What's new

Malaysia considering to expell Dr Zakir Naik

https://answering-islam.org/Gilchrist/muhammad.html

I think this parrot needs to read some works of Ibn Warraq, Ali Sina etc. The Christian Jesus, Mariyam are all so different from the Islamic ones.

Heh. So there were too virgin births, one of the Jesus(AS) of Christianity and one of Jesus (AS) of Islam? You've to wonder about the brain capability of people that come up with stuff like this. Stupidity feels ashamed.

It's simple. Christianity is man-made bullocks with a lot of the original message lost and remnants of the message of Jesus(AS). The sad fact is Christians don't even care about Jesus(AS) and instead choose to believe the crap left in there by random people in it.

And Christianity is pretty convenient. Someone died for your sins that you've not even done yet so feel free to rape, pillage, murder because hey, someone else died for you sins and is suffering because of your wrong.

Even Christian scholars themselves say Bible is so adulterated and there's no original Bible yet Christians have put their hopes on some powerful kings and priests who have added pornography, lies and whatever their heart desired to Bible over the centuries.

So there's a website that spews lies about Holy Quran and Islam and you think a Muslim will believe that crap? The Holy Quran is protected and memorised by millions, there is a Holy Quran from the time of Prophet Muhammad (saww) in England matching exactly the Holy Quran of today. Even the accounts of companions (RA) are written and verified through a vigilant process that's unique to Islam.

Not a single Christian Priest could retort to Ahmad Deedat (May Allah give him Jannat ul Firdous). But some dude on a website does by hashing some stuff up from his belly and bam, retorted. Sadly, they won't hold in a public debate though.


But here's a website that responds to that crap.
http://www.answering-christianity.com/ac3.htm

I honestly don't know how some people can put their faith in man-altered corrupted religions versus a religion that has been preserved just to fight man-made corruptions. Anyone who dared blaspheme and try to corrupt the scripture was sent to hell.

http://www.oldest.org/religion/qurans/

Listened to all kinds of lies. Some dude had the audacity to tell me the Holy Quran is lost because a goat ate the manuscript from Hazrat Ayesha Siddique (RA) pillow. Like this is the level of crap that these Christians feed their followers and amazingly they eat it up gobble gobble

Because Zakir Naik is lying. Show me prove that Indians in Malaysia support Modi. He can't. Did he even do studies? Did he have a source? He doesn't. This is why he is in trouble. And Chinese wasn't born here, well he got it wrong too, which is obviously wrong.


I don't think you have read 8chan / stormfront. They are hugely anti immigrants, especially muslim migrants. What he has done is fanning far-right anti Indian and Chinese sentiment by calling us migrants. He is no peace maker.

And we know who is Zakir Naik day by day.

David Wood? Hahaha

That dude was humiliated by Muhammed Hijab. He's still producing videos? Look at the shameless liar. Muhammed Hijab didn't even have to waste much brain cells to respond to him. It was pure gold of a debate.


 
First read your previous post ... then my reply and try to use your brain what reply links to which question/hollow decree of yours....and then only resort to your biased response.

You do that since you're straying off topic here, not me. I merely replied to your post.

Because Zakir Naik is lying. Show me prove that Indians in Malaysia support Modi. He can't. Did he even do studies? Did he have a source? He doesn't. This is why he is in trouble. And Chinese wasn't born here, well he got it wrong too, which is obviously wrong.

Read the first and maybe the 2nd page of this thread, you'll find your proof of Indians working in Malaysia for their govt.

You can call Dr. Zakir Naik whatever, you're just hurling insults, the man doesn't care and neither do I. You're just showing your true self now rather than debating calmly. :D

I don't think you have read 8chan / stormfront. They are hugely anti immigrants, especially muslim migrants. What he has done is fanning far-right anti Indian and Chinese sentiment by calling us migrants. He is no peace maker.

And we know who is Zakir Naik day by day.

I don't care what nerds/nobodies say about Dr. Zakir Naik. Their opinion is useless.

