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[Lahore] Operation against Afghan refugees ?

I have a better idea... Unite both Pakistan and Afghanistan into one state and we can have combined ownership of the massive mineral wealth of Afghanistan also... It will also solve the huge problem of India sitting in Afghanistan trying to backstab us at all available opportunity...
 
Thanks for the nice word!!! But why you people take every frustration out of Afghans? Yes, you can send them back to their country, it is your country and your decision, but dont come up with emotion based statements which dont have real weight. You hosted us for your own sake, remember the soviet invasion? You had to do it to protect Paksitan, we were a buffer between you and the soviets. Secondly, you didnt feed us, that is an utter lie!! The UN paid pakistan hugely in hte name of refugees, the refugees themselves did the most difficult jobs in pakistan that pakistanis were not keen doing it, in the cities we rented your homes which was another source of income for you guys, hundreds of milions of dollars came to pakistan in the name of afghanistan to pakistan, that was a plus point for your currency market.

A teapot is calling the kettle black, we have as much terrorist as you got, you probably got more, dont you see that internationally majority of terrorits attacks are carried out by pakistanis or have links to pakistan? we didnt have drugs or gun culture before the war, but that was and still is part of your tribal culture.

And regarding breakage, your gov loves and support militarily/politicallly the same people who love to break pakistan, ask your gov.

I know you are a very sensible person from reading all your posts but this i don't agree with. The Soviet Afghan war was not our war and definitely gave us a lot of problems in return for the money. We were forced into the war and believe me it was not for money. It is a well known fact that the Kalashnikov and drugs culture seeped into Pakistan after the Afghan refugees came. The reason why Pakistan has terrorists or links to terrorists is also because of the same reason. Something we had sown 20 years ago we are reaping today. What i don't understand is, if Pakistan is so bad a place where the Afghan refugees have to do the worst jobs and are treated very badly, why even after the war ended they stayed in Pakistan? Why most of them applied for Pakistani nationality when they could have gone back to their own country?
 

We hosted you for our own sake.....what kind of stupid logic is that. What benefit would we have gained out of it other then literally ruining our economy, baring unwanted load of your kind and all of that for what?

I gave you the reason, it was the afghan war against the soviets, we were a buffer between you and the soviets, you let us in to use us against the russians. Tell me how did we ruin your economy? no rants please, talk about facts.

So that in end we hear the same Afghans talking about the breakage about Pakistan, sparing no moment where they could spew out venom against Pakistan.

Only pashtoons of afghanistan want to break your country, and they are the only ones who are loved by pakistanis-be it gov or public.

About the UN paying us.....you got to be joking. How much do you think they payed us and them compare that with the load our economy suffered. I'm sure you can do the maths.

No sorry i cant do the maths!! You tell me the details and how we made your economy suffered.

Rest of your post is a mere rant. Because in your entire so called history Afghanistan is the reason for the instability in this region. Half of the time either you called in the Russians or now the Americans are there and really you have the audacity to accuse us of harboring terrorist.

We barely were the owner of our own destination, the superpowers and regional powers were/are playing with our fate, we were never given the chance of our own country. And please kindly remove the names of the kings of Khorasan such as Mahmoud and Ahmad Shah from your misiles if we are that bad.

Look at the amount of drugs being produced by your country and its direct impact on others specially Pakistan because we have a pours border.

Opium production in Afghanistan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

We never had drug problem in our country before war, thanks to the imposed war on us, we got all the problems now.

P.S My posts are hardly emotional. What i have said is what i truly believe in

And you called us bastard on top of other stupid things.......

and yes it does have weight because in the end its my country that is being effected at the hands of your ungrateful people.

How?

So please spare us the BS and go back to your own country. We have had enough.

That is the only thing i agree with you, yes, we need to go back.
 

The Soviet Afghan war was not our war and definitely gave us a lot of problems in return for the money. We were forced into the war and believe me it was not for money.

How were you force into it brother? i cant understand it.

It is a well known fact that the Kalashnikov and drugs culture seeped into Pakistan after the Afghan refugees came.

