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Majority of Pakistanis for 'Islamisation' of society: Poll

Pakistan emerging for the name of Islam but after some time the NAME of islam abuse by the lords of ISLAM and till now most of population cashing the name of Islam....
Not for developing peace and humanity but for their own aims.....:azn:
 
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We have already argued that the issue of the politics of identity and the role of the state and particularly of the army is important for us to understand, Zarvan says this makes us slaves of America, Well, Below is an other American slave - look what he has to say about Islamism and the politics of identity --- Hard luck Zavran but don't be sad, making mistakes is necessary before one can get it right -- it's important to recognize mistakes however:


Political Islam
By M. Zaidi | From the Newspaper
(15 hours ago) Today

IN order to understand the logic — or the lack of it — behind terrorism, one needs to first understand the interplay of governance structures and radicalisation.

Islam has widely been used throughout the Islamic world to mobilise the masses. The ruling elite has utilised it for political purposes ranging from secular nationalist to pan-Arabist to Marxist, taking advantage of its populist appeal to support the agenda of self-preservation. Paradoxically, many of the same rulers created Islamist movements which they then crushed.

In Egypt, Gamal Abdel Nasser attempted to make the prestigious Al Azhar University dependent on the government in order to lend religious legitimacy to governmental policies, including his ruthless suppression of the Islamic Brotherhood. Saddam Hussein, leader of the zealously secularist Ba’ath party, put ‘God Is Great’ on the Iraqi flag and spoke about jihad in a failed effort to get Iraqis to fight to defend his regime. Ziaul Haq created jihadist groups and then attempted to disown ‘turncoats’.

This schizophrenic mindset becomes even more complicated when applied to states that have a large spectrum of tribes.

Iran, for instance, has some 96 tribes and 647 independent clans according to a recent census. However, some of these clans have over time become redundant as power structures. But for the Pahlavi elites previously, it was a priority to suppress these tribal cultures to usher in the era of ‘modernity’. This made Reza Shah extremely unpopular amongst people in whom the ‘conservative spirit’ was deeply ingrained, and which arguably contributed to the rise of Islamism. The ruling elites tried to supplant a modernist project on a populace wholly unprepared for it; this made conditions ripe for the 1979 revolution.

An observable phenomenon in modern Iran is the alliance of politics with Islamism; arguably, Islamism has proved more adept at integrating different tribes in Iran than modernism.

This had the usual result of integrating tribal people who had lost their power base either to modern ethnic nationalism or, on the other end of the spectrum, detribalisation and absorption into ideology-based organisations. Since Islamism dominated,
recruitment to these organisations occurred at a greater rate, while the ethno-nationalism sentiments of the Baloch in Sistan and the Kurds were suppressed.

Similarly the Bakhtiaris, whose khans constituted the pre-revolutionary elite, were ruthlessly put down. This was a prominent feature accounting for the rise of Islamists, since they replaced the khans as the dominant ruling elite. Neither the modernity project nor subsequent Islamism could accommodate the ‘khan’ power structures. This was anathema for Islamism and modernity projects in Iran, so the khanate system was suppressed and eventually died out.

The Shia state of Iran and the Taliban in Afghanistan were governments taking over systems driven by a tribal mindset. The existing literature about these regimes shows how they foisted their versions of Islamism upon the masses. Political scientist Mia Bloom postulates that ‘martyrdom’ operations tend to boost the reputation of the organisation carrying them out, as evidenced in the case of Palestine. For instance, Nichole Argo argues that martyrdom or shahadat has become a mainstream Palestinian social paradigm, with social status being congruent with the level of sacrifice.

During the Oslo process, the majority of Palestinians were opposed to violence. In November 1998, some 75 per cent opposed suicide operations. However, with incrementally ineffective governance, Yasser Arafat’s popularity plummeted.

Along with an increase in their political credentials, there was a simultaneous rise in the popularity of the Islamic Jihad Movement and Hamas, with a share of almost 70 per cent going to Hamas.

