Featured Iran drops India from Chabahar rail project

[Nilgiri]

Fake news



It getting to reduclus point with so much fake stuff get released days by media on daily basis

What do you mean? The rail link project is lapsed now....India just doesn't have companies that are interested to likely get sanctioned in other operations by US.

China has far more shielded (largely sanction proof) SOEs and they are well funded too.

Its no brainer to have this project (if Iran still interested in it, which I think they are):

a) simply funded by Iran itself, and use larger leveraging from Chinese investment corpus in whatever way if needed

b) Have china officially enter the project itself.... chinese rail SOEs are excellent and experienced in project handling and completion in general

 

[QWECXZ]

Hey buddy, nothing personal here....

I'm just showing that the core interest of India in the project is in the port itself. Stuff branching out from it (rail link etc) comes under sanctions increasingly and thus its better Iran take over those phases....as already in fine print signed earlier.

Argument of "independence" vs "non-independence" is all relative, its not black and white thing....it depends on your perspective.

Lot of people (some blowing praise and hoo-haah in this thread selectively) have all kind of perspectives and opinions on this regarding Iran too...and who controls Iran and this and that...already some bringing up BLA/BLF brazenly in this thread (and one can see the accusations regd Iran for it elsewhere in this forum if its your cup of tea)....and others in this thread muse and desire all kind of things on Iran in other parts of forum (incl taking Iranian land to expand into for Pakistan's massive population growth)...or what they want to see being done with Iranian regime and IRGC and whole gamut.

Nothing of this scale and intensity and hypocrisy enters conversation piece/debate when it comes to Iran topic when it's India, let me say that right now. It is grounded in long term civilisational ties and pragmatic economic ties...that's about it.

Anyway suffice to say for IND-IRN case, we got our set of priorities, and you got yours. We are constrained big time coming out of colonial yoke pre-1950, having to deal with partition....further partition of the other partitioned piece...and big wrangling/mishandling of our economy for decades. We are only starting to achieve some economic success and credibility now, but its massively dependent on the world system at large....we cant forego that larger reliance and trajectory ...all for proving some short term point with Iran sorry. We need to grow our GDP far far more first.

Our neighbourhood is already replete with countries that fail on that big time, having say total market cap collapse from 90 billion to 40 billion in short order because of their utter incompetence.....we cannot afford such happening in ours for any reason....our fixed capital formation per year is passing 1 trillion per year, we need to double that very quickly. Till we are on much firmer ground, foreign policy will have only so much purse strings.

Actually, I meant another thing by defending your independence. US unilateral sanctions are not legal as they were not passed by the UNSC. India has every legal right to conduct business with Iran. Yet, you replaced Iranian oil with Saudi oil and reduced your business ties with us. When another country can impose their policies on you, that's a violation of your sovereignty. And it's a violation of your independence too. And you succumbed to it.

Even Iraq, Lebanon and Turkey proved to be more independent from the US. And Turkey's GDP continues to grow and they are doing fine. We expected India to be an independent actor like Turkey at least.

Iran always tried to maintain good relations with China, India and Pakistan at the same time. We never let our close friendship with China get in the way of our friendship with India until you proved unreliable as a friend. Again, we do not blame you for choosing the US over us. Many countries did that. But I still believe you failed to prove yourself as an independent country and in the current world order where everything is more or less based on the Western civilization, I believe India will never find its rightful place with this attitude. Just my two cents. You can play by their rules, but you won't be one of them.

 

[Nilgiri]

Actually, I meant another thing by defending your independence. US unilateral sanctions are not legal as they were not passed by the UNSC. India has every legal right to conduct business with Iran. Yet, you replaced Iranian oil with Saudi oil and reduced your business ties with us. When another country can impose their policies on you, that's a violation of your sovereignty. And it's a violation of your independence too. And you succumbed to it.

Even Iraq, Lebanon and Turkey proved to be more independent from the US. And Turkey's GDP continues to grow and they are doing fine. We expected India to be an independent actor like Turkey at least.

Iran always tried to maintain good relations with China, India and Pakistan at the same time. We never let our close friendship with China get in the way of our friendship with India until you proved unreliable as a friend. Again, we do not blame you for choosing the US over us. Many countries did that. But I still believe you failed to prove yourself as an independent country and in the current world order where everything is more or less based on the Western civilization, I believe India will never find its rightful place with this attitude. Just my two cents. You can play by their rules, but you won't be one of them.

I respect and share lot of your opinion in more nuanced way. Honestly the blame lies mostly with our leaders and politicians etc....they did not let India grow as fast as possible in the 90s and 2000s after we accepted the errors made from before and started to correct. That's long subject of itself.

Like I really really doubt china from 90s condition would follow the same line it can afford to with Iran now... given how reliant it was in investments and know-how transfer from western world and Japan. India basically right now has global punch power of early 2000s China overall.

In my estimation....nearly 200 billion in service exports per year go to US/West from India...and about the same in goods. Investment wise its about 50 billion coming in per year directly (and far more indirectly in corporate side stuff).... It is not feasible at this stage (3 trillion GDP) to risk this huge input flux...given the ratio of it....and little alternative (our larger population of people are simply too poor still).

