Israel concerned: Saudi Air Force to outnumber Israel's advanced US jet

[agentny17]

Actually no there were better options. I laughed and cried when I read the soviets wanted to test out if the canons on Egyptians Migs was enough to shoot down an upcoming missile so they instructed pilots to aim their canons at the missiles and fire....that didn't turn out so well.....

Better options as in better soviet weapons, right ?... The Soviet Union didn't give the best they had to Egypt, but its their weapons, we don't get to decide, they do.

 

[kobiraaz]

Sounds more like a dream team than anything else

My dream team where messi and ozil play together.

 

[agentny17]

They were not so "technologically inferior" actually read my other posts to see for yourself.

In the 60's, 70's, the Soviet Jets were 2 generations inferior to American Jets, and they gave Egypt an inferior genration to what they had. The US gave Israel the best they had, so Egypt Jets were about 3 generations inferior Israel's Jets.

 

[Mosamania]

No but you can blame them for making your jets gun/missile fodder

Al-Shazeli one of the only Arab generals I truly respect saw through their ploy and called for kicking them out of the country. Very very clever , extremely clever even you know why? It served a double purpose:

1-make the Israelis think Egyptians need more time to reorganize their forces after this move so they were calm before the surprise attack on October.
2-Clear the field for more independent descion making and cleaning out possible Israeli spies within the soviets (there was a couple).

Really great man who I respect greatly. Did you know after the war Israel realized it will only keep on existing if they have nukes cause Arabs apparently learn fast and are very capable independently something they thought otherwise.

 

[untitled]

My dream team where messi and ozil play together.

I had to Google your reply but still did not get it.

You used some football metaphor that is all I know

 

[Mosamania]

Better options as in better soviet weapons, right ?... The Soviet Union didn't give the best they had to Egypt, but its their weapons, we don't get to decide, they do.

Actually as a buyer you have every right to demand whatever weapons from the supplier. But then again didn't I emphasize the danger of soviet advisors? And to your second post you need to clearly read more into military subjects. You are suggesting that Egypt used WW2 era planes you know. So no the soviets DID provide jets they have in service....however they only did that to carry out experiments on Egyptian AirForce.

 

[untitled]

In the 60's, 70's, the Soviet Jets were 2 generations inferior to American Jets, and they ...

Jets even inferior to the MiG-21 (MiG-17s) gave the US Phantoms a run for their money during the Vietnam war.

 

[kobiraaz]

I had to Google your reply but still did not get it.

You used some football metaphor that is all I know

i am a fan of Messi, And i love Ozil too... But messi is loyal to Barcelona and Ozil plays in Real Madrid... So they are enemy basically.... I have to pray for both during barca-madrid match!! They are in my dream team...Like muslim forces, who will never be together .... Imagining them together against israel is like my Messi Ozil in same team.

 

[agentny17]

Actually as a buyer you have every right to demand whatever weapons from the supplier. But then again didn't I emphasize the danger of soviet advisors? And to your second post you need to clearly read more into military subjects. You are suggesting that Egypt used WW2 era planes you know. So no the soviets DID provide jets they have in service....however they only did that to carry out experiments on Egyptian AirForce.

No WW2 era planes, but the MIG-21 that was used in 1960 bu the SU, is not the same one they used in 1973. All i was saying that the capabilities of the MIG-21 that Egypt used, is way inferior to that of the F-4 that Israel used.

 

[Mosamania]

Jets even inferior to the MiG-21 (MiG-17s) gave the US Phantoms a run for their money during the Vietnam war.

Jets even inferior to the MiG-21 (MiG-17s) gave the US Phantoms a run for their money during the Vietnam war.

During the vietnam war because soviets goal was "inflict the maximum amount of damage on US war machine" the soviets advisors really gave their heart into it. One must remember that Israel is composed of a lot of Russian Jews "soviet jews at the time" so they felt sympathy to Israel as well.

 

[agentny17]

Jets even inferior to the MiG-21 (MiG-17s) gave the US Phantoms a run for their money during the Vietnam war.

In wide spread desert, where you can not hide behind mountains, green areas, ect.. Your Air Force is decisive.

 

[Mosamania]

No WW2 era planes, but the MIG-21 that was used in 1960 bu the SU, is not the same one they used in 1973. All i was saying that the capabilities of the MIG-21 that Egypt used, is way inferior to that of the F-4 that Israel used.

We Arabs must and I repeat MUST abandon the whole "it's not our fault it is a conspiracy/inferior" mentality. No the Mig21 was an excellent interceptor built to out maneuver the best the west threw at the soviet union.

It was OUR fault we lost the war. It is our fault we are what we were and it is OUR fault we are what we are now. Until we take responsibility for our actions we will never advance. I do not mean to attack Egypt or Egyptians and you know very well I consider Egypt as mu home as much as I consider Saudi Arabia is. But the people who suffer the most from this mentality is Egyptian people and I think you agree with me. Even Saudis nowadays when you talk to them they will say it was our fault and we must improve ourselves if we wish to wrestle the world in capabilities.

 

[Mosamania]

In wide spread desert, where you can not hide behind mountains, green areas, ect.. Your Air Force is decisive.

In desert warfare historically archers and especially mounted archers were the back bone of the army. Today archers are jets.

 

[agentny17]

We Arabs must and I repeat MUST abandon the whole "it's not our fault it is a conspiracy/inferior" mentality. No the Mig21 was an excellent interceptor built to out maneuver the best the west threw at the soviet union.

It was OUR fault we lost the war. It is our fault we are what we were and it is OUR fault we are what we are now. Until we take responsibility for our actions we will never advance. I do not mean to attack Egypt or Egyptians and you know very well I consider Egypt as mu home as much as I consider Saudi Arabia is. But the people who suffer the most from this mentality is Egyptian people and I think you agree with me. Even Saudis nowadays when you talk to them they will say it was our fault and we must improve ourselves if we wish to wrestle the world in capabilities.

I agree with you 100%, but the Egyptian Air Force was and still way technologically inferior to that of Israel. And till then we CAN NOt win a war with them, like it or not. Over Sinai, the skies are clear 24/7, clea, flat rdesert, no mountains, or anything to hide in. If a jet flies over you, their is no way you can survive. Those are facts.

---------- Post added at 03:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:23 PM ----------

In desert warfare historically archers and especially mounted archers were the back bone of the army. Today archers are jets.

Agree with you. That is why i was saying that your Air Force is a huge advantage, that was a huge disadvatgae for us in the past.

 

[Mosamania]

I agree with you 100%, but the Egyptian Air Force was and still way technologically inferior to that of Israel. And till then we CAN NOt win a war with them, like it or not. Over Sinai, the skies are clear 24/7, clea, flat rdesert, no mountains, or anything to hide in. If a jet flies over you, their is no way you can survive. Those are facts.

---------- Post added at 03:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:23 PM ----------


Agree with you. That is why i was saying that your Air Force is a huge advantage, that was a huge disadvatgae for us in the past.

The main problem with Egyptian air force now is that is is lacking. In two things. Two very decisive things:

1-BVR capability is almost non-existent which means there will be higher percentage of jets downed for Egypt than Israel. Note however Egypt has sparrow and Aims so in close range they can put up one helluva fight but I would still bet on the Israel pythons over those.
2-target and designeatio is kept one generation inferior to that of Egypt. Meaning Israeli litening pods will whip the floor with Egyptian Lantirns. Egyptian requested Sniper pods now but we will see how that turns out. If Egypt has sniper then even though it is not equal it will still give one helluva fight none the less. We make democles pods domestically it's quality is between sniper and lantirn work already started on a domestic one that will rival the Litening even though I doubt we will outclass Israel in this area.