation after the takeover, he done the right thing , showing pakistanis that, this country canbe run by, not going crouptly democratic, giving them the confidence that they can live further?
but as usual you go offtopic!
its just democracy phobia, inside your middle class mind? even though living in a constitution less country, which accepts everything as its constitution said, by the QUEEN?
you are just inspired , because of thier social system, which is so dreamy?
come back to topic, instead of bieng gods voice & teaching the rullers how to rule, jst pay attention to your studies, get a degree to get a high payed job, is that what,s the end you are heading for, while telling others what the mistakes they hve done, durring thier rule on a country? too funny, & funny?
let me tell you, it take a lot more then that, in PAKARMY specially joining the SSG ?
where from musharaf belongs?
those guys are prepared for the worst ever situation they can get, in defending thier country with minimam of money paid to them, but they still do that,cause the love the country?
even some of them, have to take the bullets & give up thier lives?
not becauss they were paid good?
the SSG shaheeds, in LAL MASJID are just there with thier, never ending commitment to show to the nation, whenever the enemy thinks they can takeover pakistan on the name of religion or damocrazy,SSG will punish them sending them to hell, they belong?
musharaf is proud , man being the top commander, he will remain higher in the hearts & minds of patriots!
forever!

There was no distribution of sweets in mohallas or anything. Rather,people were just wondering what happens next. The only place where there were sweets being distributed were those who had a bone to pick with NS. The rest of your post is again gibberish that resembles somebody frothing away at their mouth rather than taking an objective look into the matter.

The right thing to do was to hold elections. The right thing to do , if there was a brave move to be done in honour and principle and not just to usurp power and sit on it; was to disqualify people accused of corruption and then hold elections. That would have ensured that certain big players dont come to power at all and would have one upped Gen Kakar's approach in dealing with NS.
But he did not, and moreover.. there are already whistle blowers who are pointing to his alleged planning of the coup months before to avoid embarrassment for his Hara Kiri of thousands of Pakistani troops in kargil.

 

[Thorough Pro]

and Fcuk you.

ok, go to hell and Keep getting slaughtered by your 'own people'.

 

[Capt.Popeye]

There was no distribution of sweets in mohallas or anything. Rather,people were just wondering what happens next. The only place where there were sweets being distributed were those who had a bone to pick with NS. The rest of your post is again gibberish that resembles somebody frothing away at their mouth rather than taking an objective look into the matter.

The right thing to do was to hold elections. The right thing to do , if there was a brave move to be done in honour and principle and not just to usurp power and sit on it; was to disqualify people accused of corruption and then hold elections. That would have ensured that certain big players dont come to power at all and would have one upped Gen Kakar's approach in dealing with NS.
But he did not, and moreover.. there are already whistle blowers who are pointing to his alleged planning of the coup months before to avoid embarrassment for his Hara Kiri of thousands of Pakistani troops in kargil.

Ahh, now you have put the 'finger on the facts'. (The misadventure at) Kargil actually cast the die for all the events that were visited upon the 'hapless awaam' of Pakistan. For the life of me; I wonder who did not see the unsuitability of Musharraff to progress beyond staff rank. Undoubtedly, he may have been a great subaltern; but to be even a half-way decent General, one has to have some intellect- not the skills of a "rodeo performer".

 

[Thorough Pro]

how desparate, what about mutual support of Mushy to MQM and vice versa? what happened on May 11? Didn't MQM carried out naked terrorism to support "Dictator Mushraff" against democratic struggle of chief Justice? you people suck because of cherry picking attitude.

so called champions of democracy


Zulfeqar ali bhutto with dictator

nawaz shareef with a dictator

imran khan with dictator

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

I am not sure under what rule is Musharaf being held , all he did was killed a Terrorist named Bugti and cleared up Terrorist that occupied a mosque by force with weapons


PS Imran Khan was not with Dictator , Imran Khan was with a General of Armed forces who offered him role as President but Imran Khan refused

Musharaf's achivements

a) Awacs deals
b) F22P Frigate deals
c) F16 planes new ones
d) JF17 thunder mile stones
e) eConomic boom

True visionary leader ... what if Imran and Musharaf had indeed joined forces for 20 years WHAT IF ...Zardari and Nawaz never happened


One Mistake : Yes he fired the Judges but they were disrupting government but it was blown out of proportions by PPP and PML and all political parties

 

[W.11]

how desparate, what about mutual support of Mushy to MQM and vice versa? what happened on May 11? Didn't MQM carried out naked terrorism to support "Dictator Mushraff" against democratic struggle of chief Justice? you people suck because of cherry picking attitude.

http://www.defence.pk/forums/national-political-issues/279034-shocking-12-may-2007-all-preplanned-listen.html

 

[T-123456]

I would like to point out that Pakistans economy was doing good in Musharraf era.

 

[T-123456]

Sifting again to pick out key words.

rawalpindi, sweets

Rawalpindi is a cantonment town and hence very pro military.. so it is quite logical that military men would be quite happy with the takeover(to the extent to distribute sweets).

There is no proof of Benazir being happy at Musharrafs move and her books reflect this. MQM are supported and linked with a class(Businessmen and Bureaucrats) that traditionally gets along well with the military(due to perceived benefits from their links) from the times of Ayub Khan. None of the wide spread firing, fireworks and sweets anywhere else as such in the country. Not in cheecho ki malian or in Quetta.

