Mullah Akhtar is alive

[Devil Soul]

 

[war&peace]

That guy in pictures which are being shown is definitely not Mullah Mansoor

They killed an innocent Pakistani trader and his driver...their ids show that....Now who should be punished for killing two innocent people? Or the life of a Pakistani is that cheap.

 

[Arsalan]

The problem is our sovereignty and freedom...No one should be able to violate our airspace. If we want to kill someone, we should do it ourselves...Perhaps people living in Pakistan 24x7 can't feel it, can't understand it, there is a HUGE difference if NYT or CNN reports that Pakistan killed Mullah Mansour or Mullah Mansour killed by US strike in Pakistan..former makes the image and latter statments ruins it...and 2nd has happened and it endorses the point of view of anti-Pakistani lobby in congress. Furthermore, it is not what we believe or want but what is the truth...If he has not been killed then why should we keep believing the otherwise.

I was actually asking that do you think if we stop/deny the US aid that will ensure that we stop US from such attacks? I do not think so.

As for you comments regarding the killing on Taliban in this fashion, i TOTALLY agree with you on this. The news that he was killed in Pak by Pakistani security forces would have given a much better message but what if we were not able to kill him? (I wont say not willing to kill him because i for one strongly believe that we all take Taliban as our enemy and want nothing but to defeat them) In this case, i will say that it is BETTER then letting him escape only because we didn't wanted US to attack on our soil.

Here is what IDEAL situation can be, that US and Pak start trusting each other. BOTH OF THEM. We work together to fight this war together and defeat this common enemy. US involved Pakistani forces in operations, our men without any political or even military top brass influences take out the enemy targets in cooperation with the allies. This will address both things you want, it will get rid of the talibans and it will portray the positive image and the sacrifices we are making in this war. HOWEVER, the issue is that this is the ideal solution and no one is sure if that can or will be achieved.

 

[Zibago]

Spoiler alert he is live and they took out the wrong guy

 

[Sheikh Rauf]

These drone sud stop.. why dont they kill taliban in Afghanistan by drone. why cant they protect border by drone where is afghani border force. spent billions of dollars for their training and they cant protect their border... Afghanistan is chaos
even with so much forces from outside world.. Everyone is there to take care of Pakistan and check on china.. this CPEC is make nervous everyone specially jelouse india and they using afghan soil afghani sud realize indian mentality.

 

[Devil Soul]

Dunya News obtains Wali Muhammad's travel details
Last Updated On 23 May,2016 01:25 pm

Last time, Wali Muhammad toured Iran twice via road.
QUETTA (Web Desk) – Wali Muhammad, a person who was killed in a suspected US drone attack on a car in Nushki on Saturday, had travelled 18 times broad between 2006 and 2016, documents obtained byDunya News revealed on Monday.

Wali first left for Iran’s Taftan on 18 February 2016 and returned to Pakistan on March 10. Then again he visited Taftan on 25 April 2016 and returned on May 21.

He travelled through Karachi’s Jinnah International Airport 15 times and once from Quetta airport. Wali Muhammad traveled to Dubai via Emirates, Gulf, Shaheen, United Airline, PIA and Iran Air.

Last time, he toured Iran twice via road.

The details emerge two days after the Afghan authorities claimed that the leader of the Taliban, Mullah Akhtar Mansoor, has been killed in a U.S. airstrike in a remote part of southwest Pakistan.

The drone strike hit Mansoor’s car near Pak-Afghan border, Afghanistan’s Chief Executive Abdullah Abdullah confirmed.

Meanwhile, Pakistan’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs called the drone strike "a violation of (the state’s) sovereignty," after revealing in a statement the country was informed of the strike by the United States only after the fact.

The government did not specifically acknowledge Mansoor’s killing, stating instead that a vehicle was found destroyed along the border with Afghanistan.

The statement said the driver’s name was Muhammad Azam, whose body was identified and collected by his relatives. A second person is believed to be Wali Muhammad, who was "carrying a Pakistani passport ... bearing a valid Iranian visa."