Truth prevails at the end of the day no matter how many lies are spread about Dr. Zakir Naik. He'll continue on his work and people like you will keep burning in the inside. :lol:

You are quoting a hate website called AnsweringMuslims.Com to disprove Zakir Naik.

Do you realize that it is someone like you who does not belong in a Muslim country.

I wonder what majority of ethnic Malaysians will think you disparaging Islam with nasty abuse.

You only prove Zakir Naik’s statement correct.

LOL proves half/most of these trolls are anti-Muslim/Islamic....I wonder why they're not banned already..

I have heard this from Malay Muslim girls too
Especially those force to cover up.

In Islam, there is no compulsion. If anyone forces anyone to do anything then it's not Islam but cultural barbarity or just human barbarity by itself.

Religion has nothing to do with forcing people to cover up.

I have seen many women in the West, coming from non religious Muslim families adopt the hijab and other styles of covering up. Are they "forced" to cover up too??
 
I have heard this from Malay Muslim girls too
Especially those force to cover up.

Now you are just making up points to insult Muslims.

Stay on topic or I will start reporting any of you trying abuse Islam or to propagate your faith/non-faith.

I have seen many women in the West, coming from non religious Muslim families adopt the hijab and other styles of covering up. Are they "forced" to cover up too??

According to these white knights, Malaysian Muslim women don’t know what is good for them. Champions of freedom and Democracy, and their clones all over the world, eat Western propaganda and regurgitate it again and again.

Zakir Naik is right to point out such people, they are a poison to humanity and have no place in a Muslim nation.

The sooner they go back to their countries of origin, the better.
 
He shouldn't of got involved in the sensitive affairs of Malaysia and the uproar is getting worse.

You're a guest and you should have boundaries end of.
 
He shouldn't of got involved in the sensitive affairs of Malaysia and the uproar is getting worse.

You're a guest and you should have boundaries end of.

What about the old guests who couldn't tolerate him preaching in Malaysia and wanted him expelled?

This is like if say Pakistan takes in Kashmiris and suddenly Afghani people get angry and force the government to kick Kashmiris out.

Truly comical stuff. It would be understandable if the Malay people had an issue but the people screaming the most are Hindus racist terrorists.
 
What about the old guests who couldn't tolerate him preaching in Malaysia and wanted him expelled?

This is like if say Pakistan takes in Kashmiris and suddenly Afghani people get angry and force the government to kick Kashmiris out.

Truly comical stuff. It would be understandable if the Malay people had an issue but the people screaming the most are Hindus racist terrorists.

Old guests, fair enough, but they've been there since the 18th century...When do you suggest people stop becoming 'guests' 500 years or maybe a 1000 thousand years?
Having just come back from Malaysia I know how deeply interwoven the Chinese community is within Malaysian society. They wield massive economic clout and are on the forefront of making Malaysia a developed state. To upset them is not wise for a multitude of reasons.
The similitude of the Afghan and Kashmiri isn't appropriate here, as it is not a collective people asking another collective people to leave, it's the thoughts of one man, who himself is a guest.
As for the people who are screaming the most, the Hindus you refer to happen to be among the nicest I have come across. Their reaction is more akin to a small minority being fearful of hysteria being whipped up by a religious preacher who has some influence among the majority.
If he had done nothing wrong, why do we see statements from the Prime Minister and Anwar Ibrahim saying what he said was overstepping the mark?
I'd thought that Naik would have known better especially coming from India where Sanghis making crazy, provocative statements about Muslims on a habitual basis.
 
He shouldn't of got involved in the sensitive affairs of Malaysia and the uproar is getting worse.

You're a guest and you should have boundaries end of.

It's nothing serious. He spoke the truth and Indians got triggered.

Then they went down on him hard since their masters back in India have a grudge with Dr. Zakir Naik.

Thankfully Malaysia hasn't submitted fully to Indian pressure tho that might change in the future. Truly pathetic.
 
