Muhammad Cartoonist Attacked

[afriend]

why people are showing double standard? they were thinking different with below thread.
http://www.defence.pk/forums/current-events-social-issues/37883-legend-indian-muslim-artist-doesnt-trust-india.html

Well.. it goes for all the religion... hindus are sterotyped coz of babri masjid... godhra riots and issue on MF hussain.. muslims are sterotyped coz of 9/11 and all those religously motivated attacks.. unless and untill we show that we dont get intimidated by anything the religion is going to be alienated.. thats it.. people get initimidated if they have doubts about what they believe in..!!!! So i would say follow some gandhigiri for all those initimidations around you..!!!!

 

[mkiyani]

Yeah just tell Cartoonist.. Get well soon..!!!! That will not only bring in more people to islam rather than giving an image of an intolerant religion..!!!!

ya we know what your religion is doing in Gugrat to muslims and burning church and babri mosque..shiv sena and so on all represent your intolerant religion...

 

[gambit]

That 'mythical' figure the cartoonist drew a bomb on is of extreme importance.

So is Jesus. When Piss Christ came out, the Vatican and the assorted Protestant churches did not send out 'hit squads' or issue 'fatwas'. Many muslims, in trying to defend the death fatwa on Salman Rushdie, and now the Danish cartoonist, simply argued that it is weakness on the Christians that allowed their god to be so vilely debased. In doing so, these muslims are saying that violence in retaliation for blasphemy should be an established doctrine in every faith. Do you agree?

There is nothing that tells a Muslim to 'violate the sanctity of a human life' over the cartoon so thats just out of the question.

No...It is NOT out of the question. We do not live our daily lives in an intellectual and moral vacuum. Everything we do, from brushing our teeth in the AM, to jumping the wives' bones in the PM, demands some reasoning for doing so, no matter how mundane or even robotic the task. Of course, the more robotic the task, the less intellectual and moral reflections required. Walking is robotic, but the journey which involve walking, be it to get the newspaper or to rob a bank, require some intellectual and moral justification. To kill someone over a perceived insult also require some intellectual and moral justifications. Where?

The cartoonist knows exactly what he is doing because he did not stop at that cartoon, he drew more and said it himself that he did.

I mean ffs, if your going to use your 'freedom of speech' to piss people off in the excuse that it's a 'joke', then just DONT do it.

Of course he knew what he was doing. No different than the guy who created Piss Christ. The intention is the same -- to insult and offend. Only the target differs.

So here is the problem for the muslims -- Currently, the Western moral belief is that nothing is sacred, not even deities. The ultimate insult of all and to all deities is atheism, a blanket denial of all deities, not just one. Drawing a caricature of the mythical figure or immersing his image in urine is really minor compare to denying him existence in this universe. God is not here. The state is. What will the muslims do in the face of atheism when it is defended by the might of the state?

 

[afriend]

ya we know what your religion is doing in Gugrat to muslims and burning church and babri mosque..shiv sena and so on all represent your intolerant religion...

Please read my post above the crap you posted.. before you post such crap..!!!!! And hindus are not sterotyped by the west except muslims.. because more moderate voices fromt this religion have been heard.. but and my comments are based on the present day realities that exists. And pbeing provoked on intimidation goes for all religions but we where discussing of the reality that exists with islam not hinduism okk..????

 

[gambit]

i pray next time they suceed in killing him... I am using my freedom of speech so to hell with u USA and Hindu BS people...

Ok now dont u guy get angry it was just freedom of speech....

FREEDOM OF SPEECH COMES WITH RESPONSIBILITY... Think about it.

Of course we have thought about it. That is why we protect the guy who created Piss Christ but will imprison anyone who yell 'Fire' in a crowded theater when there is no fire. Both are expressions of freedom of speech, but only one has direct negative physical, not merely psychic, consequences to people. And why would you just 'pray' for the cartoonist's death? Why not kill him yourself? Are you more afraid of the might of the state than of the might of god?

 

[FreekiN]

Of course we have thought about it. That is why we protect the guy who created Piss Christ but will imprison anyone who yell 'Fire' in a crowded theater when there is no fire. Both are expressions of freedom of speech, but only one has direct negative physical, not merely psychic, consequences to people. And why would you just 'pray' for the cartoonist's death? Why not kill him yourself? Are you more afraid of the might of the state than of the might of god?

Well someone just tried and apparently he didn't care about the 'state'

lol

 

[FreekiN]

So is Jesus. When Piss Christ came out, the Vatican and the assorted Protestant churches did not send out 'hit squads' or issue 'fatwas'. Many muslims, in trying to defend the death fatwa on Salman Rushdie, and now the Danish cartoonist, simply argued that it is weakness on the Christians that allowed their god to be so vilely debased. In doing so, these muslims are saying that violence in retaliation for blasphemy should be an established doctrine in every faith. Do you agree?


No...It is NOT out of the question. We do not live our daily lives in an intellectual and moral vacuum. Everything we do, from brushing our teeth in the AM, to jumping the wives' bones in the PM, demands some reasoning for doing so, no matter how mundane or even robotic the task. Of course, the more robotic the task, the less intellectual and moral reflections required. Walking is robotic, but the journey which involve walking, be it to get the newspaper or to rob a bank, require some intellectual and moral justification. To kill someone over a perceived insult also require some intellectual and moral justifications. Where?


Of course he knew what he was doing. No different than the guy who created Piss Christ. The intention is the same -- to insult and offend. Only the target differs.

