Mullah Omar ready to end al-Qaida ties

[RameeX Xaved]

Democracy is another slap on our faces..what has this system brought us in the last 62 years? rule out the dictatorship period, what about 32 years of democracy? more corruption, more lawlessness, more murders, more bribery, more injustice and what not?
the future of Pakistan and Afghanistan and the united states of Islam is in Khilafat, not the one which is portrayed by the TTP, but the one which was laid down by Hazrat Abu Bakar (R.A) 1400 years ago.. where women are allowed full education, the courts give quick justice to the victim and where the President is not the one sponsored by CIA, but a true muslim, patriot and who could talk with the enemies of Pakistan in their own tone..
I'd be happy if MO has learnt from his past mistakes and puts his effort in establishing the true khilafat based on the fundamental law and rights of Islam which will be the centre of muslim Islam from all around the world..

 

[Awesome]

Democracy is haram as per Islamic Idealogy , if western world is accepting Islamic financial system why not Islamic Governance (Khalafat) is acceptable ?

No where has it been written that Democracy is haram.

Second of all, humanity is made in a way where it will NEVER accept an imposed leader. If I don't get to choose who my leader is, I will have problems with it.

And don't get me started on the farce of Islamic finance...

 

[Awesome]

Democracy is another slap on our faces..what has this system brought us in the last 62 years? rule out the dictatorship period, what about 32 years of democracy? more corruption, more lawlessness, more murders, more bribery, more injustice and what not?
the future of Pakistan and Afghanistan and the united states of Islam is in Khilafat, not the one which is portrayed by the TTP, but the one which was laid down by Hazrat Abu Bakar (R.A) 1400 years ago.. where women are allowed full education, the courts give quick justice to the victim and where the President is not the one sponsored by CIA, but a true muslim, patriot and who could talk with the enemies of Pakistan in their own tone..
I'd be happy if MO has learnt from his past mistakes and puts his effort in establishing the true khilafat based on the fundamental law and rights of Islam which will be the centre of muslim Islam from all around the world..

hahaha and Install Mullah Omar as our Khalifa?

 

[FireFighter]

hahaha and Install Mullah Omar as our Khalifa?

Well! Do you think the western style democracy would work? It would totally destroy Afghanistan's culture and tradition. And that's exactly what the Americans want. They wanna brainwash the Afghans and then turn them against us. Look what happened to us ever since we've been following the British democratic system. We have lost our identity and morals and values. Our people have self-esteem issues as a result. Our judiciary is not for the people but to serves the political elites.


No matter how bad MO is depicted, he's still a far better option for the Afghans. He's their hero who fought for them and stood up for the Afghans against the most brutal superpowers in recent human history. How many such leaders have we had in our recent history? NONE.


Last but not least, you're following the western agenda too closely. If the Taliban beat women for whatever they deem illegal, so do the Chinese police. Heck but these are rather isolated instances. Have u seen how chinese police treats people??? Far worse than what the Taliban could do, yet no one dare raises a finger at the Chinese. So do the Russians. It's all hypocrisy and double standards, the very instances are used to occupy more land and justify long-term hegemonic ambitions.

 

[Awesome]

Well! Do you think the western style democracy would work? It would totally destroy Afghanistan's culture and tradition. And that's exactly what the Americans want. They wanna brainwash the Afghans and then turn them against us. Look what happened to us ever since we've been following the British democratic system. We have lost our identity and morals and values. Our people have self-esteem issues as a result. Our judiciary is not for the people but to serves the political elites.


No matter how bad MO is depicted, he's still a far better option for the Afghans. He's their hero who fought for them and stood up for the Afghans against the most brutal superpowers in recent human history. How many such leaders have we had in our recent history? NONE.


Last but not least, you're following the western agenda too closely. If the Taliban beat women for whatever they deem illegal, so do the Chinese police. Heck but these are rather isolated instances. Have u seen how chinese police treats people??? Far worse than what the Taliban could do, yet no one dare raises a finger at the Chinese. So do the Russians. It's all hypocrisy and double standards, the very instances are used to occupy more land and justify long-term hegemonic ambitions.

Dude YOU have been choosing idiots like Zardari, Benazir, and Nawaz Sharif. What is Democracy's fault?

Choose better!

Afghanis need to choose better too.

 

[waraich66]

No where has it been written that Democracy is haram.

Second of all, humanity is made in a way where it will NEVER accept an imposed leader. If I don't get to choose who my leader is, I will have problems with it.

And don't get me started on the farce of Islamic finance...