However, the identity of the second body in the car "is [still] being verified on the basis of evidence found at the site of the incident and other relevant information," the statement added.

In his statement, US President Obama did not confirm that the attack on Mansoor took place inside Pakistan, saying only that the U.S. "will work on shared objectives with Pakistan, where terrorists that threaten all our nations must be denied safe haven."

There have been previous rumors and reports about Mansoor’s demise prior to Saturday’s operation. There has been no formal statement from the Taliban since the announcement of the strikes targeting Mansoor.
http://dunyanews.tv/en/Pakistan/337969-Dunya-News-obtains-Wali-Muhammads-travel-details

 

[Arsalan]

He was a guest of the state, Pakistan could have killed him anytime they wish but since they invested significant resources in making him the dead of Taliban, killing him is like murdering your own golden goose. I don't know why do I have to spell this out - Taliban has always been a Pakistani asset, Granted not always reliable or controllable but still an asset without which the whole idea of strategic depth goes to bin.

As some other poster, I think @Imran Khan so eloquently said - "They might be dogs, but they are our dogs".

Few subtexts to this issue - Complete secrecy of operation, silence of ISPR, Nawaz Sharif was informed and presumably not the security establishment and diplomats (as evidenced by the FO statement seeking clarification). All this points out to the enormous trust deficit not b.w US and Pakistan alone but b/w Pakistani civilian govt and security establishment themselves.

No one deny that Talibans have been Pakistani assets in the past, heck they have been US assets in the past. Just like Al Qaeda and ISIS was a US asset. However if someone deny the fact that we are at war with Talibans in our country and the fact the these elements are have the support of third party then they are totally wrong. All you need is to follow the news to see how much damage they are causing us and you may understand our position. Our problem/ our reason of disagreement can be depicted by this one image:

 

[Zibago]

I guess I should take your word over Obama's because he personally called you assuring you of his well being? Sometime back Omar was still alive despite having been dead for two years. I know how it goes with Pakistani conspiracy loving awaam - not my first rodeo!

Dead people dont issue audio statements the situation is still not 100% clear

 

[Hyde]

And if he indeed was an ordinary civilian, US wouldn't even apologise for the death of innocent soul. No action would be taken against the responsible...

If he was Mansour then of course the Pakistani Government must be thrashed for being so incompetent for not being able to find a terrorists by herself

 

[Zibago]

I guess I should take your word over Obama's because he personally called you assuring you of his well being? Sometime back Omar was still alive despite having been dead for two years. I know how it goes with Pakistani conspiracy loving awaam - not my first rodeo!

How many times was Ilyas Kashmiri killed before being actually killed?

 

[Spectre]

Dead people dont issue audio statements the situation is still not 100% clear

Been there seen that before. Audio of Osama and Mullah Omar both kept circulating months after their death. No one is proffesional enough to conduct a forensic audio analysis to ensure if it is indeed Akhtar or not. Let alone the fact that Audio can be pre-recorded precisely for this purpose.

As I said, I will take the official statement before whispers on the interwebs.

 

[war&peace]

I was actually asking that do you think if we stop/deny the US aid that will ensure that we stop US from such attacks? I do not think so.

As for you comments regarding the killing on Taliban in this fashion, i TOTALLY agree with you on this. The news that he was killed in Pak by Pakistani security forces would have given a much better message but what if we were not able to kill him? (I wont say not willing to kill him because i for one strongly believe that we all take Taliban as our enemy and want nothing but to defeat them) In this case, i will say that it is BETTER then letting him escape only because we didn't wanted US to attack on our soil.

Here is what IDEAL situation can be, that US and Pak start trusting each other. BOTH OF THEM. We work together to fight this war together and defeat this common enemy. US involved Pakistani forces in operations, our men without any political or even military top brass influences take out the enemy targets in cooperation with the allies. This will address both things you want, it will get rid of the talibans and it will portray the positive image and the sacrifices we are making in this war. HOWEVER, the issue is that this is the ideal solution and no one is sure if that can or will be achieved.

