JF-17: Low Level Strike (Concept)

[MastanKhan]

I really wish China has capabilities to *steal* whole top secret flight designs from blueprints to metallurgy all the way down to all flight control systems From the country with most advanced IT technologies and most sophisticated security system. Who had been in spy war with USSR for more than half century.
Why people even doubt what you said? No questions should be ever asked.

And I remember you also claimed China didn't chose FC-31 is because it's a copy of F-35 and China dare not to anger USA, a man of wisdom indeed

Hi,

Metallurgy is where the US sabotaged the chinese industrial complex---. The americans knew that they would not be able to hold back the chinese regarding the design---.

But metallurgy---that is where they killed the chinese fighter aircraft engine production---chinese developed engine's critical components failing at or around 200 hours mark---which means a very well invested time frame and funds---.

At the first component failure---chinese assumed it was their own fault---at the second failure---they though they had missed a critical step---at the third time failure---they began to realize it was a metallurgy sabotage regarding the composition and percentages of metals in the product---.

Since then they have been trying and trying to get the composition right---.

 

[PeacefulWar]

Hi,

Metallurgy is where the US sabotaged the chinese industrial complex---. The americans knew that they would not be able to hold back the chinese regarding the design---.

But metallurgy---that is where they killed the chinese fighter aircraft engine production---chinese developed engine's critical components failing at or around 200 hours mark---which means a very well invested time frame and funds---.

At the first component failure---chinese assumed it was their own fault---at the second failure---they though they had missed a critical step---at the third time failure---they began to realize it was a metallurgy sabotage regarding the composition and percentages of metals in the product---.

Since then they have been trying and trying to get the composition right---.

China can steal the metallurgy by hacking into US network. Piece of cake.
After all, you claim China steal the whole design and technology of F22 and F35, why left metallurgy behind?
Maybe the hacker happened to run out of disk when copy documents?

Anyway I can sense that you have never involved into any researching related work, so I understand why you have these *interesting* ideas.

 

[MastanKhan]

China can steal the metallurgy by hacking into US network. Piece of cake.
After all, you claim China steal the whole design and technology of F22 and F35, why left metallurgy behind?
Maybe the hacker happened to run out of disk when copy documents?

Anyway I can sense that you have never involved into any researching related work, so I understand why you have these *interesting* ideas.

Hi,

The design of the aircraft is in the " VISIBLE SPECTRUM "---so someone stealing it and with the modern computers---they can do wonders---.

Then there is a lots of stuff on the public forum---that is full of information---that stuff is known in the as " works of fiction "---the books with theior shiny and fancy covers that you see in the book stores---.

That is the best source of leaking the material---. But the metal composition is such a science and an art---and there are so many different variable involved---that it is next to impossible to copy that technology an steal it---.

Just like the damascus Blade---till modern times---no one could match their strength or could find the technique how to make it---yet it was available to all who could buy it----.

There is a certain degree of monstrosity behind the american thinking---they are extremely secretive & devious in their planning---.

They are a firm believer of " control the controllable "---see what the chinese thought as a piece of pie turned out to be a piece of cactus with thorns---.

The chinese are so deep in investment in their engine program---that they cannot get out even if they want to---.

 

[DrWatson775]

China can steal the metallurgy by hacking into US network. Piece of cake.
After all, you claim China steal the whole design and technology of F22 and F35, why left metallurgy behind?
Maybe the hacker happened to run out of disk when copy documents?

Anyway I can sense that you have never involved into any researching related work, so I understand why you have these *interesting* ideas.

Corporate/R&D Intel 101 : if you know someone is going to steal something, make a wrong/sabotaged but somewhat 'working' version available enough so they can steal it but protect it enough so as not to raise suspicion. Hence delay the process as much as possible if completely stopping it is beyond reach.

 

[PeacefulWar]

Corporate/R&D Intel 101 : if you know someone is going to steal something, make a wrong/sabotaged but somewhat 'working' version available enough so they can steal it but protect it enough so as not to raise suspicion. Hence delay the process as much as possible if completely stopping it is beyond reach.

LOL
You never worked on any R&D related projects, that's why you guys will make up all kinds of fantasy ideas.
That's all I can say.

 

[MastanKhan]

Corporate/R&D Intel 101 : if you know someone is going to steal something, make a wrong/sabotaged but somewhat 'working' version available enough so they can steal it but protect it enough so as not to raise suspicion. Hence delay the process as much as possible if completely stopping it is beyond reach.

Hi,

That is an age old trick---.

If it was all about R&D---china would have been far ahead in fighter aircraft engine building---but is still struggling---.

Why---because building a successful fighter aircraft engine is tantamount to have gained alien technology of some kind---.

You have to ask the question---what does the US know that its fighter aircraft engines are longer lasting and far superior in performance than anything else---.

What is it about the US R&D that china has a hard time with its fighter aircraft engine building---.

 

[Armchair]

@MastanKhan

MK it's been such a long journey. Ah, those days you were ridiculed, chided, insulted, attacked in every way possible, including by mods, who would silently allow such attacks and even engage themselves in attacking you. I played a tiny role too - but I think the argument eventually got through to the PN, who had till then only relied on the PAF for fighter aircraft acquisition expertise.

This is the value of an open forum where all opinions and ideas are allowed to be discussed without censor. The best ideas win. And when those ideas get implemented into policy, it changes the world, and gives one's own group a competitive advantage against other mindless zombie nations.

 

[The Raven]

@MastanKhan

MK it's been such a long journey. Ah, those days you were ridiculed, chided, insulted, attacked in every way possible, including by mods, who would silently allow such attacks and even engage themselves in attacking you. I played a tiny role too - but I think the argument eventually got through to the PN, who had till then only relied on the PAF for fighter aircraft acquisition expertise.