They started using the suicide-bombing tactic, coupled with the provision of social services, to gain popularity among the masses. Against the backdrop of economic decay, rising unemployment and gloomy prospects, groups such as Hamas seen to be ‘doing something’ (suicide tactics) about the escalating Israeli aggression undermined a substantial chunk of the Palestinian Authority’s support base.

Although there are clear differences between the Iranian clerical leadership, the Taliban as well as the Palestinian Authority, the deterioration in socio-economic opportunities for the middle class and income disparities between the elite and the proletariat were identical drivers of Islamism. Arguably, these operate throughout the breadth of the radicalised Islamic world today, including Pakistan.


Another type of model one could use to draw analogies with Pakistan is the type of governments which modelled themselves on Stalinist lines. The ruling elite of these states used the rhetoric of the rising of the proletariat against the bourgeois, which petered out with the end of the Cold War. As in Iraq and Syria, these ‘caring’ regimes evolved into little more than brutal dictatorships utilising the secret police as coercive instruments. An epitome of this variant was Nasser’s’ government in Egypt, and Jaffer Numeiri’s government in Sudan, which prompted a violent reaction by the Islamists. Nasser’s strong-arm tactics would later fan the Islamist movement into a roaring flame.

However, the late Egyptian president Anwar Sadat was perhaps even more instrumental in igniting these movements. The Islamists felt betrayed by Sadat’s unfulfilled promises, which would lead more radical Islamists such as Al Jihad into the circle of never-ending violence. Sayyid Qutb’s simplistic analysis has been inspirational for a vast majority of Islamists disillusioned by regimes that could be clearly discerned as having one agenda: self-sustenance. Thus Qutb used the classical pre-Arabian Islamic concept of jahiliya or ignorance to denounce the Muslim leadership, which he saw as failing to overthrow the yoke of the West.

Placing Islamic tradition at the altar of political objectives and nationalistic causes has gravely affected the perception of Islam, particularly in the West. This is paradoxical since many of the leaders in this category tended to woo the West, but it has caused an identity crisis for their conservative masses. Since Islamic heritage was selectively sifted to support temperamental political causes, intellectual revivalism in the Muslim world has suffered greatly.


Also, Islam has started to signify the politics of identity, in which the leadership’s exploitation of the sentiments of the masses became inextricably intertwined with political agendas. This also served to display to the outside world a distorted picture of political Islam.

The writer is a security analyst.
 
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We have already argued that the issue of the politics of identity and the role of the state and particularly of the army is important for us to understand, Zarvan says this makes us slaves of America, Well, Below is an other American slave - look what he has to say about Islamism and the politics of identity --- Hard luck Zavran but don't be sad, making mistakes is necessary before one can get it right -- it's important to recognize mistakes however:


Political Islam
By M. Zaidi | From the Newspaper
(15 hours ago) Today

IN order to understand the logic — or the lack of it — behind terrorism, one needs to first understand the interplay of governance structures and radicalisation.

Islam has widely been used throughout the Islamic world to mobilise the masses. The ruling elite has utilised it for political purposes ranging from secular nationalist to pan-Arabist to Marxist, taking advantage of its populist appeal to support the agenda of self-preservation. Paradoxically, many of the same rulers created Islamist movements which they then crushed.

In Egypt, Gamal Abdel Nasser attempted to make the prestigious Al Azhar University dependent on the government in order to lend religious legitimacy to governmental policies, including his ruthless suppression of the Islamic Brotherhood. Saddam Hussein, leader of the zealously secularist Ba’ath party, put ‘God Is Great’ on the Iraqi flag and spoke about jihad in a failed effort to get Iraqis to fight to defend his regime. Ziaul Haq created jihadist groups and then attempted to disown ‘turncoats’.

This schizophrenic mindset becomes even more complicated when applied to states that have a large spectrum of tribes.

Iran, for instance, has some 96 tribes and 647 independent clans according to a recent census. However, some of these clans have over time become redundant as power structures. But for the Pahlavi elites previously, it was a priority to suppress these tribal cultures to usher in the era of ‘modernity’. This made Reza Shah extremely unpopular amongst people in whom the ‘conservative spirit’ was deeply ingrained, and which arguably contributed to the rise of Islamism. The ruling elites tried to supplant a modernist project on a populace wholly unprepared for it; this made conditions ripe for the 1979 revolution.

