Muhammad Ali Jinnah - The Great Leader

[MultaniGuy]

you are talking about drinking, pork, being rich af living an affluent lifestyle, marrying non-muslim

everyone knows about it, literally a lot of people know about it,

he was an Ataturk type guy, wouldn't have taken BS from fundos
unfortunately died too early

lol, you like the Ataturk? Wasn't the man supposedly a traitor. Not everything Ataturk did was wrong, he did save Turkey.

Jinnah was not secular, but he was not exactly a model Islamist as a person from the West would imagine.

 

[MultaniGuy]

I am grateful to Jinnah for giving us Pakistan
I do not know Jinnah's personal life or going by the standard of the times in 1947.
Whatever Jinnah's faults or shortcomings are, that is for Allah to judge.


Those times were vastly different from today's of 2021.

Why would pakistanis take pride in this?? This man was well dressed because he was pampered by british empire just like rest of elite muslims of brtish empire.
Unlike empires of the past, british empire used local leaders to work for british exit strategy.
In reality it was brtish empire who created pakistan just like they created india and rest of the nations that were once under its empire.

I don't agree with you completely. The British did use divide and rule policy to rule South Asia.
I still credit the Muslim League for partition.

I do agree that the British used locals to help solidify their rule in South Asia.

 

[Menace2Society]

What was the raison d'etre for creating Pakistan then?

There is a civilizational divide between us and Indians. It not just religion that is the difference, its everything in every way! Nations are not just born and sustain because of religion. Its geography, culture and a MINDSET, a very particular concept that is unique to us. Don't measure your ideological origins with another culture, that is simply unfair on you because leaders of other civilizations receive a a very long rope and some of them did a lot of bad things to our people and to their own.

I don't care about what food he has on his plate and nor did he. His priorities were on things that mattered and he delivered.

 

[Maula Jatt]

There is a civilizational divide between us and Indians. It not just religion that is the difference, its everything in every way! Nations are not just born and sustain because of religion. Its geography, culture and a MINDSET, a very particular concept that is unique to us. Don't measure your ideological origins with another culture, that is simply unfair on you because leaders of other civilizations receive a a very long rope and some of them did a lot of bad things to our people and to their own.

I don't care about what food he has on his plate and nor did he. His priorities were on things that mattered and he delivered.

Islamists fail to see the broader picture of Pakistani creation and just focus on the religious aspect of it and forget the civilizational divide, way of thinking etc

Its just Hindu, Muslim but its bigger than that (although its a big part)

 

[MultaniGuy]

Islamists fail to see the broader picture of Pakistani creation and just focus on the religious aspect of it and forget the civilizational divide, way of thinking etc

Its just Hindu, Muslim but its bigger than that (although its a big part)

I believe there are huge cultural differences between Pakistan and India.
Some people used to say Pakistan and Northern India had some cultural similarities but I too disagree with that notion.

 

[ghazi52]

Quaid-e-Azam Mohammad Ali Jinnah, Khan of Kalat (c) and Fatima Jinnah.
Date: 1947

 

[ghazi52]

 

[ghazi52]

Although, We the whole Nation Pakistan have no precious / remarkable words to say thanks to this honourable family, but in our ordinary words with our core of heart, we are very much thankful to this family, what they have done for Muslims of Indo-Pak and gifted a sweet Islamic Country Pakistan to all of us. Allah Jee may reward them a lot in Heaven for all their services and sacrifices for Pakistan. Ameen.

 

[ghazi52]

“His memory is very beautiful. He was emotional and affectionate, but he was unable to demonstrate it..

There was some kind of loneliness about Jinnah. A lonely man.”

- Jamshed Nusserwanjee, The First Elected Mayor of Karachi.

 

[M. Sarmad]

I have read Quaid-e-Azam's biographies. None of them said he ate pork or drank alcohol.

Show me where in his Biographies written by Akbar S. Ahmed, Stanley Wolpert, which says he did these things.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.

The very reason behind Pakistan banning Stanley's Jinnah biography was the fact that Stanley Wolpert plainly refused to take out the part where he had written about Jinnah's dietary habits, i.e., Jinnah drank alcohol and ate ham sandwiches. Stanley Wolpert has quoted M.C Chagla (a friend turned foe). But Chagla was not the only one to say that, there are a lot of other people also who have maintained that Jinnah liked ham sandwiches and pork sausages (For details , See Stanley Jackson , the Agha Khan London , 1952 , p 169) ....

As for the other guy you mentioned (Akbar S. Ahmed), he says that nearly every book about Jinnah outside Pakistan mentions that he drank alcohol.

Jinnah was a liberal Muslim who followed Shia Islam. And he remained one till the very end.

But none of this makes Jinnah a lesser man (or leader)

If you respect Jinnah, respect the man for what he really was, not for what you would've liked him to be. Otherwise there are a lot of people out there, our entire religious establishment / Mullah Biradari most notably, who hate the man for being irreligious (or even worse a Shia), but mostly avoid to say that in open

 

[doorstar]

Jinnah was not secular,

you know everything, dontcha? PhD in history, I bet, from Youtube university

 

[Maula Jatt]

@M. Sarmad I felt sad after our conversation on Mr.Jinnah @MultaniGuy changed his avatar to a no name guy who most have no idea about...

Personal habits of a man shouldn't cloud one's judgement on actions of Mr. Jinnah

 

[doorstar]

I am aware Quaid-e-Azam was raised an Agha Khani before converting to the Sunni sect in 1901.

wow! PDF just keeps on imparting secret knowledge. what an amazing place. so much to learn from here but alas there is just not enough time to take it all in

 

[ghazi52]

One of the last known photos of Muhammad Ali Jinnah.
Evidently, he looks quite frail and weak.
His iron willpower is what kept him going.

 

[doorstar]

changed his avatar to a no name guy who most have no idea about...

- https://historypak.com/choudhry-rahmat-ali-1895-1951/