I empathise and even sympathise with this spot Iran is in (we have also seen the temerity of US through course of cold war and after to sanction and push us around to get their way)....Iran is independent country that should not see these unilateral sanctions for exercising its sovereignty...as matter of consistent principle.

Iran through cooperation with China and Russia will have to grow as much as it can economically....that's probably the most pragmatic course with current Iran foreign policy and Iran govt set up. India is in very different position my friend... we are in process of early bulking up still for our frame....the larger role in multi-polar world comes much later. It may seem strange or weird to many outside India...but you got to be Indian (and also honest one) to know how much is to be done...how early the modern journey in our redemption truly is....and what level of robust psyche as a whole we then need to develop commensurately.

I know Iran will make wise choices and will have good cognisance of India's predicament too...and I always wish Iran the best from deepest part of me.

We both operate on proper civilisation time (that goes well beyond some snapshot of govt, geopolitical egos and politics in general)....we have both inherited it.... that doesn't need me to tell you about. The name Persia (and cognates) are old old words of greatest reverence in all the Indian languages I know. Our lifetimes compared to that are short my friend....most countries don't understand it.

 

[Uguduwa]

This forum is so much cringe. Pakistan has absolutely nothing to do with anything. Even if this news is true then it's because China has financial power and is not afraid of US sanctions unlike cash strapped India. It's also interesting how Iran is moving towards being a Chinese vassal state. Like many other countries before, China will now have a monopoly on Iranian infrastructure projects. You have to be an idiot to think that this partnership is equal when Iran has no choice but China but for China Iran is not very significant. I also assume that after being choked by the US in pacific ocean, China is now looking to maintain a secure energy supply via other routes.

 

[Shams313]

Concept of luck is not relevant in this case. It is a no brainer that the Chinese can bring a lot more to the table and are less vulnerable to US pressure. Indians had their chance in Chahbahar but their slower than snail pace of development could not continue forever. Furthermore, Indian presence in Chahbahar is causing tension with Iran's neighbour Pakistan. Indians can use Chahbahar in the same manner any other nations can if they pay for the service, however in terms of an actual presence in Chahbahar, China must be the one.

Concept of luck is not relevant in this case. It is a no brainer that the Chinese can bring a lot more to the table and are less vulnerable to US pressure. Indians had their chance in Chahbahar but their slower than snail pace of development could not continue forever. Furthermore, Indian presence in Chahbahar is causing tension with Iran's neighbour Pakistan. Indians can use Chahbahar in the same manner any other nations can if they pay for the service, however in terms of an actual presence in Chahbahar, China must be the one.

They never wanted..
Indian r much more zhionist lover then anyone, they extremely support Israel over iran, consider israel as sworn brother against muslim, the muslim massacare project.

 

[Murgah]

The development comes as China finalises a massive 25-year, $400 billion strategic partnership deal with Iran, which could cloud India’s plans.
Four years after India and Iran signed an agreement to construct a rail line from Chabahar port to Zahedan, along the border with Afghanistan, the Iranian government has decided to proceed with the construction on its own, citing delays from the Indian side in funding and starting the project.

Last week, Iranian Transport and Urban Development Minister Mohammad Eslami inaugurated the track-laying process for the 628 km Chabahar-Zahedan line, which will be extended to Zaranj across the border in Afghanistan. Officials told The Hindu that the entire project would be completed by March 2022, and that Iranian Railways will proceed without India’s assistance, using approximately $400 million from the Iranian National Development Fund.


The development comes as China finalises a massive 25-year, $400 billion strategic partnership deal with Iran, which could cloud India’s plans.

Trilateral agreement
The railway project, which was being discussed between the Iranian Railways and the state-owned Indian Railways Construction Ltd (IRCON), was meant to be part of India’s commitment to the trilateral agreement between India, Iran and Afghanistan to build an alternate trade route to Afghanistan and Central Asia.


Also read: Iran to promote Chabahar as curbs will hit main port

In May 2016, during Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s visit to Tehran to sign the Chabahar agreement with Iranian President Rouhani and Afghanistan President Ghani, IRCON had signed an MoU with the Iranian Rail Ministry.

The MoU was to construct the Chabahar-Zahedan railway as “part of transit and transportation corridor in trilateral agreement between India, Iran and Afghanistan”. IRCON had promised to provide all services, superstructure work and financing for the project (around $1.6 billion).

Also read: India to develop Iran's Chabahar port

However, despite several site visits by IRCON engineers, and preparations by Iranian railways, India never began the work, ostensibly due to worries that these could attract U.S. sanctions. The U.S. had provided a sanctions waiver for the Chabahar port and the rail line to Zahedan, but it has been difficult to find equipment suppliers and partners due to worries they could be targeted by the U.S., said officials. India has already “zeroed out” its oil imports from Iran due to U.S. sanctions.

The Ministry of External Affairs and IRCON declined to comment on the issue.

However, when asked if the MoU with IRCON had been cancelled, now that the project has been started without it, an official said India could still join at a “later date.”