An observable phenomenon in modern Iran is the alliance of politics with Islamism; arguably, Islamism has proved more adept at integrating different tribes in Iran than modernism.

This had the usual result of integrating tribal people who had lost their power base either to modern ethnic nationalism or, on the other end of the spectrum, detribalisation and absorption into ideology-based organisations. Since Islamism dominated,
recruitment to these organisations occurred at a greater rate, while the ethno-nationalism sentiments of the Baloch in Sistan and the Kurds were suppressed.

Similarly the Bakhtiaris, whose khans constituted the pre-revolutionary elite, were ruthlessly put down. This was a prominent feature accounting for the rise of Islamists, since they replaced the khans as the dominant ruling elite. Neither the modernity project nor subsequent Islamism could accommodate the ‘khan’ power structures. This was anathema for Islamism and modernity projects in Iran, so the khanate system was suppressed and eventually died out.

The Shia state of Iran and the Taliban in Afghanistan were governments taking over systems driven by a tribal mindset. The existing literature about these regimes shows how they foisted their versions of Islamism upon the masses. Political scientist Mia Bloom postulates that ‘martyrdom’ operations tend to boost the reputation of the organisation carrying them out, as evidenced in the case of Palestine. For instance, Nichole Argo argues that martyrdom or shahadat has become a mainstream Palestinian social paradigm, with social status being congruent with the level of sacrifice.

During the Oslo process, the majority of Palestinians were opposed to violence. In November 1998, some 75 per cent opposed suicide operations. However, with incrementally ineffective governance, Yasser Arafat’s popularity plummeted.

Along with an increase in their political credentials, there was a simultaneous rise in the popularity of the Islamic Jihad Movement and Hamas, with a share of almost 70 per cent going to Hamas.

They started using the suicide-bombing tactic, coupled with the provision of social services, to gain popularity among the masses. Against the backdrop of economic decay, rising unemployment and gloomy prospects, groups such as Hamas seen to be ‘doing something’ (suicide tactics) about the escalating Israeli aggression undermined a substantial chunk of the Palestinian Authority’s support base.

Although there are clear differences between the Iranian clerical leadership, the Taliban as well as the Palestinian Authority, the deterioration in socio-economic opportunities for the middle class and income disparities between the elite and the proletariat were identical drivers of Islamism. Arguably, these operate throughout the breadth of the radicalised Islamic world today, including Pakistan.


Another type of model one could use to draw analogies with Pakistan is the type of governments which modelled themselves on Stalinist lines. The ruling elite of these states used the rhetoric of the rising of the proletariat against the bourgeois, which petered out with the end of the Cold War. As in Iraq and Syria, these ‘caring’ regimes evolved into little more than brutal dictatorships utilising the secret police as coercive instruments. An epitome of this variant was Nasser’s’ government in Egypt, and Jaffer Numeiri’s government in Sudan, which prompted a violent reaction by the Islamists. Nasser’s strong-arm tactics would later fan the Islamist movement into a roaring flame.

However, the late Egyptian president Anwar Sadat was perhaps even more instrumental in igniting these movements. The Islamists felt betrayed by Sadat’s unfulfilled promises, which would lead more radical Islamists such as Al Jihad into the circle of never-ending violence. Sayyid Qutb’s simplistic analysis has been inspirational for a vast majority of Islamists disillusioned by regimes that could be clearly discerned as having one agenda: self-sustenance. Thus Qutb used the classical pre-Arabian Islamic concept of jahiliya or ignorance to denounce the Muslim leadership, which he saw as failing to overthrow the yoke of the West.

Placing Islamic tradition at the altar of political objectives and nationalistic causes has gravely affected the perception of Islam, particularly in the West. This is paradoxical since many of the leaders in this category tended to woo the West, but it has caused an identity crisis for their conservative masses. Since Islamic heritage was selectively sifted to support temperamental political causes, intellectual revivalism in the Muslim world has suffered greatly.