Lets dont put all the problems of paksitan on Afghan refugees, it wont help you at all. I dont deny the fact that the refugees have brought some problems to pakistan, but they have brought good things too, it is natural. But if guys try to put every blame on us which they always do, then i can tell you tehy are going on the wrong path. Drug cultivation and gun culture was proud part of Pakistan's tribal areas long before we came to pakistan. We never had gun/drug in our country before the russians, weapons starting to come to Afghanistan from the Soviets and from Pakistan, Pakistan and america plus their Arab/non Arab allies poured weapons and amunitions in Afghanistan and all of them came to Afghanistan from Pakistan, please dont accuse us of gun culture in pakistan.

The reason why Pakistan has terrorists or links to terrorists is also because of the same reason.

Zia and Americans founded such an evil that the same evil is biting them, we didnt have extremism in Afghanistan before,i am sure pakistan didnt have either.

What i don't understand is, if Pakistan is so bad a place where the Afghan refugees have to do the worst jobs and are treated very badly, why even after the war ended they stayed in Pakistan?

Because pakistan is still much better than afghanistan, the standard of life way too high, when i said the worst of jobs, i meant the worst jobs for paksitanis, afghans had to it to survive, people are not complaing about pakistan, criticizing the politics of GoP is an entirely differnet thing.

Why most of them applied for Pakistani nationality when they could have gone back to their own country?

Another misconception by pakistani freinds, we never applied for pak citizenship, every single of them are refugees, not nationals of paksitan.
 
According to the Afghan citizen card issued by Nadra and agreement between UNHCR and Pakistan Govt they can live in Pakistan till 2012 ..... The operation might be against those who are not living legally. As Pakistan govt gave them a chance to register themself for free......
 
How were you force into it brother? i cant understand it.

We were forced into it because US couldn't enter it openly as it would have triggered a much bigger war, the only country bordering Afghanistan that could have been "influenced" by US to help them with a capable enough "Army" was unfortunately Pakistan. Now do you understand?

Lets dont put all the problems of paksitan on Afghan refugees, it wont help you at all. I dont deny the fact that the refugees have brought some problems to pakistan, but they have brought good things too, it is natural.

Pardon me but i would really like to have one or two examples of the "good things" as you have put.

Drug cultivation and gun culture was proud part of Pakistan's tribal areas long before we came to pakistan. We never had gun/drug in our country before the russians, weapons starting to come to Afghanistan from the Soviets and from Pakistan, Pakistan and america plus their Arab/non Arab allies poured weapons and amunitions in Afghanistan and all of them came to Afghanistan from Pakistan, please dont accuse us of gun culture in pakistan.

I would request you to read this first, i know you know your own history better than anyone but at times we tend to omit some things for our own satisfaction.

Opium production in Afghanistan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Pakistan didn't force USSR to attack you, if USA and Pakistan helped you to defeat them you want to imply they shouldn't have? Would you have been better off had USA not helped you? OK they had their own benefit in it but if they didn't where would Afghanistan be today? Pakistan was the ultimate looser in that war no matter how you look at it.

Zia and Americans founded such an evil that the same evil is biting them, we didnt have extremism in Afghanistan before,i am sure pakistan didnt have either.

I cannot digest this coming from an Afghan i am sorry. What ever Zia and America did it ultimately helped you defeat the Soviets didn't it? The Afghan war ended in 1989 with the dissolution of USSR, what did you do from then till the US attack in 2002? How did you improve your economy? by cultivating drugs and terrorists?
Because pakistan is still much better than afghanistan, the standard of life way too high, when i said the worst of jobs, i meant the worst jobs for paksitanis, afghans had to it to survive, people are not complaing about pakistan, criticizing the politics of GoP is an entirely differnet thing.

Believe me there are a lot of Pakistani's who are doing the "worst" jobs and there is no such job that the Pakistani's think "Undo-able"
Another misconception by pakistani freinds, we never applied for pak citizenship, every single of them are refugees, not nationals of paksitan.

Here's an interesting article for you to ponder upon.

Islamabad: Govt cancels over 80,000 CNICs issued to Afghan refugees | Pakistan Criminal Records
 
And please kindly remove the names of the kings of Khorasan such as Mahmoud and Ahmad Shah from your misiles if we are that bad.