There is a huge difference between TTP and Afghan Talibans and you are mixing both of them. All TTP should be killed (I guess most have been killed) and a few hiding in Afghanistan. Afghan Talibans were never an enemy of Pakistan, not before the infamous WOT, not even during it or now. I would require evidence to believe otherwise. They are a legit political entity in Afghanistan and US has engaged them in the peace process, they have a mission/presence in Doha....very close to CENTCOM...What we need is to seal our border with Afghanistan and do not allow any spillage through the porous border. No Taliban should be in Pakistan or their supporters....however if they make govt in Afghanistan, they can sit in Afghan embassy in Islamabad but that's a totally different thing. As opposed to Taliban, the northern alliance, NDS and current and previous govt in Kabul are open enemies of Pakistan. Their venomous statements embellish headlines every now and then in international media. They are cooperating with India in more than just the civilian ways. They are also encouraging ISIS to take on Talibans and the remnants of TTP have shown allegiance to ISIS. Also we need to work on reducing the extremism in our society but that can only be done when we have an honest and sincere leader as our PM...not a liar and terrorist supporter. We need to apprehend all the terrorist leaders roaming free in Pakistan like Molvi Abdul Aziz, Jaish Maulana Azhar (friend of Rana Sanaullah). As far as the strikes are considered, may i ask a question...Why did USA not do any such thing against Iran or Cuba? despite being enemy for decades...US imposed sanctions on Iran through UNO and tried to destroy its economy but no strike...why... because Iran did not allow that and international law does not allow that.

 

[friendly_troll96]

Yar mar gi ya na woo, abb to F16 day doo.....

You want F16's or not...He is dead....mullah akhtar is dead....

haha "chachay" ko mamoo bna diya

 

[Arsalan]

All most all Pakistani posters take great pains to distinguish b/w Taliban and TTP. I wonder this omission was by design or accident.

It is Taliban who distinguish themselves like this not us, we just acknowledge this difference unlike many who do not or claims that they don't but actually do (Like US and Afghanistan) . I will highly appreciate you can point me to some statement from Afghan Taliban which endorses TTP. The problem is if someone justify that Afghans Taliban are good and TTP are bad. BUT, that will be only as wrong as someone saying TTP are good and Afghan Taliban are bad ( read US and Afghan forces withdrawing from the area that serves as TTP safe haven inside Afghanistan). This differentiation was introduced by the Taliban themselves and is acknowledge but everyone alike. Some do it openly and some only behind closed doors while making policies.
We, US and Pak can keep on playing the blame game for as long as we like but ground realities wont change.

 

[Spectre]

It is Taliban who distinguish themselves like this not us, we just acknowledge this difference unlike many who do not or claims that they don't but actually do (Like US and Afghanistan) . I will highly appreciate you can point me to some statement from Afghan Taliban which endorses TTP. The problem is if someone justify that Afghans Taliban are good and TTP are bad. BUT, that will be only as wrong as someone saying TTP are good and Afghan Taliban are bad ( read US and Afghan forces withdrawing from the area that serves as TTP safe haven inside Afghanistan). This differentiation was introduced by the Taliban themselves and is acknowledge but everyone alike. Some do it openly and some only behind closed doors while making policies.
We, US and Pak can keep on playing the blame game for as long as we like but ground realities wont change.

Fair enough but your prior post lumped them together while the reality is that unlike TTP, Afghan Taliban have not made any incursions or attacks inside Pakistan. So it seems disingenuous when you claim suffering from Taliban when in reality they are still your assets and neither Pak Military or Afghan Taliban have lifted a finger to harm each other.

However if someone deny the fact that we are at war with Talibans in our country and the fact the these elements are have the support of third party then they are totally wrong. All you need is to follow the news to see how much damage they are causing us and you may understand our position. Our problem/ our reason of disagreement can be depicted by this one image: