JF-17 and LCA development comparison

[SQ8]

Mate, we gotta disagree here because nothing is specified or specific. General terms - composite research and small scale manufacture?

In any case take my words to the extent you think i am right, and i take your words in the same - pending more details to emerge on Pakistan's industrial and research infrastructure to come up.

Specifics are very unlikely considering the nature of the research carried out within SPD.
But as an example for specific, Pakistan is fully capable of producing RAM coated tiles and RAM paint/putty.

 

[Donatello]

Yup. Self reliance. However we did not have the technological ability to create anything more advanced than the LCA. And thus we had to put a limit there.



There are 3 phases here:
1. Assembling - from CKD, SKD
2. Licenced Manufacture
3. Building from your own designs

Well mate, as of now Pakistan is assembling JF-17 from kits. Its not building them. If you think of Pakistan being self sufficient is assembling JF-17 then you dont have an idea that India has been building not just assembling planes for a really long time now.
That line that you have at Kamra right now - it assembles, not even licensed manufacture at the moment.

In about 3 years they start licence manufacturing - only some items, not even 50% of the plane.

The point of LCA was to develop our own indigenous components that go in that plane, not just buy everything from different sources and assemble them. How far along is Pakistan in that? Yes im NOT talking even about even licensed manufacture, im talking about building from your own design using your own technology.

If PAF had more money, they would have gone for assembling J-10's - customizing them as well as they dont like what the Chinese have right now.

They would have put up an assembly line for J-10's. Maybe after 5 years, they would have gone on to license manufacture of many items from that plane. They wouldnt be with JF-17's.

Well we all know now how crapfully and embarrassingly that indigenous LCA failed. Where first batch of 50 aircraft are ready w.r.t to JF-17, LCA's future in India's own armed forces is not even clear. I mean, LCA didn't impress at home, let alone the world.

So how about we cut with your usual rhetoric and B.S and let the thread be an informative thread for JF-17 only?

Shall we?? hain hain?

MODs please clean up off topic posts.

Thank you.

 

[Viper0011.]

Sorry my lord. This labourer still cannot spell and work even after donated jobs

Is that the ONLY come back you have?? Couldn't respond to sheet so you got to the spellings???

If you see where I am from....the word is spelled 'LABOR' not 'LABOUR'. Your Anglo-British English sounds like French when you say 'La-Bour' lol.

 

[MilSpec]

Well we all know now how crapfully and embarrassingly that indigenous LCA failed. Where first batch of 50 aircraft are ready w.r.t to JF-17, LCA's future in India's own armed forces is not even clear. I mean, LCA didn't impress at home, let alone the world.

So how about we cut with your usual rhetoric and B.S and let the thread be an informative thread for JF-17 only?

Shall we?? hain hain?

MODs please clean up off topic posts.

Thank you.

O.T. "didn't impress at home, let alone the world." have I heard similar rhetoric somewhere? maybe...

Anyways there was no need to drag LCA and and anti-Indian rhetoric in an information thread. Any plans of PAC Kamra to build the radar inhouse. It may be the best investment in terms of research and infrastructure that pakistan can make, if it hasn't already.

 

[EagleEyes]

Discuss here rather than derailing quality threads with off topic comparison discussions.

 

[fatman17]

we r giving another chance to bash and troll each other.

 

[BATMAN]

The biggest comparative fact Teja is paper plane, while JFT is already war hardy.Another Teja fact Indian would like to hide is that all world tried to build it but DRDO managed to fail them all. Another little known fact that till 2007 the cockpit of Teja was all analogue.

 

[Edevelop]

LCA should be placed in a museum now.....

 

[Contrarian]

LCA should be placed in a museum now.....

Nope. LCA already exceeds what JF-17 is technologically and is built using Indian designs and in India-which is not the case for JF-17.

That however doesnt matter, because its not operational. Even if it was made out of gold but still not operational, it is futile to compare.

JF-17 is available for operations today, something that is not even close for LCA and unlikely for a good long while.

P.S: Zakii you have got to be kidding me that you deleted my post in which i didnt say anything offensive at all, merely quoted the posts, yet have posts talking about brainless Indians and donated jobs stay!

 

[BATMAN]

Even an ignorant can tell Teja is a failed copy attempt of mirage1.
While technology employed in JFT can be found only in JSF.

 

[Mujraparty]

does Pakistan have wind tunnel testing facility ..?

 

[MilSpec]

This took an interesting turn.....



LCA has brought some key elements that will be greatly beneficial:

CFC composites, prepregs and wet lam, all materials developed though testing-modification cycles indigenously. Strength parameters exceed anything out there in the off the shelf market. CFC used extensively throughout bay panels, spars, skins, air brakes. Even the tailfin, rudder, elevons, are made from CFC- titanium combos. Fatigue life of the composite airframe outguns metal structures by miles. Crack propagation in the airframe due to rivet holes is eliminated.
Monolithic Tailfin is another achievement, matched by none other.

Indigenous development of landing gear, now it might seem like a simple thing to do, but every russian aircraft I have had the opportunity to work on has presented one big problem, huge disparity in the total life cycle of the airframe and the landing gear. Even in some cases the life of main landing gear and nose landing gear is different. Huge problem is posed in terms of overhauling and maintaining spares. LCA tejas landing gear is matched to the airframe, (apparently thats one of the big weight additions, requested to be changed for naval version )

I dont have a good understanding of avionics so someone else might be able to shed better light on this topic, but all imported components of the avionics and are specified by us and tailor made to IAF's test team requirements, similar to what I imagine was done on FC1 by Catic for PAF.

All hydraulics components for control system are optimized and designed in accordance and quite a few components are sourced from private parties as it doesn't really make sense to set up an entire machine shop for valves, actuators, etc.

Radar systems are a huge blessing in disguise, I am sure pakistani members will take a dig at the radar, but joint development with Elta has reaped huge benefits (green pine anyone?), and ARDE will get a huge head start compared to others. LRDE is already working on an AESA radar. Research in this field supplanted by LCA will have huge potentials.

RWR, SPS, and MAW systems all will be indigenous on the production models.


Irrespective of the delays, the achievements and capabilities LCA project has brought to NAL, LRDE, ADA, and ADE are astounding.

 

[BlueDot_in_Space]

Nope. LCA already exceeds what JF-17 is technologically and is built using Indian designs and in India-which is not the case for JF-17.

That however doesnt matter, because its not operational. Even if it was made out of gold but still not operational, it is futile to compare.

JF-17 is available for operations today, something that is not even close for LCA and unlikely for a good long while.

P.S: Zakii you have got to be kidding me that you deleted my post in which i didnt say anything offensive at all, merely quoted the posts, yet have posts talking about brainless Indians and donated jobs stay!

Comparing the maturity level of the two planes is futile as we have alot of official information and videos on LCA tejas like weapon trials etc and very minimal official information about JF17 tests. We do not know much about JF17 maturity level like what kind of tests have been performed so far for example high AOA testing, load testing, spin recovery, buffet testing wake penetration test etc.

 

[Zarvan]

JF-17 has been produced really fast and has started the service to in Pakistan Air Force and soon Block II will be also in service of Pakistan but LCA is no where to be seen even though India started working on it long before PAF started its work on JF-17 Thunder

 

[BlueDot_in_Space]

The biggest comparative fact Teja is paper plane, while JFT is already war hardy.Another Teja fact Indian would like to hide is that all world tried to build it but DRDO managed to fail them all. Another little known fact that till 2007 the cockpit of Teja was all analogue.

Another Fact is ignorance is bliss.