Old guests, fair enough, but they've been there since the 18th century...When do you suggest people stop becoming 'guests' 500 years or maybe a 1000 thousand years?
Having just come back from Malaysia I know how deeply interwoven the Chinese community is within Malaysian society. They wield massive economic clout and are on the forefront of making Malaysia a developed state. To upset them is not wise for a multitude of reasons.
The similitude of the Afghan and Kashmiri isn't appropriate here, as it is not a collective people asking another collective people to leave, it's the thoughts of one man, who himself is a guest.
As for the people who are screaming the most, the Hindus you refer to happen to be among the nicest I have come across. Their reaction is more akin to a small minority being fearful of hysteria being whipped up by a religious preacher who has some influence among the majority.
If he had done nothing wrong, why do we see statements from the Prime Minister and Anwar Ibrahim saying what he said was overstepping the mark?
I'd thought that Naik would have known better especially coming from India where Sanghis making crazy, provocative statements about Muslims on a habitual basis.

Ooh, the Hindus are the nicest people and fearful minority. Tell me something, is this how a fearful minority acts?

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/new...not-be-allowed-to-remain-in-malaysia--8753048

Look at the date 20 April 2017. Look at the language of the nice Hindus.

Here are the facts.

Dr Zakir Naik has been the victim of a malicious campaign launched by Hindus in Malaysia the moment he stepped foot in Malaysia. In fact, these Hindus have been pressuring the government from that day.
In the process, they aligned Chinese with themselves.

Dr Zakir Naik responds to these extremists after years of hearing lies, defamatory campaigns against him, if you want me expelled, you should go home first because you're the older guests. These extremists find an excuse to blow it out of proportion.

The only people who were disturbing the peace amd creating disharmony among Malaysians and dividing the country are Hindus and Hindus alone.

You don't know why Dr Zakir Naik said what he said. Malaysian government gives PR to Dr Zakir Naik. The Hindus start making hurtful comments and demand his expulsion knowing full well that Malaysian Muslims including PM love Dr Zakir Naik. But these Malaysian Hindus obey their Indian masters instead of Malaysian PM.

Who are the Hindus pledging allegiance to? Modi or Malaysian PM?

I find it extremely hypocritical of these Hindus who didn't feel disharmony and threat to peace when they were muddying the country with their extremism but one response from Dr Zakir Naik who doesn't even have the same pull as these Hindus and the floodgates of hell have been opened. Halp!! Unity of Malaysia is threatened.

Despicable and disgusting.
 
Ooh, the Hindus are the nicest people and fearful minority. Tell me something, is this how a fearful minority acts?

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/new...not-be-allowed-to-remain-in-malaysia--8753048

Look at the date 20 April 2017. Look at the language of the nice Hindus.

Here are the facts.

Dr Zakir Naik has been the victim of a malicious campaign launched by Hindus in Malaysia the moment he stepped foot in Malaysia. In fact, these Hindus have been pressuring the government from that day.
In the process, they aligned Chinese with themselves.

Dr Zakir Naik responds to these extremists after years of hearing lies, defamatory campaigns against him, if you want me expelled, you should go home first because you're the older guests. These extremists find an excuse to blow it out of proportion.

The only people who were disturbing the peace amd creating disharmony among Malaysians and dividing the country are Hindus and Hindus alone.

You don't know why Dr Zakir Naik said what he said. Malaysian government gives PR to Dr Zakir Naik. The Hindus start making hurtful comments and demand his expulsion knowing full well that Malaysian Muslims including PM love Dr Zakir Naik. But these Malaysian Hindus obey their Indian masters instead of Malaysian PM.

Who are the Hindus pledging allegiance to? Modi or Malaysian PM?

I find it extremely hypocritical of these Hindus who didn't feel disharmony and threat to peace when they were muddying the country with their extremism but one response from Dr Zakir Naik who doesn't even have the same pull as these Hindus and the floodgates of hell have been opened. Halp!! Unity of Malaysia is threatened.

Despicable and disgusting.

Most of the 'Hindus' don't care about India and it's affairs and yes they are nice, I've been many times at that.
There are however some elements that have been at it, but why get involved? He should have just ignored them and now he has a bigger problem.
You still didn't answer why the PM and Ibrahim have not backed him.
 