Democracy is the political framework of the Capitalist thought, i.e. the ruling system that the Capitalist states and their like implement.Democracy, for those who embrace it, means that people rule themselves by themselves with the systems that they choose. Oftentimes, Capitalists refer to their system as "The Democratic System", but such a connotation is incorrect for more than one reason Democracy was not innovated by the Capitalists but had been preceded by the Greeks. Moreover, they were not the only ones who implemented it; the Marxist-Socialists claimed that they were democrats and they consistently pretended that they implemented democracy.

The most important element of democracy is that it makes the human being and not the Creator as the legislator, which is logical for those who call for the detachment of religion from life because this detachment means to transfer the right to legislate from the Creator to the human being. The Capitalists, in this issue did not discuss whether the Creator has obliged man to follow a certain law and implement it in his life, nor did they even examine this issue at all, rather they appointed man as the legislator without any discussion.

For Muslims to adopt democracy means to disbelieve in all - may Allah _ forbid - the decisive and conclusive Evidences,among which are many Qur'anic verses which oblige them to follow the law of Allah _ and to reject any other law. Moreover, these erses consider any one of them who does not follow or mplement the law of Allah _ as either a Kaafir, a Zalim, or a Fasiq,


"And those who do not rule by whatever Allah has revealed are non-believers (Kaafiroon)." [TMQ AL-Ma'idah: 44]


"And those who do not rule by whatever Allah has revealed are oppressors (zalimoon)." [TMQ AL-Ma'idah: 45]


"And those who do not rule by whatever Allah has revealed are transgressors (fasiqoon)." [TMQ AL-Ma'idah: 47]


Thus, whoever does not rule by whatever Allah _ has revealed, denying Allah _'s right to legislate, as is the case with those who believe in democracy, is a Kaafir according to the explicit words of the Qur'an, because by doing so he is rejecting those decisive verses,and denying a conclusive text makes a person a Kaafir as the Muslim Fuqaha' agreed unanimously.

The Kaafiroon and their agents who rule the Muslim countries, as well as all those who call for democracy who are counted from among the Muslims, whether they are individuals or movements, realise that the basis for democracy is the rejection of the law of Allah _ and putting man in the place of the Creator. For this reason, they do not present democracy from this perspective, but instead claim that democracy means people ruling themselves by themselves, with equality and justice prevailing among the people, and the accountability of the ruler guaranteed.Although democracy explicitly implies the rejection of the laws of Allah and following the law of His _ creation, the advocates of democracy intentionally avoid addressing the issue of rejecting the law of Allah.


The remaining claims of democracy have no actual reality, the claim that people rule themselves by themselves is a major fallacy. In all Capitalist Democratic societies, people do not rule themselves by themselves, because this is a fanciful idea. In reality, people are ruled by a certain group of influential people, such as the prominent Capitalists in the United States and the aristocrats in England, which are two of the most deeply-rooted Capitalist Democratic countries. These influential groups in the Capitalist countries hold the necessary means to bring whoever they want into the government and legislative assemblies (parliaments) so that the laws which are passed and those charged with their implementation would be serving their interests.


Regarding what is claimed about equality, justice,and accountability of the rulers, these are all theoretical, without any compatibility with reality. It is enough for one to look to America, the leader of the democratic world, to find that equality, justice, and accountability are all selective, enjoyed and practiced by those who have a particular colour, religion, race, or financial wealth.The suffering faced by the blacks, Indians, those of Latin and Asian origins, those who are not Protestant, and those who are not from Western European backgrounds is evidence enough that what is claimed of democracy is - despite some exceptional cases - merely theory.Consequently, it is not allowed for a Muslim to accept democracy, because it is Kufr and gives man what is entitled exclusively for the Creator. It is obligatory upon every Muslim to reject it and to challenge all those who propagate it.

 

[Awesome]

Democracy is the political framework of the Capitalist thought, i.e. the ruling system that the Capitalist states and their like implement.Democracy, for those who embrace it, means that people rule themselves by themselves with the systems that they choose. Oftentimes, Capitalists refer to their system as "The Democratic System", but such a connotation is incorrect for more than one reason Democracy was not innovated by the Capitalists but had been preceded by the Greeks. Moreover, they were not the only ones who implemented it; the Marxist-Socialists claimed that they were democrats and they consistently pretended that they implemented democracy.

The most important element of democracy is that it makes the human being and not the Creator as the legislator, which is logical for those who call for the detachment of religion from life because this detachment means to transfer the right to legislate from the Creator to the human being. The Capitalists, in this issue did not discuss whether the Creator has obliged man to follow a certain law and implement it in his life, nor did they even examine this issue at all, rather they appointed man as the legislator without any discussion.