So here is the problem for the muslims -- Currently, the Western moral belief is that nothing is sacred, not even deities. The ultimate insult of all and to all deities is atheism, a blanket denial of all deities, not just one. Drawing a caricature of the mythical figure or immersing his image in urine is really minor compare to denying him existence in this universe. God is not here. The state is. What will the muslims do in the face of atheism when it is defended by the might of the state?

Someone else answer this. or ill answer tommorow... im off to sleep

 

[gambit]

[/B]

Well someone just tried and apparently he didn't care about the 'state'

lol

One could argue that his incompetence will be ignored in the afterlife. But his contempt for this particular Western government will double his houris allotment in that same afterlife. Should be motivational enough for more to take up the cause.

 

[mkiyani]

Of course we have thought about it. That is why we protect the guy who created Piss Christ but will imprison anyone who yell 'Fire' in a crowded theater when there is no fire. Both are expressions of freedom of speech, but only one has direct negative physical, not merely psychic, consequences to people. And why would you just 'pray' for the cartoonist's death? Why not kill him yourself? Are you more afraid of the might of the state than of the might of god?

Dont tell me what to do... i will do what ever i want... i am not afraid of any one except Allah... you wound never talk so clamly if u were in afghanistan or any other country which usa invaded...u will piss in ur pants...

 

[ambidex]

I think that cartoonist needs to make sit on a donkey with black paint rubbed on face. First they will try to sell their stupidity to make money and fame then will try to save their a$$ by the name of freedom of speech.

 

[SMC]

Freedom of speech is basically a smokescreen against these things. Fact of the matter is these countries remove the whole freedom of speech when it doesn't suit them and put it back when it suits them. Here's an example:

BBC NEWS | Europe | Arabs charged over Dutch cartoon

Arabs charged over Dutch cartoon

An Arab organisation is to be put on trial in the Netherlands over its publication of a cartoon deemed offensive to Jews, prosecutors say.

The cartoon, published by the Arab European League (AEL) on its website, questions the Holocaust.

It said the decision to prosecute illustrated bias against Muslims.

It said the same standards were not applied to the Dutch MP Geert Wilders, who made a film including cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad.

Last month prosecutors said they would not put the far-right MP on trial for distributing the controversial Danish cartoons, which caused a storm of protest after their publication in 2005.

However, he is still being investigated separately for inciting hatred against Muslims by making statements comparing Islam to Nazism.

But Dutch prosecutors said the AEL cartoon was "discriminatory" and "offensive to Jews as a group... because it offends Jews on the basis of their race and/or religion".

The cartoon shows two men standing near a pile of bones at "Auswitch" (sic). One says "I don't think they're Jews".

The other replies: "We have to get to the six million somehow."

A spokeswoman for the prosecuting authority said the group could be fined up to 4,700 euros (£4,100), though in theory a prison sentence was also possible.

'Perverse'

AEL chairman Abdoulmouthalib Bouzerda said the charges proved "what Muslims have been saying for decades".

"Freedom of expression is only a pretext to make life bitter for Muslims... and if [they] try to bring this hypocrisy to light, that right is denied them."

The AEL says it does not deny the facts of the Holocaust but posted the cartoon as an "act of civil disobedience".

It said it had agreed to remove it from its site, but reversed that decision to protest over the failure to prosecute Geert Wilders.

"Double standards are being applied," it said in a statement.

But Jewish groups said it was not reasonable for the group to express its opposition to alleged bias against Muslims, by attacking Jews.

Ronny Naftaniel of the Center for Documentation on Israel, said: "Imagine if Dutch Jews insulted Muslims every time they heard an anti-Semitic remark. What kind of perverse world would we be living in?"

Tensions over the Netherlands' Muslim population have increased in recent years, notably since the killing of a controversial film-maker by a Muslim extremist in 2004.

 

[gambit]

Dont tell me what to do... i will do what ever i want... i am not afraid of any one except Allah... you wound never talk so clamly if u were in afghanistan or any other country which usa invaded...u will piss in ur pants...

I am not telling you what to do. I was only asking on why would you merely 'pray' for the man's death instead of doing something other than talk and rant about it. You make bellicose noises and represent yourself with violent icons but do nothing else. Prayers are not unique to Islam. But so far the efficacy of prayers have been dubious at best. No mater how much a religious leader exhort the believers to pray, the religion's deity have always needed a human agent to execute a supposedly directive from heaven. Why is that?

 

[gambit]

Freedom of speech is basically a smokescreen against these things. Fact of the matter is these countries remove the whole freedom of speech when it doesn't suit them and put it back when it suits them. Here's an example:

BBC NEWS | Europe | Arabs charged over Dutch cartoon

This is supposedly for Jews in regard to the Holocaust. This is not about protecting Judaism as a religion.

 

[SMC]

This is supposedly for Jews in regard to the Holocaust. This is not about protecting Judaism as a religion.

That's irrelevent. The basic idea is freedom of speech and freedom of expression. One group is allowed to have the whole idea of freedoom taken away in their favour (i.e. the jews), and the opposite for muslims. Double standards and hypocrisy.

 

[gambit]

That's irrelevent. The basic idea is freedom of speech and freedom of expression. One group is allowed to have the whole idea of freedoom taken away in their favour (i.e. the jews), and the opposite for muslims. Double standards and hypocrisy.

It is relevant in the perspective that prosecutions for criticisms of the Holocaust is not broadly applied. We have no such laws in the US. It is relevant in the perspective that said prosecution, when it exist, is narrow in scope. It is the Holocaust but not Judaism. The muslims' right to call Jews 'apes and pigs' are not taken away.