Is PAF ranked top among all Muslim Countries Airforces Now?

[joekrish]

Compared to 90's we have improved in quality then what is the reason that our ranking should decline.

There is no doubt but would you not agree that other countries have added a lot more than you in terms of equipments and tech?

 

[Ahmad Masood]

Being new to forum I surely lack the detailed knowledge but while living in Saudi I see a lot of employment ads for F15 and Typhoon technicians in the paper. Most of the technicians for the RSAF are western expatriates. I am not sure about Pilot training in RSAF also. On the other hand, I have come across some PAF officials working with RSAF as instructors. This somehow proves a point that PAF has more knowledge.
Turkey, everybody knows is doing very well; courtesy of NATO. Doesn't Pakistan lack the technological edge in radar technology, BVR and Air Defence? In my opinion I would rank Pak 3rd.
I have also heard that PAF's main goal is to defend rather than attack. I thought the best air forces are the ones who have the ability to attack.

 

[ejaz007]

I disagree that paf was at technology disadvantage.....

Everyone is fully aware in 1971 paf had middle equipped mirages....where as India despite outnumbering pak by 2 to 1 had inferior technology....paf also had the full backing and training of USA who was ally...

India was fimly the soveit ally and had no USA support....

Today the scenario is reversed India has the techno edge and the nos....over paf....

For me this paf world class pilots is debateble had your no longer considered the USA ally. If anything its the Indians picking up technology and training from the best ie Israel USA and France.....

India had Mig-21's and Su-7's.

IAF had improved Mig-21's better than the ones North Vietnamese air force had and still gave USAF a nightmare.

IAF did not have inferior technology. 

There is no doubt but would you not agree that other countries have added a lot more than you in terms of equipments and tech?

Examples would be appreciated.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

Most people here are talking like an air force is like a computer or an electronic gadget. Newer the gadget that you own---the more superior your capabilities are.

The machines being discussed here are methods of massive death and destruction---.When these machines have similar capabilities there is more to having the most advanced version.

 

[Neptune]

For those whom say HVKK does not have combat experience.

Turkish War of Independence

Ararat Rebellion

Dersim Rebellion

Korean War

Battle of Tylliria

Invasion of Cyprus

Operation Provide Comfort

Operation Deliberate Force

Operation Northern Watch

Operation Allied Force

Operation Enduring Freedom

Operation Northern Iraq

Operation Sun

Turkey-Iraq Cross-border Raids

Clashes at the Aegean Sea

Operation Active Endavior

Operation Eagle Assist

Operation Unified Protector

Syrian-Turkish Border Clashes

Operation Active Fence

And whom say
the Goverment spends at least $2,000,000 for the training of a F-16, F-4E, RF-4E pilot. That number increases to 10-11 million if the pilot's selected as skilled by HVKK, to be a trained as Astronaut Candidate. (One of the two pilots killed by Syria was one of them)

Anka, Heron, Boeing 737 AEW&C Peace Eagle, A400M, F-35A/F-35B (2016, TF-X (by 2023). 270+ F-16C/D (188 Block 50/50+, the rest is Block 40), yeap, Tango-1 never dies

TEI's been working on several national engines (Rotor Fixed, Jet, Turboprob...etc.)

 

[ejaz007]

For those whom say HVKK does not have combat experience.

Turkish War of Independence

Ararat Rebellion

Dersim Rebellion

Korean War

Battle of Tylliria

Invasion of Cyprus

Operation Provide Comfort

Operation Deliberate Force

Operation Northern Watch

Operation Allied Force

Operation Enduring Freedom

Operation Northern Iraq

Operation Sun

Turkey-Iraq Cross-border Raids

Clashes at the Aegean Sea

Operation Active Endavior

Operation Eagle Assist

Operation Unified Protector

Syrian-Turkish Border Clashes

Operation Active Fence

And whom say
the Goverment spends at least $2,000,000 for the training of a F-16, F-4E, RF-4E pilot. That number increases to 10-11 million if the pilot's selected as skilled by HVKK, to be a trained as Astronaut Candidate. (One of the two pilots killed by Syria was one of them)

Anka, Heron, Boeing 737 AEW&C Peace Eagle, A400M, F-35A/F-35B (2016, TF-X (by 2023). 270+ F-16C/D (188 Block 50/50+, the rest is Block 40), yeap, Tango-1 never dies

TEI's been working on several national engines (Rotor Fixed, Jet, Turboprob...etc.)

Impressive list. Just one question. In how many of these operations Turkish air force had an opposing air force to fight with?

Then we shall move forward on ranking issue.

 

[Sinnerman108]

Nothing is changed if you look at past. In the past our adversaries had the latest equipment, but still with older less advanced jets we performed well. Our pilots downed the Israeli jets with the same jets which the Arabs were flying. If you take as true what Alan Warnes just said recently, the PAF guys with their 80s era F-16s had an upper hand on the Saudi Typhoons. A 3rd gen aircraft of 80s vintage avionics beating a 4.5 gen aircraft, speaks about the training and professionalism.

And in my post also i am talking about the training and professionalism, we do lack in latest equipment, sometimes man behind the machine wins and sometimes the machines based on its equipment will win.