For Muslims to adopt democracy means to disbelieve in all - may Allah _ forbid - the decisive and conclusive Evidences,among which are many Qur'anic verses which oblige them to follow the law of Allah _ and to reject any other law. Moreover, these erses consider any one of them who does not follow or mplement the law of Allah _ as either a Kaafir, a Zalim, or a Fasiq,


"And those who do not rule by whatever Allah has revealed are non-believers (Kaafiroon)." [TMQ AL-Ma'idah: 44]


"And those who do not rule by whatever Allah has revealed are oppressors (zalimoon)." [TMQ AL-Ma'idah: 45]


"And those who do not rule by whatever Allah has revealed are transgressors (fasiqoon)." [TMQ AL-Ma'idah: 47]


Thus, whoever does not rule by whatever Allah _ has revealed, denying Allah _'s right to legislate, as is the case with those who believe in democracy, is a Kaafir according to the explicit words of the Qur'an, because by doing so he is rejecting those decisive verses,and denying a conclusive text makes a person a Kaafir as the Muslim Fuqaha' agreed unanimously.

The Kaafiroon and their agents who rule the Muslim countries, as well as all those who call for democracy who are counted from among the Muslims, whether they are individuals or movements, realise that the basis for democracy is the rejection of the law of Allah _ and putting man in the place of the Creator. For this reason, they do not present democracy from this perspective, but instead claim that democracy means people ruling themselves by themselves, with equality and justice prevailing among the people, and the accountability of the ruler guaranteed.Although democracy explicitly implies the rejection of the laws of Allah and following the law of His _ creation, the advocates of democracy intentionally avoid addressing the issue of rejecting the law of Allah.


The remaining claims of democracy have no actual reality, the claim that people rule themselves by themselves is a major fallacy. In all Capitalist Democratic societies, people do not rule themselves by themselves, because this is a fanciful idea. In reality, people are ruled by a certain group of influential people, such as the prominent Capitalists in the United States and the aristocrats in England, which are two of the most deeply-rooted Capitalist Democratic countries. These influential groups in the Capitalist countries hold the necessary means to bring whoever they want into the government and legislative assemblies (parliaments) so that the laws which are passed and those charged with their implementation would be serving their interests.


Regarding what is claimed about equality, justice,and accountability of the rulers, these are all theoretical, without any compatibility with reality. It is enough for one to look to America, the leader of the democratic world, to find that equality, justice, and accountability are all selective, enjoyed and practiced by those who have a particular colour, religion, race, or financial wealth.The suffering faced by the blacks, Indians, those of Latin and Asian origins, those who are not Protestant, and those who are not from Western European backgrounds is evidence enough that what is claimed of democracy is - despite some exceptional cases - merely theory.Consequently, it is not allowed for a Muslim to accept democracy, because it is Kufr and gives man what is entitled exclusively for the Creator. It is obligatory upon every Muslim to reject it and to challenge all those who propagate it.

Stop copy pasting articles without giving reference to them.

The system if it doesn't involve elections... Is crap. This thread is about Mullah Omar, if he is for imposing a theocracy upon the Afghans, then I oppose it simply on that as do all the sane people of the world.

 

[mjnaushad]

hahaha and Install Mullah Omar as our Khalifa?

The real question is even we accept mullah omer as our khalifa for a moment. Who will be the next khalifa after MO. A bloody war will start for the seat of Kalifa.

 

[FireFighter]

Dude YOU have been choosing idiots like Zardari, Benazir, and Nawaz Sharif. What is Democracy's fault?

Choose better!

Afghanis need to choose better too.

I don't think you got my point. Let me rephrase it in better words...


THe question is not what leadership has democracy produced for us, the real question, is what kind of a democracy is it that produces such incompetent, morally corrupt and imbecile pack of wolves in sheeps clothing?

It is "western" democarcy for "eastern" folks. Two entirely different philosophical/ideological systems imposed on entirely different regional/cultural/religious bloc. The system is meant to produce slaves who cater to their western masters. And that's not going to change until you make the necessary amendments in the system, if not a complete overhaul. The likes of in Iran and China.

Now coming back to Mullah Omer, at least give him the due respect for standing up for his beliefs. Even if he wants to impose a shura-council based shariah system on his people, then so be it because that would be an indigenous system of governance for the people, not a western/communist system designed to make slaves. Why force a nation to go and vote when it has never been their tradition? And that too voting for people the likes of Karzai's?