Now, NS coward, Big bang.. I assume its the Nuclear program. NS was/is very much a man of lesser gait who prefers the status quo(due to both monetary and legacy issues). Moreover, accounts from multiple personalities including clinton refer to severe threats given to him(and the nation of Pakistan) for testing a nuclear weapon. However, eventually after consulting and prodding he did "push the button" and not give in to American Pressure. By contrast, the Commando(from his own account) was scared out of "being bombed to the stone age" that he did not go beyond war games to consult any political party and ended up placing Pakistan on a platter to the US.

Kargil

The accounts of former military officers are enough in this case so it is better you argue with them. Regardless of whether Hamid Mir is a CIA/RAW/MOSSAD agent or not. I doubt that AVM Latif or Gen Talat are.

Fake system

The system has been around since 1973 and Gen Musharraf has taken oath to it. Decide on how you want to paint him.



It was undoubtedly. The same was in the Ayub era. Technocrats work, sound financial knowledge works. However, most of all; favourable international relations and massive concessions by the largest economic power knows the the United States goes a long way.

So,dont you think in the current situation a military man should rule Pakistan?
A patriot who thinks of the county first?

 

[SQ8]

So,dont you think in the current situation a military man should rule Pakistan?
A patriot who thinks of the county first?

The two are not exclusive nor is the first dependant on the second and vice versa.
Gen Yahya Khan was a military man for Pakistan yet his prime objective was to hold power and enjoy the perks of being the final "lord". There is little patriotism or anything in that motivation.

Moreover, many "patriotic" officers are actually sleeper assets in certain countries for other countries. In Pakistan's case the mysteries of Radars being shut down during the OBL raid or attacks not launched during the 65 war due to "delays" raise a lot of questions.

Pakistan should be ruled by a person who has come through a democratic process from the people. If Musharraf is able to do that, then he should rule Pakistan. Democratic process works and eventually does produce effective rulers provided that other ailments such as a feudal system are weeded out.
India is an excellent example of it regardless of their own complaints at their system.

 

[T-123456]

The two are not exclusive nor is the first dependant on the second and vice versa.
Gen Yahya Khan was a military man for Pakistan yet his prime objective was to hold power and enjoy the perks of being the final "lord". There is little patriotism or anything in that motivation.

Moreover, many "patriotic" officers are actually sleeper assets in certain countries for other countries. In Pakistan's case the mysteries of Radars being shut down during the OBL raid or attacks not launched during the 65 war due to "delays" raise a lot of questions.

I said patriot and not puppet.
You can try it with democracy in Pakistan but it wont work for now,what did the civil government achieve in those 5 year?
I'll answer:Nothing.

 

[Dillinger]

We would be naive or rather insecure to presume that the same does not happen in other military forces around the world including the US(recent spate of Generals being fired is evidence that they have their black sheep as well). However, their fellows are usually shunted around to(relatively) less important commands if certain personality traits are seen as civilian oversight does not leave room for too much of Yes-men and Pets. Here, these men regularly end up three stars.

America reminds me, enhh..why do they have ni-43 maps of Kashmir in their military archives?

Oh well, no system can be perfect. One can only hope to reduce the quantum of issues that may arise. Musharraf did show some intelligence in foreign affairs though, even with us after the Kargil fiasco was done and over with, no?

 

[SQ8]

I said patriot and not puppet.
You can try it with democracy in Pakistan but it wont work for now,what did the civil government achieve in those 5 year?
I'll answer:Nothing.

And I gave you the analogy of how a military man is not always a total patriot. Musharraf IS undoubtedly a patriot.. but his patriotism is outweighed and tainted by his own ambition to be seen in glory. That is what led to episodes like Kargil and that is what kept him power hungry.. and making grave mistakes in attempt to hold power at the expense of the nations future.

The last 5 years was led by corrupt men, who came into power on the basis of sympathy votes. Men who essentially were given a scot free status by none other than Musharraf himself. At the same time, the last five years were also very important in helping establish alternative political forces and mobilizing the youth for political change(something not seen since the 1970s and not on this scale).. moreover, they last five years were the most constitutional ever; and the first proper "running" of a system that was envisaged by the founder was made.

So while the last five years were horrible on the surface, they accomplished a lot more for Pakistan than is understood.

 

[T-123456]

And I gave you the analogy of how a military man is not always a total patriot. Musharraf IS undoubtedly a patriot.. but his patriotism is outweighed and tainted by his own ambition to be seen in glory. That is what led to episodes like Kargil and that is what kept him power hungry.. and making grave mistakes in attempt to hold power at the expense of the nations future.

The last 5 years was led by corrupt men, who came into power on the basis of sympathy votes. Men who essentially were given a scot free status by none other than Musharraf himself. At the same time, the last five years were also very important in helping establish alternative political forces and mobilizing the youth for political change(something not seen since the 1970s and not on this scale).. moreover, they last five years were the most constitutional ever; and the first proper "running" of a system that was envisaged by the founder was made.

So while the last five years were horrible on the surface, they accomplished a lot more for Pakistan than is understood.

What is the perspective of the next five years?
Nr 27 worlds economy for how long,its time to move up the ladder dont you think?
Is it going to happen in the future,you know there is the potential?