Also, Islam has started to signify the politics of identity, in which the leadership’s exploitation of the sentiments of the masses became inextricably intertwined with political agendas. This also served to display to the outside world a distorted picture of political Islam.

The writer is a security analyst.

I haver ready this funny argument it was really very funny
 
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sir your goverments have handed it to UAE and do u really think Drons fly from their and if yes than they are flying without Pakistan consent because UAE is such a strong Country man give some valid point

First.. please use some punctuation, its difficult to make sense of your post in the first go... hence finding any "valid point" in your post.

Second..if our government handed it over to the Arabs who in turn handed it over to the Americans..
Then the arabs are complicit as well.. American slaves in your words??
After all.. the UAE provides jobs to thousands of Pakistani people.

And as for your valid point about arabs have always fought for Islam..
the current Arab revolutions are purely nationalistic in nature.. not one shred of evidence apart from them following Islam in their daily lives suggests these Arabs are bringing in change for the love of Islam or to defeat Americans and conquer the whole world with Islam, or that they will . Except for a few clerics here and there, the arabs are more concerned with freedom of thought and speech at the moment.
its all fine about the alcohol and Pigs and earthly women..
But , it is still unclear as to what you intend to put forth as the argument here apart from broken tidbits here and there regarding Islam, ummah.. and Arabs.
 
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First.. please use some punctuation, its difficult to make sense of your post in the first go... hence finding any "valid point" in your post.

Second..if our government handed it over to the Arabs who in turn handed it over to the Americans..
Then the arabs are complicit as well.. American slaves in your words??
After all.. the UAE provides jobs to thousands of Pakistani people.

And as for your valid point about arabs have always fought for Islam..
the current Arab revolutions are purely nationalistic in nature.. not one shred of evidence apart from them following Islam in their daily lives suggests these Arabs are bringing in change for the love of Islam or to defeat Americans and conquer the whole world with Islam, or that they will . Except for a few clerics here and there, the arabs are more concerned with freedom of thought and speech at the moment.
its all fine about the alcohol and Pigs and earthly women..
But , it is still unclear as to what you intend to put forth as the argument here apart from broken tidbits here and there regarding Islam, ummah.. and Arabs.

are you trying to be funny Do u really think UAE is capable of handing your airbase to Americas without your approval you if you think so that don't talk to me because it is really very funny and most arabs are not fine with Alcohol it is the propaganda of followers Abdullah Bin Ubai and the hypocrites to divide muslims further to make their American masters happy but they will be defeated
 
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First.. please use some punctuation, its difficult to make sense of your post in the first go... hence finding any "valid point" in your post.

Second..if our government handed it over to the Arabs who in turn handed it over to the Americans..
Then the arabs are complicit as well.. American slaves in your words??
After all.. the UAE provides jobs to thousands of Pakistani people.

And as for your valid point about arabs have always fought for Islam..
the current Arab revolutions are purely nationalistic in nature.. not one shred of evidence apart from them following Islam in their daily lives suggests these Arabs are bringing in change for the love of Islam or to defeat Americans and conquer the whole world with Islam, or that they will . Except for a few clerics here and there, the arabs are more concerned with freedom of thought and speech at the moment.
its all fine about the alcohol and Pigs and earthly women..
But , it is still unclear as to what you intend to put forth as the argument here apart from broken tidbits here and there regarding Islam, ummah.. and Arabs.
sir most arab are not Nationalist by nature most of the facebook workers even call themselves Islamists and it is now clear that in most countries Islamists will win the elections DEATH TO SECULARISM
 
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sir most arab are not Nationalist by nature most of the facebook workers even call themselves Islamists and it is now clear that in most countries Islamists will win the elections DEATH TO SECULARISM

If Arabs are not nationalistic by nature please explain why did they stand up against the TURKISH OTTOMAN caliphate?
 
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are you trying to be funny Do u really think UAE is capable of handing your airbase to Americas without your approval you if you think so that don't talk to me because it is really very funny and most arabs are not fine with Alcohol it is the propaganda of followers Abdullah Bin Ubai and the hypocrites to divide muslims further to make their American masters happy but they will be defeated

sir most arab are not Nationalist by nature most of the facebook workers even call themselves Islamists and it is now clear that in most countries Islamists will win the elections DEATH TO SECULARISM

facepalm.jpg


There is a nice Urdu saying for you

"Ghulail bana ke Chirya marey"...