I wasn't going to reply to this but i am sick of it afghans accusing us pakistanis of stealing their heroes name, What name ?

Mahmud of Ghazni was turk neither pushtun nor tajik who make up majority of population
Abdali was a pushtun born in Multan pakistan(suleiman mountains in pakistan are birthplace of pushtoon)
Ghauri had a pathetic military carrier and was defeated by hindus armies twice and was killed by punjabi gakkhar tribe, he should have his name removed from our missile

At the time of Mahmud of Ghazna, Most of Afghanistan was ruled by hindu shahi while sindh and south punjab was a muslim arab kingdom


Lastly There was no such thing as afghanistan about thousands years ago
Mahmud of Ghazna was a king of Zabul which included parts of pakistani balochistan and eastern khyber pakhtoonkhwa, He is as much a hero of pakistan as is afghanistan,

Most afgans are bigoted towards turks, make fun of them and call them immigrants
 
I suggest having strict laws about the. If the break them, deportion should be result. They are ruining the nation and must be deported, but with a strong reason!
 
I gave you the reason, it was the afghan war against the soviets, we were a buffer between you and the soviets, you let us in to use us against the russians. Tell me how did we ruin your economy? no rants please, talk about facts.



Only pashtoons of afghanistan want to break your country, and they are the only ones who are loved by pakistanis-be it gov or public.



No sorry i cant do the maths!! You tell me the details and how we made your economy suffered.



We barely were the owner of our own destination, the superpowers and regional powers were/are playing with our fate, we were never given the chance of our own country. And please kindly remove the names of the kings of Khorasan such as Mahmoud and Ahmad Shah from your misiles if we are that bad.



We never had drug problem in our country before war, thanks to the imposed war on us, we got all the problems now.



And you called us bastard on top of other stupid things.......



How?



That is the only thing i agree with you, yes, we need to go back.

I will counter your post latter but first this:

Pakistan and the Afghan Refugees

Pervaiz Iqbal Cheema

Governor of Balochistan Justice (retd) Amirul Mengal's recent assertion that Pakistan is not really in a position to bear the burden of more Afghan refugees seems logical. Reminding the UN Undersecretary-General for Humanitarian Affairs Mr.Kenzo Oshima Mr. Mengal highlighted the fact that Pakistan has been playing host to more than two million Afghan refugees for the last 20 years. Similarly the refusal of NWFP's Governor to accept any more Afghan refugees are indeed appears to be convincing and well founded. Those who have already entered or are still pouring into Pakistan because of the porous nature of Pak-Afghan border, enormous sympathies among the Pakistanis on this side of the Durand Line, humanitarian considerations, and guarded reluctance to enforce strict security system at the borders have enormously increased the existing burden.

The initial influx of the Afghan refugees started almost immediately after Sardar Daud's coup in 1973 but the large-scale migration began to take place after the Saur revolution in April 1978. The subsequent events like the introduction of Hafizullah Amin's hurriedly prepared reforms and Soviet invasion of Afghanistan in December 1979 accelerated the flow of refugees at an alarming pace. Approximately 20,00 to 100,000 Afghan refugees walked into Pakistan almost every month soon to touch the four million mark. By any yardstick this number of refugees was too large for Pakistan to provide for even the basic needs and requirements.

Just as the numbers of the Afghan refugees were overwhelming, the nature and extent of problems emanating from refugee concentration in bordering provinces of Pakistan were equally frightening. Although mere feeding and housing of three to four million Afghan people confronted Pakistan with complex difficulties of alarming magnitude, the government and the people of Pakistan especially those of NWPF and Balochistan were able to cope with the problems rather admirably.

While many outsiders including UNHCR, WFP, UNICEF, WHO, FAO along with many independent relief agencies and humanitarian groups helped Pakistani authorities in their massive relief operation, the major burden in terms of total expenditure incurred was borne by the Pakistanis. Generally it is stated that roughly around fifty percent of the expenditure incurred was cuffed up by the Pakistani sources. In addition to financial burden, Pakistan was lumbered with many complex problems that were less obvious but extremely disturbing. The refugees not only introduced ethno-demographic imbalances within certain areas of Pakistan but also substantively contributed to complex social, economic, political and security problems.