Last edited:
Old guests, fair enough, but they've been there since the 18th century...When do you suggest people stop becoming 'guests' 500 years or maybe a 1000 thousand years?
Having just come back from Malaysia I know how deeply interwoven the Chinese community is within Malaysian society. They wield massive economic clout and are on the forefront of making Malaysia a developed state. To upset them is not wise for a multitude of reasons.
The similitude of the Afghan and Kashmiri isn't appropriate here, as it is not a collective people asking another collective people to leave, it's the thoughts of one man, who himself is a guest.
As for the people who are screaming the most, the Hindus you refer to happen to be among the nicest I have come across. Their reaction is more akin to a small minority being fearful of hysteria being whipped up by a religious preacher who has some influence among the majority.
If he had done nothing wrong, why do we see statements from the Prime Minister and Anwar Ibrahim saying what he said was overstepping the mark?
I'd thought that Naik would have known better especially coming from India where Sanghis making crazy, provocative statements about Muslims on a habitual basis.

Chinese, Malays, Indians are all immigrations, natives are in the forest, once Chinese was majority then British imported malays and Indians to counter Chinese.
 
Outsider do not understand the definition of Malay. This article from Malaysia Kini can give some light on who are the Malays, and different definition between Indonesia and Malaysia.

Anyone who is a Muslim and practice the way of life as Malay, are termed Malay in Malaysia. Thus if a Chinese, Indian, Cambodian, Thai or Vietnamese who is a Muslim, and practise the way of Malay life, are all termed Malay in Malaysia.

The original people of Malaysia are Orang Asli in West Malaysia, and Dusun-Dayak in East Malaysia. The Malays came later around 7th century (as some said), flourished from 14th century Malacca empire (built by a prince from Singapore, descended from Palembang, Indonesia), to present day immigration from Indonesia, most of them are ethnic Bugis, Achenese, Minangkabau, Sea gypsies/ Orang Laut and other ethnic groups from South East Asia, including the Chams from Cambodia and Vietnam. In Indonesian definition, they are not ethnic Malay but for political reason, they are defined as Malay by Malaysian constitution.

And the aboriginal people are called Orang Asli, they are not called Malay.

Extract of prelude and origin of Malacca Empire history.
"In an effort to revive the fortune of Malayu in Sumatra (Indonesia), in the 1370s, a Malay ruler of Palembang (Indonesia) sent an envoy to the court of the first emperor of the newly established Ming dynasty. He invited China to resume the tributary system, just like Srivijaya did several centuries earlier. Learning this diplomatic maneuver, immediately King Hayam Wuruk of Majapahit sent an envoy to Nanking, convinced the emperor that Malayu was their vassal, and was not an independent country.[10] Subsequently, in 1377—a few years after the death of Gajah Mada, Majapahit sent a punitive naval attack against a rebellion in Palembang,[11]:19 which caused the complete destruction of Srivijaya and caused the diaspora of the Srivijayan princes and nobles. Rebellions against the Javanese rule ensued and attempts were made by the fleeing Malay princes to revive the empire, which left the area of southern Sumatra in chaos and desolation.

By the second half of 14th century, Kingdom of Singapura grew wealthy. However, its success alarmed two regional powers at that time, Ayuthaya from the north and Majapahit from the south. As a result, the kingdom's fortified capital was attacked by at least two major foreign invasions before it was finally sacked by Majapahit in 1398.[12][13][14] The fifth and last king, Parameswara (founder of Malacca Empire) fled to the west coast of the Malay Peninsula.

Parameswara (also known as "Iskandar Shah" in some accounts) fled north to Muar, Ujong Tanah and Biawak Busuk before reaching a fishing village at the mouth of Bertam river (modern-day Malacca River). The village belonged to the sea-sakai or orang laut which were left alone by Majapahit forces that not only sacked Singapura but also Langkasuka and Pasai. As a result, the village became a safe haven and in the 1370s it began to receive a growing number of refugees running away from Mahapahit's attacks. By the time Parameswara reached Malacca in the early 1400s, the place already had a cosmopolitan feel with Buddhists from the north, Hindus from Palembang and Muslims from Pasai."