 

[TechLahore]

Democracy is the political framework of the Capitalist thought, i.e. the ruling system that the Capitalist states and their like implement.Democracy, for those who embrace it, means that people rule themselves by themselves with the systems that they choose. Oftentimes, Capitalists refer to their system as "The Democratic System", but such a connotation is incorrect for more than one reason Democracy was not innovated by the Capitalists but had been preceded by the Greeks. Moreover, they were not the only ones who implemented it; the Marxist-Socialists claimed that they were democrats and they consistently pretended that they implemented democracy.

The most important element of democracy is that it makes the human being and not the Creator as the legislator, which is logical for those who call for the detachment of religion from life because this detachment means to transfer the right to legislate from the Creator to the human being. The Capitalists, in this issue did not discuss whether the Creator has obliged man to follow a certain law and implement it in his life, nor did they even examine this issue at all, rather they appointed man as the legislator without any discussion.

For Muslims to adopt democracy means to disbelieve in all - may Allah _ forbid - the decisive and conclusive Evidences,among which are many Qur'anic verses which oblige them to follow the law of Allah _ and to reject any other law. Moreover, these erses consider any one of them who does not follow or mplement the law of Allah _ as either a Kaafir, a Zalim, or a Fasiq,


"And those who do not rule by whatever Allah has revealed are non-believers (Kaafiroon)." [TMQ AL-Ma'idah: 44]


"And those who do not rule by whatever Allah has revealed are oppressors (zalimoon)." [TMQ AL-Ma'idah: 45]


"And those who do not rule by whatever Allah has revealed are transgressors (fasiqoon)." [TMQ AL-Ma'idah: 47]


Thus, whoever does not rule by whatever Allah _ has revealed, denying Allah _'s right to legislate, as is the case with those who believe in democracy, is a Kaafir according to the explicit words of the Qur'an, because by doing so he is rejecting those decisive verses,and denying a conclusive text makes a person a Kaafir as the Muslim Fuqaha' agreed unanimously.

The Kaafiroon and their agents who rule the Muslim countries, as well as all those who call for democracy who are counted from among the Muslims, whether they are individuals or movements, realise that the basis for democracy is the rejection of the law of Allah _ and putting man in the place of the Creator. For this reason, they do not present democracy from this perspective, but instead claim that democracy means people ruling themselves by themselves, with equality and justice prevailing among the people, and the accountability of the ruler guaranteed.Although democracy explicitly implies the rejection of the laws of Allah and following the law of His _ creation, the advocates of democracy intentionally avoid addressing the issue of rejecting the law of Allah.


The remaining claims of democracy have no actual reality, the claim that people rule themselves by themselves is a major fallacy. In all Capitalist Democratic societies, people do not rule themselves by themselves, because this is a fanciful idea. In reality, people are ruled by a certain group of influential people, such as the prominent Capitalists in the United States and the aristocrats in England, which are two of the most deeply-rooted Capitalist Democratic countries. These influential groups in the Capitalist countries hold the necessary means to bring whoever they want into the government and legislative assemblies (parliaments) so that the laws which are passed and those charged with their implementation would be serving their interests.


Regarding what is claimed about equality, justice,and accountability of the rulers, these are all theoretical, without any compatibility with reality. It is enough for one to look to America, the leader of the democratic world, to find that equality, justice, and accountability are all selective, enjoyed and practiced by those who have a particular colour, religion, race, or financial wealth.The suffering faced by the blacks, Indians, those of Latin and Asian origins, those who are not Protestant, and those who are not from Western European backgrounds is evidence enough that what is claimed of democracy is - despite some exceptional cases - merely theory.Consequently, it is not allowed for a Muslim to accept democracy, because it is Kufr and gives man what is entitled exclusively for the Creator. It is obligatory upon every Muslim to reject it and to challenge all those who propagate it.

What utter garbage. You are now misusing verses of the Holy Book to further your own agenda. Shame on you.

The verses you have quoted above do not make a case for democracy vs. khilafat. Even in the early history of Islam, all the khalifas were chosen/elected/appointed in completely different ways. Don't try to impose your (mis)understandings about Islam on the rest of the community, otherwise you will simply have more of what you have had for the last 1400 years. Infighting and paralysis.

The Turks have the right idea... we too need to provide a holistic education to our next generation that is not madressa centric, so we can go that route ASAP.

 

[Awesome]

I don't think you got my point. Let me rephrase it in better words...