25-year Strategic Partnership
Meanwhile, complicating matters further, Iran and China are close to finalising a 25-year Strategic Partnership which will include Chinese involvement in Chabahar’s duty free zone, an oil refinery nearby, and possibly a larger role in Chabahar port as well.

According to leaked versions of the 18-page “Comprehensive Plan for Cooperation between Iran and China”, being finalised by officials in Tehran and Beijing, the cooperation will extend from investments in infrastructure, manufacturing and upgrading energy and transport facilities, to refurbishing ports, refineries and other installations, and will commit Iranian oil and gas supplies to China during that period.

Iranian officials denied a report that also suggested Chabahar port, where India took, will be leased to China. However, Iran proposed a tie-up between the Chinese-run Pakistani port at Gwadar and Chabahar last year, and has offered interests to China in the Bandar-e-Jask port 350km away from Chabahar, as well as in the Chabahar duty free zone.

Each of those possibilities should be watched closely by New Delhi, said former Ambassador to Iran, K.C. Singh. “[The Iran-China deal] impinges on India’s “strategic ties” with Iran and the use of Chabahar port. Jask lies to west of Chabahar & right before Straits of Hormuz. China would thus extends its control along the Pakistan-Iran coast,” he cautioned
https://www.thehindu.com/news/natio...oject-cites-funding-delay/article32072428.ece

 

[PeacefulWar]

IMHO, with or without China deal this makes no sense to let India do this from the begining.
India hasn't show any capability to work on such big projects, they can't do such project by themselves in their own country.

And Iran itself has stronger industrial power than India.

 

[Mighty Lion]

Good decision which will help India too as India's main aim is to have railway line between Chabahar and Afghanistan and this ensures the project can go ahead without delay.
India's IRCON was unable to start work on railway line as the European and Japanese companies which supplies it equipment refused to give them as they were afraid of US sanctions despite waiver.

Now Indian govt can directly transfer money to Iran's national fund (won't be an issues because of US waiver) and an Iranian company can do the construction.

So by 2022 we will have an operational railway line thus cutting down current time to transport our goods to Afghanistan from Chabahar by 40%.

 

[unrequitted_love_suzy]

railway for indian rice , haha

 

[vi-va]

Actually, I meant another thing by defending your independence. US unilateral sanctions are not legal as they were not passed by the UNSC. India has every legal right to conduct business with Iran. Yet, you replaced Iranian oil with Saudi oil and reduced your business ties with us. When another country can impose their policies on you, that's a violation of your sovereignty. And it's a violation of your independence too. And you succumbed to it.

Even Iraq, Lebanon and Turkey proved to be more independent from the US. And Turkey's GDP continues to grow and they are doing fine. We expected India to be an independent actor like Turkey at least.

Iran always tried to maintain good relations with China, India and Pakistan at the same time. We never let our close friendship with China get in the way of our friendship with India until you proved unreliable as a friend. Again, we do not blame you for choosing the US over us. Many countries did that. But I still believe you failed to prove yourself as an independent country and in the current world order where everything is more or less based on the Western civilization, I believe India will never find its rightful place with this attitude. Just my two cents. You can play by their rules, but you won't be one of them.

This is called insights which Indian lacks.
Indians are subservient to the old world order, while Iran, Turkey, Pakistan, China, Russia are creating new world order.
The creator of the new world order will have their own places in new one, just like 5 permanent members in UNSC after WW2 world order.

 

[Beast]

India is successfully corner by China from all front.

 

[Nilgiri]

Indians are subservient to the old world order, while Iran, Turkey, Pakistan, China, Russia are creating new world order.

@T-123456 ... grouping stronk!

 

[IceCold]

Expect major attacks/resistence to this StrategicDeal from The Empire!

We are heading towards a major conflict with China, Russia, Pakistan and Iran now on one side and US, India and Israel (because of Iran) on the other. My only concern is my country not prepared enough neither economically to sustain an economic war nor militarily to sustain a long drawn war. Corruption and treachery of past governments have left us vulnerable.

 

[graphican]

Baluchistan will be terrorism free as Indian influence will die in Iran and Afghanistan InShaAllah. More than ever before, we can be sure that there won't be a Baniya in Afghanistan anymore.

Everywhere in the region, Indians will be wiped off and flushed down.

 

[Mighty Lion]

https://www.thehindu.com/news/natio...nding-delay/article32072428.ece?homepage=true

The development comes as China finalises a massive 25-year, $400 billion strategic partnership deal with Iran, which could cloud India’s plans.
Four years after India and Iran signed an agreement to construct a rail line from Chabahar port to Zahedan, along the border with Afghanistan, the Iranian government has decided to proceed with the construction on its own, citing delays from the Indian side in funding and starting the project.

Good decision which will help India too as India's main aim is to have railway line between Chabahar and Afghanistan and this ensures the project can go ahead without delay.
India's IRCON was unable to start work on railway line as the European and Japanese companies which supplies it equipment refused to give them as they were afraid of US sanctions despite waiver.

Now Indian govt can directly transfer money to Iran's govt for railway line (won't be an issue because of US waiver) and an Iranian company can do the construction.

So by 2022 we will have an operational railway line thus cutting down current time to transport Indian goods to Afghanistan from Chabahar by 40%.