Article of Interest from Malaysia Kini.
Definition of 'Malay' root cause of Indonesian anger

Tourism Malaysia must be congratulated for adopting a brilliant tagline for its international advertising campaigns. In just two words, ‘Truly Asia’, it sums up the essence of Malaysia in a memorable manner. Together with its descriptor - ‘The wonders of Asia in one exciting destination’ – it makes a competitive and compelling case for the country.

Why go to say, Thailand or Vietnam, with their monocultures, when you can have a multicultural experience in Malaysia? Malaysia has no problems with China and India because its claims are explicit; there are people of Chinese and Indian descent who practice some form of their original cultures in Malaysia.

Tourists are not disappointed, as the country is abundantly blessed with tourist attractions – architecture, festivals, food – which are genuinely of Chinese or Indian origin.

However, several Tourism Malaysia advertisements and events have been met with anger in Indonesia. The root of this dispute stems from the very different definitions of ‘Malay’ in Malaysia and Indonesia. Put simply, ‘Malay’ is regarded as a ‘suku’ (ethnic group) in Indonesia and a ‘bangsa’ (race) in Malaysia and this difference has profound consequences.

Indonesians are proud of their country because of their long, difficult and bloody fight for nationhood and independence. They trace their struggle to 1928, when a congress of young Indonesian nationalists from many ethnic groups and islands proclaimed the ‘Sumpah Pemuda’ (Youth Pledge), which formalised the concept of ‘one country - Indonesia, one people, Indonesian - and one language of unity, Indonesian’.

Significantly, Malay was chosen as the Indonesian national language instead of Javanese, the language spoken by the numerically, politically and economically dominant group in Indonesia. This because Malay was the lingua franca in the archipelago and, therefore, an ethnically neutral unifying force in the new nation.

Thus the Republic of Indonesia began as a social contract between many ethnic groups of various religions, who shared the common burden of Dutch colonialism and who had decided to unite as one nation.

Today, Indonesians regard their nation as made up of more than 300 ethnic groups, with the Javanese (41% or more than 90 million) being the largest, followed by Sundanese (36 million), Malay (8 million), Madurese (8 million), Batak (7 million) and so forth. Importantly, the Indonesian constitution guarantees its citizens freedom of choice of religion and ethnicity does not determine religious belief.

Indonesian children are taught this history and national identity from elementary school. They learn about the different ethnic groups that make up Indonesia, with their specific customs, songs, dances, dress and so forth. They are taught that the Lilin dance is Malay, the ‘angklung’ in Sundanese, the ‘Reog Ponorogo’ dance is Javanese and ‘Rasa Sayange’ is Ambonese.

In Malaysia the definition of ‘Malay’ is a political construct which is spelled out categorically in the constitution. A Malay is ‘a person who professes the religion of Islam, habitually speaks the Malay language (and) conforms to Malay custom’.

Given the vagueness of the definition, it is easy to see why Malaysians tend to think that almost anything Indonesian is automatically ‘Malay’. All Indonesians speak Malay/Indonesian, the vast majority of them are Muslim, and therefore, ‘Indonesian’ equals ‘Malay’, with the exception of some items which are explicitly not Muslim, like the Balinese ‘pendet’ dance.

The incident which provoked the most serious Indonesian response was in 2007, when Tourism Malaysia used Rasa Sayang(e) in its ‘Visit Malaysia Year’ advertising campaign. The Malaysian tourism minister’s response to the Indonesian protests was that Malaysia had a right to use this song as it is from a shared heritage in the Malay archipelago.

This was perceived by Indonesians as ignorant and arrogant. (In the Malaysian context, it would be like the Dayaks saying that ‘boria’ is Dayak as it is part of the shared Malaysian culture.)

The Malaysian answer was bewildering to Indonesians because the Ambonese are dark-skinned, with curly hair from their mixed Melanesian, Malay and African lineage - they look like the Orang Asli of Peninsular Malaysia - and are predominantly Christian.

In other words, they do not fulfil any of the criteria that define ‘Malay’. They look different, use a language which is unintelligible to standard Malay speakers and have a different culture and religion from the Malays.