THe question is not what leadership has democracy produced for us, the real question, is what kind of a democracy is it that produces such incompetent, morally corrupt and imbecile pack of wolves in sheeps clothing?

It is "western" democarcy for "eastern" folks. Two entirely different philosophical/ideological systems imposed on entirely different regional/cultural/religious bloc. The system is meant to produce slaves who cater to their western masters. And that's not going to change until you make the necessary amendments in the system, if not a complete overhaul. The likes of in Iran and China.

Now coming back to Mullah Omer, at least give him the due respect for standing up for his beliefs. Even if he wants to impose a shura-council based shariah system on his people, then so be it because that would be an indigenous system of governance for the people, not a western/communist system designed to make slaves. Why force a nation to go and vote when it has never been their tradition? And that too voting for people the likes of Karzai's?

This is not a debate on whether democracy is good or not. I think you're drastically wrong about democracy and I would oppose a Khilafat system in Afghanistan.

MO is a woman hitter! Unacceptable to have women being hit on their behinds, that too on the streets!

 

[waraich66]

What utter garbage. You are now misusing verses of the Holy Book to further your own agenda. Shame on you.

The verses you have quoted above do not make a case for democracy vs. khilafat. Even in the early history of Islam, all the khalifas were chosen/elected/appointed in completely different ways. Don't try to impose your (mis)understandings about Islam on the rest of the community, otherwise you will simply have more of what you have had for the last 1400 years. Infighting and paralysis.

The Turks have the right idea... we too need to provide a holistic education to our next generation that is not madressa centric, so we can go that route ASAP.

Problem is with your attitude, you dont want to understand clear and simple defination rule of Islam which emphesis on quality not on quantity , in democracy a person supported by majority foolish and uneducated people will win and deserving person will lose.


Well said by Iqbal.
Juda hu deen siasat se to rah dati hai changezi


Usage of abusive language is representing weakness in your attitude and character

 

[Desert Fox]

That is some good news!But...

What about the TTP, will they be willing to make peace with Pakistan?

InshaAllah When America and NATO withdraw from Afghanistan, indians leaves Afghanistan, and a stable government arrives in Afghanistan, these TTP thugs will disappear as if they never existed!

 

[Ahmad]

Fundemantalist, If you care about muslims, end your friendship with china who is tourturing muslims and denying their every right. the truth is that your type of attitude is a major cause of muslims suffering in afghanistan(and in pakistan), i dont know if you do it deliberately or not.

 

[TechLahore]

Problem is with your attitude, you dont want to understand clear and simple defination rule of Islam which emphesis on quality not on quantity , in democracy a person supported by majority foolish and uneducated people will win and deserving person will lose.

Your definition of quality and mine may differ completely. From the early history of Islam itself, you will see very clearly that the debate regarding the succession of the Prophet would not have been possible were it not for these differences in qualitative judgement. Today everyone would agree to one version of the story and there would be differences of opinion on this succession. But it is not so.

The most dangerous society is one where one group of people impose their definition of "quality" on others... God gave us free will as *the* distinguishing trait which made us the highest among His creation. We are free to exercise that God-given gift without myopic illiterates standing in our way.

Well said by Iqbal.
Juda hu deen siasat se to rah dati hai changezi

I love Iqbal. But I must remind you that while you are liberally quoting him in support of your Islam-related arguments, you must also account for the fact that Iqbal himself did not follow many aspects of Islam... for example, he drank. And he did a lot of other things too, which old inhabitants of Lahore's inner city will gladly detail for you. See, I am a firm believer in the Quranic verse, "La ikraha fiddeen". Iqbal was free to drink in the same way as you are free to not drink. While God may or may not like a man's individual actions, he will be judged on the entirety of his conduct. I am no one to sit in judgement over him. Until a man's action harm society and start to interfere with the divinely ordained rights of other human beings, you cannot force anything down anyone's throat.

The argument you make re quality goes to the heart of this, i.e. a minority of men (not Prophets - just ordinary men) sitting in judgement and deciding the fate of the majority. If the majority must perish, let it be of their own volition.

But I do find it comical that this cadre of Reborn Muslims (a breed not unlike their Baptist/Church of Christ right wing brethren in the US) would use a poet like Iqbal to make their case.

Usage of abusive language is representing weakness in your attitude and character

Garbage by any other name, is still garbage. I am not abusing anyone. Just expressing my outrage on a set of views. A liberty I do enjoy until pigs sprout wings and fly or Mullah Umar becomes khalifah... have your pick.

As far as your judgements on my character go, two can play that game. Your misuse of Quranic verses exposes your character as that of a charlatan.