Lt. Gen (R) Tariq Khan speaks

[Jango]

when some of these very same officers and their cohort get into the GHQ, they can perhaps follow the path of the above mentioned chiefs instead of Bajwa and Asim Munir et-al.

Those generally seldom get into positions of power.

NN, I have yet to see a single incident of women being raped in custody. Not saying its an impossibility but do share links etc. if this is indeed the case. There is a lot of propaganda being wielded on both sides to build a narrative. We should always seek the truth. I am not saying excesses and extreme hardship is not being borne by PTI, but this talk of "rapes" is only from you.

Nobody should ever forget this because when we do have democracy, we should value it for it is worth.

Not rape, as in not proven or anything, but there were 5 cops pushing Usman Dar's mother into a room by her arms, and then closed the door and when a cop saw someone making a video from outside, they closed the curtains.

in case, what do you think about Kiyani then?

His period was also full of political machinations.

Moreover, his period was more transitionary in nature, after a long rule of Musharraf.

 

[blain2]

What leaders r u talking about? Zardari and nawaz ? They r just en extension of establishment

It does not matter, they came through the vote of the public at that time. Once in office, the public needs to find whatever means to hold them accountable.

I have seen a video where a policeman was showing his dick to womens arrested and were trying to get out of police van ...

He was threatening to rape them

That video is at least 2-3 years old and the officer in question was arrested and fired from his police job but it had nothing to do with any of the recent political issues. As I have said before, sift through the propaganda because it is being done by both sides to mislead and generate sympathy for own and hate for the other side.

There was another one showing "torture of PTI workers" at the hands of the army when in reality it is a video of the SSG cadres beating up trainees during Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape (SERE) training.

This is not to say our police and Rangers have not roughed up people, but rape and "rapes" are serious claims.

 

[blain2]

Those generally seldom get into positions of power.



Not rape, as in not proven or anything, but there were 5 cops pushing Usman Dar's mother into a room by her arms, and then closed the door and when a cop saw someone making a video from outside, they closed the curtains.



His period was also full of political machinations.

Moreover, his period was more transitionary in nature, after a long rule of Musharraf.

That is not true. Most of the current crop of Brigadiers probably have their sympathies for PTI and this cohort will be the vanguard of the senior leadership in the next 3-5 years.

Like I said, accusations of rape are extremely serious. Even the detention of women is bad enough, so these claims have to be checked, verified and hell raised if found to be true.

 

[VCheng]

Not rape, as in not proven or anything, but there were 5 cops pushing Usman Dar's mother into a room by her arms, and then closed the door and when a cop saw someone making a video from outside, they closed the curtains.

The goals of such a strategy may not be to actually rape or molest, but to put that fear in the heart of the intended target that next time it could happen by demonstrating the willingness to be ruthless and the impunity with which it could be done. Usually that is enough. Otherwise, dramatic sounds can be staged as well to play on the subject's imagination even more. A secondary effect can be socially devastating by simply advertising that "something" happened which can also add effectiveness.

 

[blain2]

The goals of such a strategy may not be to actually rape or molest, but to put that fear in the heart of the intended target that next time it could happen by demonstrating the willingness to be ruthless and the impunity with which it could be done. Usually that is enough. A secondary effect can be socially devastating by simply advertising that "something" happened which can also add effectiveness.

Baday #2 harbay hotay hain in k pas. When push comes to shove, the reality is that Pakistani politics are not for shareef/decent people.

 

[VCheng]

Baday #2 harbay hotay hain in k pas. When push comes to shove, the reality is that Pakistani politics are not for shareef/decent people.

Sir, this is only for beginners. The real techniques are far more than this, but why go there in a public forum?

 

[blain2]

Sir, this is only for beginners. The real techniques are far more than this, but why go there in a public forum?

Unfortunately, I am well aware as are most here...have seen all sorts badmashi by law enforcers first hand.

 

[VCheng]

Unfortunately, I am well aware as are most here...have seen all sorts badmashi by law enforcers first hand.

Mere amateurs they are compared to the real masters of such dark crafts. Let us leave it there.

 

[Jango]

that Pakistani politics are not for shareef/decent people.

Agreed, and I think right now this is what is being shown to the middle class nobodies who joined the PTI and the general middle class which took part in politics post 2013.

Those people are being shown, by the general establishment at large, to stay in your auqat, we are the head honchos and we will do as we please.

The message is loud and clear, politics is for the Sharifs, the Zardaris, the Chaudharies, the Maliks, the Gujjars, and so on, not for the 50k naukri wala BSc kid, or the nobody whose father sold newspapers.

That is not true. Most of the current crop of Brigadiers probably have their sympathies for PTI and this cohort will be the vanguard of the senior leadership in the next 3-5 years.

I am talking about the PSO positions, at least those close to the COAS. The CGS, the VCGS-A, the DG ISI, and the sorts. Only those will be promoted or put into those positions who agree with the COAS. Not hard to find a rotten apple in the bunch. The rest of the good boys can be shifted to CLS or NDU or POF etc. As has happened, with Gen Rizwan most recently.

But the optimist in me does think we will be seeing a changed army in the years to come. Fingers crossed.

, but to put that fear in the heart of the intended target that next time it could happen by demonstrating the willingness to be ruthless and the impunity with which it could be done.

I think that has worked, to a certain extent.

I know a fair few people in my own circle who have deleted their whatsapp groups, went silent on Twitter, and so on and so forth.

 

[VCheng]

Those people are being shown, by the general establishment at large, to stay in your auqat, we are the head honchos and we will do as we please.

Exactly what I kept telling people here, but no one was willing to accept this bitter reality.

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

Agreed, and I think right now this is what is being shown to the middle class nobodies who joined the PTI and the general middle class which took part in politics post 2013.

Those people are being shown, by the general establishment at large, to stay in your auqat, we are the head honchos and we will do as we please.

The message is loud and clear, politics is for the Sharifs, the Zardaris, the Chaudharies, the Maliks, the Gujjars, and so on, not for the 50k naukri wala BSc kid, or the nobody whose father sold newspapers.

These idiots are betting this will work when in truth it's never gonna work. The blow back for everything they have done will be far reaching and beyond anything these masters planners have planned for. Going by their track record they should be terrified. By crucifiying IK and PTI they are making sure the next person who demands change will not be a pacifist like IK or Asghar Khan before him. They will have one advantage that these guy Didn't have they will know who the real enemy is. Any movement demanding rights for middle class will have a militant and agressive approach.

 

[Jango]

Exactly what I kept telling people here, but no one was willing to accept this bitter reality.

I am still, foolishly, hopeful that this is not the end. Let's see.

 

[VCheng]

I am still, foolishly, hopeful that this is not the end. Let's see.

Oh I agree this is not the end. It is merely the continuation of the status quo that is painful for many here to accept.

 

[Jango]

Oh I agree this is not the end. It is merely the continuation of the status quo that is painful for many here to accept.

Hopeful for it to be the opposite!

 

[VCheng]

Hopeful for it to be the opposite!

I am perfectly willing and able to let such an optimistic stance continue, for it does not affect the reality.