It was unfortunate that the minister Tengku Adnan Mansor took what Indonesians perceived to be a confrontational stance in this disagreement. The situation could easily have been diffused at this stage by him saying something like:

‘All Malaysians love this song and we have been singing it for generations. Since it is a folk song we cannot pay royalties as no one holds the copyright, but we Malaysians would like to thank the Ambonese for sharing it with us by providing five scholarships to their students to study in Malaysian universities.’

It would have soothed Indonesian discontent and promoted Malaysian education in one fell swoop. Instead, Indonesians began thinking of Malaysians as stealing parts of obviously non- Malay Indonesian culture and calling it ‘Malay’, just to attract a few more international tourists.

With the heightened sensitivity since then, any little incident is now played up for maximum political mileage. These disputes are set to occur again and again as the crux lies in the definitions of ‘Malay’.

Given that the conflicting views are closely entwined with the politics and history of the two countries, these definitions are set in stone. After all, if Malaysians look at themselves from an Indonesian perspective, they would be forced to conclude that there is no majority race in Malaysia.

It is a country where the Malays are the largest minority group, followed by the Chinese, Indians, Javanese, Bugis, Acehnese, Madurese and the indigenous peoples of Sabah, Sarawak and Peninsular Malaysia, a nation where the majority are pendatang, led by a Bugis pendatang from South Sulawesi. The current Malaysian government will never allow this view to prevail.
 
Last edited:
Most of the 'Hindus' don't care about India and it's affairs and yes they are nice, I've been many times at that.
There are however some elements that have been at it, but why get involved? He should have just ignored them and now he has a bigger problem.
You still didn't answer why the PM and Ibrahim have not backed him.

Simple reason. Voter base.

Siding with Dr Zakir Naik will cost them the Indian and Chinese votes more so Indians because they were already pissed off why Dr Zakir Naik was protected and not become victim of a Hindutva lynch mob and forced to sing their idols names in India.

Mahathir would've kicked him if it didn't mean pissing off the Muslim population. So he just shut him up.
 
The incident which provoked the most serious Indonesian response was in 2007, when Tourism Malaysia used Rasa Sayang(e) in its ‘Visit Malaysia Year’ advertising campaign. The Malaysian tourism minister’s response to the Indonesian protests was that Malaysia had a right to use this song as it is from a shared heritage in the Malay archipelago.

The song Rasa Sayang is from Maluku and was featured in Indonesia's first made film after Independence, Darah & Doa (1950), that is 7 years before Malaysia independence.

Regardless, the dispute wouldn't be big if it wasn't because the sentiment at the time. It was a VERY hot time for Indonesia - Malaysia relationship when case after case of Indonesian being mistreated in Malaysia came to surface. Among many was Nirmala Bonat case (2004) and the assault on an Indonesian Karate referee (2007).

I remember our people were very fond of Malaysia, we truly regarded Malaysia as "Saudara Serumpun" but Sipadan-Ligitan dispute and the cases of Indonesians being abused in Malaysia has changed what Indonesia perceived of Malaysia forever.

Things has been a lot better now and relation has mended but it doesn't yet return to where it was, maybe someday, maybe never, time will tell.

===

Given that the conflicting views are closely entwined with the politics and history of the two countries, these definitions are set in stone. After all, if Malaysians look at themselves from an Indonesian perspective, they would be forced to conclude that there is no majority race in Malaysia.

It is a country where the Malays are the largest minority group, followed by the Chinese, Indians, Javanese, Bugis, Acehnese, Madurese and the indigenous peoples of Sabah, Sarawak and Peninsular Malaysia, a nation where the majority are pendatang, led by a Bugis pendatang from South Sulawesi. The current Malaysian government will never allow this view to prevail.

Agree... :tup:

.
 
Chinese, Malays, Indians are all immigrations, natives are in the forest, once Chinese was majority then British imported malays and Indians to counter Chinese.

WOW......this guy just single-hadedly rewrote IndoChina history :lol:

Another paid CCP troll...

Where did ethnic Malays immigrate from?

Malays?? What Malays? They don't exist!! China good! Chinese people always here! :D
 
Back
Top Bottom