Until the advent of the 80s organized terrorism was virtually absent in Pakistan. But with the influx of refugees, Pakistan began to experience acts of terrorism in varied forms. The province of NWFP was particularly at the receiving end. The Kabul regime had managed to penetrate into the great reservoirs of resistance; namely the refugee camps. In fact it was commonly believed in Pakistan at the time that many saboteurs had come into Pakistan in the guise of refugees who indulged in many acts of terrorism. In addition the internal feuds between various resistance groups and factions also manifested in different forms of irresponsible acts of terrorism.

Acts of terrorism not only continued even after the signing of the Geneva Accords of 1988 and subsequent establishment of the Mujahideen's own government but increased enormously. Part of the contributions came from Indian Agency RAW's concerted nefarious activities following the intensification of Kashmiris' struggle for self-determination. Soon the agreed governing formulas degenerated into discords and varied groups of Mujahideen started an unending struggle for power and Afghanistan plunged into a fierce civil war. It has not yet been able to extricate itself from the clutches of civil war. Apart from making period peace efforts and sending food and other necessary food supplies, Pakistan refrained rather scrupulously from getting deeply entangled in the ongoing civil war. Yet Pakistan continued to experience acts of terrorism.

Apart from acts of terrorism, the presence of large number of Afghan refugees caused many political problems. Ordinarily an external crisis tends to have unifying effect internally but the impact of Afghan refugees largely divided the Pakistanis. Besides the influx of refugees caused ethnic imbalance in some areas of Pakistan resulting into periodic violent clashes. In addition, an intense debate raged for quite sometimes over the question whether or not the refugees would go back to Afghanistan. Despite the Soviet withdrawal from Afghanistan not many refugees opted to go back. Admittedly the ongoing civil war deterred then from returning to their homeland, but one has to be fair to the Pakistanis and not expect them to absorb such a large number of Afghans into Pakistani society.

Because of the Afghan refugees unwillingness to return to their homeland Pakistan had to experience innumerable economic and social problems, some of which gave birth to security problems. Apart from incurring cost in monetary terms, the provision of fodder for animals (cattle, sheep, goat and camel etc.) population of the Afghan refugees, deforestation, increase in rent that pushed it beyond the capacities of the locals, taking shares in both transport and construction businesses and increasing competition for the locals, increasing unemployment, injecting corruption practices for securing the much desired Pakistani identity cards, introducing Kalashnikov culture, intensification of sectarianism, poppy cultivation and drug trafficking along with massive increase in crime rates were and in many ways still are just some of the problems that were the product of hosting such a large number of Afghan refugees.

With the ongoing civil war, chronic draught, shattered economy, and the approaching winter thousands of Afghans were already trekking their way out of Afghanistan into the neighbouring countries. For obvious reasons Pakistan always attracted disproportionately much higher numbers. While the peace-patches have not been long and frequent, the renewed fighting between the Taliban regime and Northern Alliance has also been causing the flight of the refugees. In addition, the threat of impending American strike has further exasperated the situation.

Following the 11th September suicide attacks on Trade Towers in New York and Pentagon in Washington, all aid shipments to Afghanistan were stopped and the foreign workers pulled out of the country. After a gap of three weeks the aid agencies have restarted to send food to Afghanistan with reservations. Insuring that the aid reaches the right and needy groups of people along with the availability of truckers to move the food and essential goods seem to be the two most frequently expressed concerns of some of the donors.

It has been augured by some quarters that roughly two to three millions Afghans refugees are likely to enter Pakistan once the American strikes begin against the Taliban regime in Afghanistan. Anticipating such a large influx of new Afghan refugees. Both the Pakistani authorities and the UNHCR are assessing the basic amount that would cater for the bear minimum needs of the incoming refugees. While one can appreciate that the need for such preparations for anticipated influx of refugees, the efforts should also be concentrated how to motivate the refugees to go back to Afghanistan and lesson the burden ob Pakistan. It needs to stressed here that since Soviet withdrawal from Afghanistan only two millions out of the total of four millions refugees went back to their homeland. And after a short while even some of them came back to Pakistan.

