Is China's 'F-16' Now Obsolete? | The National Interest

[royalharris]

USA is ahead of russia and china
For russia and china, they help each other in military technology, don't waste the time to make the comparsion which is better
The comparsion contribute nothing

 

[Daniel808]

Yes, I am agree with you that China still one step behind russia regarding Turbofan Engine, especially TVC Engine.
But if we talk about Warships Engine, China is much step ahead in Front of Russia. That's what you need to admit too @ptldM3

About Kamov Cooperation with CAIC to Design Z-10, that's happen in 90s. Yes, China is back then in that time. But, that's only design, Radar Avionics and Weapons System is using their own technology (and we still don't talk about China's Better Avionics and Radar system compare to Russia)


China buy SU-35 because that's the requirement from ROSOBORON if China want to get 40N6 on their S-400 SAM. That's why China only buy 24 unit SU-35 not hundreds.
SU-35 still using less Advanced PESA Radar, mostly China's Modern Fighter now already using more Advanced AESA Radar.
In cold war time, US also buy many Soviet Aircraft for Test & Evaluation, but that doesn't mean they cannot make better aircraft then soviet union. China will do the same, especially because some of his Un-friendly neighbour is using Russian made aircraft.


And you must be remember, China dump SU-27 Licence Contract in 2000s, because Russian Avionics and Radar System is very Obsolete compare to Chinese one.

Regarding Stealth Fighter, Your T-50 PAKFA have many issues. Even India decide to ditch their Stealth Fighter Program with Russia.
http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...tched-its-stealth-fighter-program-with-russia


I am also interested in Russian Aviation and have positive Impression with your country development, but I think you need to be more Objective and neutral regarding this issue @ptldM3


Best Regards

@ptldM3 why you ignore this reply to you?

Russia has experience of fighting against which air force in Syria?

ISIS Air Force

As if Russian buy every single component of your military hardware. Remember the missile corvette that need Chinese high speed diesel engine to complete it as Ukraine option are not available. As as the recent infra sensor that needed for Su-30MKK export and the clamour for importing of Chinese Type54 frigates by your Russian military analyst.

Still remember the ill venture of trying to buy France LHD Mistral cos your Russian shipyard are too outdated. Until now, not even a modern LDP for Russian Navy.

You open too much, my friend

 

[ptldM3]

@ptldM3 why you ignore this reply to you?

Because almost everything you say is unproven hearsay and nonsense that has been debunked many times over. That is like the 5th excuse I hear for the SU-35 purchase. As for SU-27 contract, China broke it by building unauthorized flaked variants, it had nothing to do with avionics. The only snag in the SU-57 is the time to develop the engine and India has not cancelled anything.

 

[Daniel808]

Because almost everything you say is unproven hearsay and nonsense that has been debunked many times over. That is like the 5th excuse I hear for the SU-35 purchase. As for SU-27 contract, China broke it by building unauthorized flaked variants, it had nothing to do with avionics. The only snag in the SU-57 is the time to develop the engine and India has not cancelled anything.

You are the one telling all bullsh!t, but you keep telling other people that Mother rossiya is numbah one.

Everyone in here now, that China Dump SU-27 Licence Contract because Mother Rossiya prohibit those SU-27 (J-11A) using more Advanced Chinese Avionics and Radar System.

Russian avionics and Radar is a junk stuff, sorry.

Even you cannot build a proper engine for modern warships.
What you expect from a country that always keep a TUG BOAT beside his Lone Aircraft Carrier

https://www.google.co.id/amp/s/www....an-carrier-plagued-by-technical-problems/amp/

 

[Jlaw]

^ isn't it funny that the rude delusional jingoistic pro-Chinese posters here all have more red ratings than green, but the more objective and informed posters that they argue with have more green ratings than red.

Iran is a superpower so just leave China alone. they cannot outdo you folks. You have ICBM, 4th gen fighter, speed boats to take down AC.

 

[ptldM3]

You are the one telling all bullsh!t, but you keep telling other people that Mother rossiya is numbah one.

Did I hurt your feelings with facts? Keep acting like an upset teenager.

Everyone in here now, that China Dump SU-27 Licence Contract because Mother Rossiya prohibit those SU-27 (J-11A) using more Advanced Chinese Avionics and Radar System.

Childish rhetoric with zero facts...typical


In that case China should have seized all production immediately, instead they continued making unauthorized copies. (Breach of contact) Your entire argument falls apart here. The fact is India dominated F-15s using SU-30Ks (not MKI) during Cope India so the avionics were not bad as you are trying to convince everyone. China just end up copying much of the avionics as they did with the aircraft. For decades Chinese radars, IR sensors, missiles, and in gerneral aircraft were were steaming crap, suddenly after Russia sold them SU-27/30 and assisted in setting up production lines as well as helped in many other projects, suddenly now China can now make a decent or good aircraft. Tap dance you want all around it massive theft and Russian assistance got China were it is now. Prior to Russia helping China, China was in the dark ages.

Russian avionics and Radar is a junk stuff, sorry.