This is the value of an open forum where all opinions and ideas are allowed to be discussed without censor. The best ideas win. And when those ideas get implemented into policy, it changes the world, and gives one's own group a competitive advantage against other mindless zombie nations.

Not quite. Before you and MK get carried away with your self-congratulatory back slapping, there's that minor inconvenience called reality. Besides, why would the PN listen to a couple of random Joes who think they know better than the PN?! Talk about delusions of grandeur!

 

[MastanKhan]

Not quite. Before you and MK get carried away with your self-congratulatory back slapping, there's that minor inconvenience called reality. Besides, why would the PN listen to a couple of random Joes who think they know better than the PN?! Talk about delusions of grandeur!

Hi,

So---you come from the school of thought that Baray Abbaji ( Grandfather ) knows everything---.

 

[MastanKhan]

LOL
You never worked on any R&D related projects, that's why you guys will make up all kinds of fantasy ideas.
That's all I can say.

Hi,

And you have no clue about the " deciet of the good ole white boys "---the americans.

Sonny boy---even the devil shies away from their treachery and deceit.

You talk about R&D projects---it will take china maybe 50 + years to make the J58 engine---the one the americans designed in the late 50's.

 

[MastanKhan]

@MastanKhan

MK it's been such a long journey. Ah, those days you were ridiculed, chided, insulted, attacked in every way possible, including by mods, who would silently allow such attacks and even engage themselves in attacking you. I played a tiny role too - but I think the argument eventually got through to the PN, who had till then only relied on the PAF for fighter aircraft acquisition expertise.

This is the value of an open forum where all opinions and ideas are allowed to be discussed without censor. The best ideas win. And when those ideas get implemented into policy, it changes the world, and gives one's own group a competitive advantage against other mindless zombie nations.

Hi,

What made you say that today---?

 

[PakFactor]

Not quite. Before you and MK get carried away with your self-congratulatory back slapping, there's that minor inconvenience called reality. Besides, why would the PN listen to a couple of random Joes who think they know better than the PN?! Talk about delusions of grandeur!

This is the issue, we always think the higher ups know better like our elders who keep saying, Ham na Dunya dhaki. I always asked those elders out of respect have they gone to Japan and China? Majority have never left their village. The difference between the South Asian and Western way of thinking is that ideas flow from bottom and implemented accordingly at the top. Officers at the top can also make mistakes none are perfect we need to get rid of this ya Bacha ha mentality, in America more young create wealth after looking at how elders have screwed up and they perfect things.

@MastanKhan @Armchair

 

[The Raven]

This is the issue, we always think the higher ups know better like our elders who keep saying, Ham na Dunya dhaki. I always asked those elders out of respect have they gone to Japan and China? Majority have never left their village. The difference between the South Asian and Western way of thinking is that ideas flow from bottom and implemented accordingly at the top. Officers at the top can also make mistakes none are perfect we need to get rid of this ya Bacha ha mentality, in America more young create wealth after looking at how elders have screwed up and they perfect things.

@MastanKhan @Armchair

False analogy. It's not a case of placing the armed forces on a pedestal. Unless you're a member of the senior leadership in the military, we're not privy to the details and available resources that they have. It's easy for any Tom Dick and Harry to criticise from the outside, but when people who rely on Google think they can do a better job than the military, then they're delusional to say the least. The military are run by humans, of course they'll make mistakes, but to call them incompetent and useless simply because they don't induct an outdated and largely irrelevant fighter (JH-7) simply because you're a fan of the aircraft, is bordering on ignorant narcissisism.

 

[araz]

False analogy. It's not a case of placing the armed forces on a pedestal. Unless you're a member of the senior leadership in the military, we're not privy to the details and available resources that they have. It's easy for any Tom Dick and Harry to criticise from the outside, but when people who rely on Google think they can do a better job than the military, then they're delusional to say the least. The military are run by humans, of course they'll make mistakes, but to call them incompetent and useless simply because they don't induct an outdated and largely irrelevant fighter (JH-7) simply because you're a fan of the aircraft, is bordering on ignorant narcissisism.

I could not have put it better. In a previous life when Mr MK was not on my ignore list he argued that goving in to Asif Zardari's request for a 400 million $ add on to the M2K price was entirely justifiable and therefore the person who did no acceed to that demand was incompetant. This was at least done to the very person who refused to acceed to that demand so one can opine that he was expressing an opinion.
A

 

[PakFactor]

False analogy. It's not a case of placing the armed forces on a pedestal. Unless you're a member of the senior leadership in the military, we're not privy to the details and available resources that they have. It's easy for any Tom Dick and Harry to criticise from the outside, but when people who rely on Google think they can do a better job than the military, then they're delusional to say the least. The military are run by humans, of course they'll make mistakes, but to call them incompetent and useless simply because they don't induct an outdated and largely irrelevant fighter (JH-7) simply because you're a fan of the aircraft, is bordering on ignorant narcissisism.

I didn’t say they are useless or advocated for JH-7 itself. All I’m saying due to PAF
controlling the AC, PN has never been able to create a dedicated air arm for air cover and suffered due to it. Our enemy next door has a dedicated air arm while ours is controlled by AF and decision is up to them how to use the AC. If the AF needs those planes for other missions PN would be left open from air attacks. If I’m not mistaken it was retired PN Chiefs during the ‘65 and ‘71 Wars that saw this short coming and subsequent Chiefs haven’t done anything to rectify the situation. So their is an obvious learning curve issue in the branches of the military.

The other reason I lay the issue with the Chiefs of Armed Forces during critical times after ‘65 & ‘71 they refused to give access to enough funds to build up the Navy. None thought if your under naval blockade you lose one of two access to trading routes and at the mercy of your enemy.