So i am not speaking with any syndrome. I accept the fact that we lack in technology, but our training and professionalism standards are the best, that is why we survived in last wars, but may be that will not be enough in the future of how technology is evolving. Thus training and professionalism is not enough for future, we need good advanced equipment or else the training only may not save us.

I don't think you got my point.

Men in Blue was a termed coined during Musharraf's time, owing to their operational lack of discipline.
i.e PAF men were involved in a lot of activities which no one could term professional !

 

[Neptune]

Impressive list. Just one question. In how many of these operations Turkish air force had an opposing air force to fight with?

Then we shall move forward on ranking issue.

Clashes at the Aegean, Operations; Active Fence, Allied Force, Atilla, Unified Protector, Korean War. But today It's not about where have you fought. It's about, how do you get trained, what training programs you are under to, how many flight hours do you have...etc.

By logic, TURAF has far more flying hours and better training than the Chinese and Indian air forces. And proba more history than the PLA-AF. But will that make us top of them? No it won't. As Chinese and Indian Air force is better than us I think.

 

[ejaz007]

Clashes at the Aegean, Operations; Active Fence, Allied Force, Atilla, Unified Protector, Korean War. But today It's not about where have you fought. It's about, how do you get trained, what training programs you are under to, how many flight hours do you have...etc.

By logic, TURAF has far more flying hours and better training than the Chinese and Indian air forces. And proba more history than the PLA-AF. But will that make us top of them? No it won't. As Chinese and Indian Air force is better than us I think.

If you accept that IAF is better than TURAF then PAF is definitely better than TURAF because PAF is better than IAF. PAF record against IAF in wars is enough to prove it.

 

[GURU DUTT]

If you accept that IAF is better than TURAF then PAF is definitely better than TURAF because PAF is better than IAF. PAF record against IAF in wars is enough to prove it.

well care to tell how

its nov 2013 not december 1965

what is the attretion rate and annual avrage flying hours of a PAF pilot and IAF pilot

can you tell who has the latest tech support from all the leading aerospace giants in the world and has latest tech form all over the world

who has the worlds best LAND/Aerostat & AWACs based Radar sysytems and SA sysytems to back them in south asea

can you please tell which air force(IAF or PAF) does multiple air exersises with all leading air forces of the world

wake up bro and smell the coffee stop living in past

 

[Ping]

If you accept that IAF is better than TURAF then PAF is definitely better than TURAF because PAF is better than IAF. PAF record against IAF in wars is enough to prove it.

Pakistani Air-to-Air Victories
Indian Air-to-Air Victories since 1948

^ Neutral site. Green and violet is the confirmed kills and close calls respectively.

 

[ejaz007]

well care to tell how

its nov 2013 not december 1965

what is the attretion rate and annual avrage flying hours of a PAF pilot and IAF pilot

can you tell who has the latest tech support from all the leading aerospace giants in the world and has latest tech form all over the world

who has the worlds best LAND/Aerostat & AWACs based Radar sysytems and SA sysytems to back them in south asea

can you please tell which air force(IAF or PAF) does multiple air exersises with all leading air forces of the world

wake up bro and smell the coffee stop living in past

Don't worry what ever you have stated shall be verified during the next round whenever that takes place.

Exercises alone don't make an air force efficient or better. Its the battle that does. 

Pakistani Air-to-Air Victories
Indian Air-to-Air Victories since 1948

^ Neutral site. Green and violet is the confirmed kills and close calls respectively.

In 1965 and 1971 wars technology was some what comparable however numerical advantage was with IAF and still PAF shot down more planes than IAF.

This makes PAF better in this aspect.

 

[GURU DUTT]

Don't worry what ever you have stated shall be verified during the next round whenever that takes place.

Exercises alone don't make an air force efficient or better. Its the battle that does.

well as napoleon once said "armies crawl on there bellies"

lolzzz you cant even mantain and oprate your prime assets @ F16s as per there full potential deu to lack of money / feul and spare parts they cant even be used against india since the latest ones source codes are still managed and mantained by US experts as US dosent wants its cutting edge tech to go into hands of "world renowed reverse ingenears"

your pilots cant fly more than 180 hours per annum while an avrage flying time of an IAF fighter pilot is 270+ hours

and IAF has the latest fight stimulators & advance trainers backed by constant israeli air force speciallists inputs regarding use of wepons / anty WVR & BVR counter measures and tacticks + we have the best of all the western and russian block hardware & training no dought we were late starters but we are staedily getting there to the top while what is your condition lolzz we all know what happened on Minhas base and whats the state of your prepairdinessl olzzz we all saw that on 11-05-2011

 

[Ping]

In 1965 and 1971 wars technology was some what comparable however numerical advantage was with IAF and still PAF shot down more planes than IAF.
This makes PAF better in this aspect.

You don't even know how to count?

 

[illuminatidinesh]

[/QUOTE]In 1965 and 1971 wars technology was some what comparable however numerical advantage was with IAF and still PAF shot down more planes than IAF.

This makes PAF better in this aspect.[/QUOTE]
No it doesnt, the number of sorties the IAF flew against the defenders .
U didnt even dare to engage the IAF when it mattered most.