Undoubtedly the coming humanitarian crisis is likely to further burden Pakistan and the international community need to undertake measures that would ensure that Pakistan is not once again left in lurch as was done in the past. Being next door to Afghanistan, Pakistan has suffered in many ways. Not only it has and continues to play host to a very large number of Afghan refuges despite its weak economy, it has tried its best to avert the coming crisis through diplomatic means. It has consistently extended sustained support to alleviate miseries of the Afghan people. Despite its economic difficulties, the limited resources, the past experience with donor agencies who left the entire problem of Afghan refugees to the Pakistanis, the people and the governments of Pakistan have always cared for the welfare of the Afghan people. The expressed concerns of the two Governors merely points towards the upper limits of Pakistanis patience, hospitality, and ability to cope with already over-burdened situation.

IPRI :: Islamabad Policy Research Institute

I have highlighted major parts from the article of some to which i am a witness myself such as the increasing of rents and loss of jobs etc.
 
^^^ i didnt read the article, but for god's sake send them all back and stop moaning.
 
assalam alaikum

My pakistani brothers in Saudia there r many illegals and they also do crimes including our pakistani brothers but when there is an action against them (sending them back to their countries ) these same ppl get the sympathy. If there r some criminals in the afghan refugees book them but don't accuse all the refugees and gali day nay ki zaroorat nahi hay plz

i hope our brother in post 21 is right.

Ahmad we don't love or care for only pushtoon, After the soviets left afghanistan some ethnics gained more then what their actual percentage of the population and they dont want to let these gains go away they opted for the help of other countries don't wanna name them now,We put our weight behind pushtoons coz we belived afghanistan will not be peacful if pushtoons r not given their right share. How right we were look at afghanistan all the ethnic parties (not including pushtoons) including SUPER POWER AND NATO could not provide peace in aghanistan since 10 years and can go on for how long we don' know.

We saw and know what the tajiks say about us after the fall of kabul and i guess the qila janji ( dont know how to pronounce) and the killing of ppl in containers
uzbuks were along with the americans and some of the killed were maybe pakistanies but we didnot take on tajiks or uzbuks.

Ahmad i m glad atleast u said something good about pakistan since u always seem to find only bad things about pakistan and mostly tend to appreciate the post of the indians against us, thank u

TARIQ
 
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Ahmad we don't love or care for only pushtoon, After the soviets left afghanistan some ethnics gained more then what their actual percentage of the population and they dont want to let these gains go away they opted for the help of other countries don't wanna name them now,We put our weight behind pushtoons coz we belived afghanistan will not be peacful if pushtoons r not given their right share. How right we were look at afghanistan all the ethnic parties (not including pushtoons) including SUPER POWER AND NATO could not provide peace in aghanistan since 10 years and can go on for how long we don' know.

We saw and know what the tajiks say about us after the fall of kabul and i guess the qila janji ( dont know how to pronounce) and the killing of ppl in containers
uzbuks were along with the americans and some of the killed were maybe pakistanies but we didnot take on tajiks or uzbuks.

I will send you a pm regarding this, as i dont think this thread is irrelivant to it.

Ahmad i m glad atleast u said something good about pakistan since u always seem to find only bad things about pakistan and mostly tend to appreciate the post of the indians against us, thank u

TARIQ

I thank anybody if their post is in line with my thinking, not unnecessary thanking, i am thanking pakistanis everyday.
 
^^^ i didnt read the article, but for god's sake send them all back and stop moaning.

Sorry to say but this is exactly the thankless attitude that we have received from Afghan refugees. Neither you nor us at this forum can do anything about it except admitting what is right and what is wrong.
 
Sorry to say but this is exactly the thankless attitude that we have received from Afghan refugees. Neither you nor us at this forum can do anything about it except admitting what is right and what is wrong.

Perhaps you havent seen my previous posts before how much i personally was and still is thankfull to pakistani public for letting us in their country. put yourself in my shoes and tell me how will you react if somebody calls every single of you Bastard and Put every sigle problem of his country on you? you are a sensible man and you tell me....
 
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