More baseless rhetoric from a butt hurt Chinese fanboy. They suck but were good enough for China to buy and good enough to beat F-15s during 2005 and good enough to hire Russian engineers to assist China


And Pakistan wants to replace Chinese avionics with French in the JF-17.....and please do tell. How many times have Chinese systems been rejected by other countries when compared with Russian? Just about the only success story was JF-17 and that was only possible with Russian help.

Even you cannot build a proper engine for modern warships.

Buddy I used to work in the marine industry, including a secret drone project years ago....


Ukraine kept most of the heavy marine industry. Some ships had issues because of this, but most propulsion that doesn't rely on Ukraine or cheap Chinese parts have not had issues whatsoever. Russia operates hundreds of Diesel engines including modern surface ships and submarines...

Russia imported parts from Ukraine to keep costs low instead of setting up new factories. The fact is Russia makes some of the best diesel, turbine and turbofan engines in the world. The fact is Russia holds the record in producing the most powerful power plants in the world.

As an example the Z-10 weak 1,350hp engine, in comparison the KA-52 has a 2,400hp engine.

TU-160 has 55,000 lbs thrust from each engine. China has nothing close to this and never will.

What you expect from a country that always keep a TUG BOAT beside his Lone Aircraft Carrier


https://www.google.co.id/amp/s/www....an-carrier-plagued-by-technical-problems/amp/

That aircraft carrier was long overdue for a long overhaul.

 

[ZeEa5KPul]

TU-160 has 55,000 lbs thrust from each engine. China has nothing close to this and never will.

You can't be serious. The only reason China would never have an engine like the Tu-160's is that it judges it to be militarily useless.
Do you honestly not see which way the world is going? Do you think Russia has any hope of keeping up with the gargantuan quantities of money and manpower China is pouring into developing military technology? Do you think whatever lead Russia has in anything can survive into the coming decade? If your answer is yes, then you must be the one who monopolized all of Russia's optimism.

 

[Daniel808]

Bla bla bla

I'm tired with all your fairy tale.
Let's picture say everything


Sukhoi-27 Cockpit, that this boy @ptldM3 said MUCH MUCH ADVANCED than Chinese Avionic.

J-11 Cockpit, that China copied installed by Chinese Avionic Crap according to Ivan

Cockpit of Upgraded J-11 (2007), again with Chinese Crap Avionic according to ivan

Butthurt

 

[UserUnknown2025]

i am not muslim, you don't have to put me in a big camp don't worry ;-)

Hahaha you are a funny guy
I like this guy. He’s got a nice sense of humor and is immutably optimistic. Cheers

I'm tired with all your fairy tale.
Let's picture say everything


Sukhoi-27 Cockpit, that this boy @ptldM3 said MUCH MUCH ADVANCED than Chinese Avionic.
View attachment 496443

J-11 Cockpit, that China copied installed by Chinese Avionic Crap according to Ivan
View attachment 496444

Cockpit of Upgraded J-11 (2007), again with Chinese Crap Avionic according to ivan
View attachment 496445

Butthurt

不要摧毁人家的紫噂心。
There’s no point in starting this argument. Both China and Russia has good air forces. End of story.

 

[ptldM3]

I'm tired with all your fairy tale.
Let's picture say everything


Sukhoi-27 Cockpit, that this boy @ptldM3 said MUCH MUCH ADVANCED than Chinese Avionic.
View attachment 496443

J-11 Cockpit, that China copied installed by Chinese Avionic Crap according to Ivan
View attachment 496444

Cockpit of Upgraded J-11 (2007), again with Chinese Crap Avionic according to ivan
View attachment 496445

Butthurt

Your argument is stale. You show 1980s anolog cockpit of SU-27SK and show Chinese cockpits developed decades later using LCD monitors. That doesn't disprove the fact that China didn't copy and learn about radars, mission computers, navigation systems, engines, weapons, ECM, etc from the SU-27 and SU-30MKK which they then incorporated technology into other programs.


Still continently ignoring the SU-30MKK? Here let me refresh your memory:



SU-30MKK (1990s technology purchases in 2000)

Russia has garbage avionics but China bought the SU-27SK, then the SU-30MKK and now the SU-35.

You can't be serious. The only reason China would never have an engine like the Tu-160's is that it judges it to be militarily useless.

The reason China have no equivalent to NK-321 is because they can't develop anything that comes close it it just like they struggled developing light and medium jet engines despite having foreign examples they can copy, learn and or improve upon.

Only to someone completely ignorant and foolish is 55,000lbs thrust "useless" in a heavy bomber...

China just prefers using weak and inefficient jet engines developed in the 1940s in their bombers because range, payload and short takeoffs are for morons like the Russians.

Do you honestly not see which way the world is going? Do you think Russia has any hope of keeping up with the gargantuan quantities of money and manpower China is pouring into developing military technology? Do you think whatever lead Russia has in anything can survive into the coming decade? If your answer is yes, then you must be the one who monopolized all of Russia's optimism.

This is not even an argument but nonsense and a desperate argument. Israel and France develop were class military technogy that even the US uses and everyone know how much money and manpower both countries have.