That is all you can come up..repeating the same mantra without any coherent idea behind it.
Where all over facebook??
There are like a billion facebook users...the page the sparked the revolution was for the man who died in Egyptian police custody..
where are you coming up with your logic??
 
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If Arabs are not nationalistic by nature please explain why did they stand up against the TURKISH OTTOMAN caliphate?

sir not all of the stood some of them stood and this Arab Nationalism is the one which HAZRAT MUHAMMAD SAW destroyed but it was always used by Abdullah Bin Ubai to divide muslims and I am amazed how many Abdullah Bin Ubai have followers in this age who trying their best to promote nationalism and divide muslims may ALLAH give Hadaya to all and save us from his anger
 
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facepalm.jpg


There is a nice Urdu saying for you

"Ghulail bana ke Chirya marey"...

That is all you can come up..repeating the same mantra without any coherent idea behind it.
Where all over facebook??
There are like a billion facebook users...the page the sparked the revolution was for the man who died in Egyptian police custody..
where are you coming up with your logic??

you will see in upcoming elections when Islamists will win INSHALLAH
 
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First.. please use some punctuation, its difficult to make sense of your post in the first go... hence finding any "valid point" in your post.

Second..if our government handed it over to the Arabs who in turn handed it over to the Americans..
Then the arabs are complicit as well.. American slaves in your words??
After all.. the UAE provides jobs to thousands of Pakistani people.

And as for your valid point about arabs have always fought for Islam..
the current Arab revolutions are purely nationalistic in nature.. not one shred of evidence apart from them following Islam in their daily lives suggests these Arabs are bringing in change for the love of Islam or to defeat Americans and conquer the whole world with Islam, or that they will . Except for a few clerics here and there, the arabs are more concerned with freedom of thought and speech at the moment.
its all fine about the alcohol and Pigs and earthly women..
But , it is still unclear as to what you intend to put forth as the argument here apart from broken tidbits here and there regarding Islam, ummah.. and Arabs.

A very well analysed post that demolishes wild flights of fancy.

---------- Post added at 12:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:23 PM ----------

you will see in upcoming elections when Islamists will win INSHALLAH

Pakistan has never brought in Islamists to power!
 
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A very well analysed post that demolishes wild flights of fancy.

---------- Post added at 12:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:23 PM ----------

Pakistan has never brought in Islamists to power!
Sir for your kind information MMA governed the province of Khayber Pakhtun Kahwa and Balochistan not very long ago also in most area parties of Islamic forces are divided among sects and many others don't even vote for example in Karachi if free and fair election is held and Religious Parties join together than you will see the results
 
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Sir for your kind information MMA governed the province of Khayber Pakhtun Kahwa and Balochistan not very long ago also in most area parties of Islamic forces are divided among sects and many others don't even vote for example in Karachi if free and fair election is held and Religious Parties join together than you will see the results

Yes.. the MMA with maulana diesel..
the same MMA that did NOTHING for the KP.. NOTHING for Balochistan..
and Nothing for Karachi..
which is what these false "Islamists" and those like you who support them are..
NOTHING.
 
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Yes.. the MMA with maulana diesel..
the same MMA that did NOTHING for the KP.. NOTHING for Balochistan..
and Nothing for Karachi..
which is what these false "Islamists" and those like you who support them are..
NOTHING.
I don't support Moalan Diseal but I support Shairah and to take on Secular Traitors which one day will be made part of history
 
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mr.zarvan you need to study Turkish system. Shariah will not be part of Pakistan as long as you have deobandis, salafis, wahabis and now the sunni tehreek, jumaat-e-islami and other similar parties/groups that are trying to force (not individual people/civilians). Let be clear we can't end sects here but these people with specific tasks to damage society and Pakistan and Islam needs to be rooted out.

Who fed talibans/AQ it was high time and MMA was governing at that time in KPK, under their noses although it is clear MMA was very much involved in infestation of this all.
 
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