Why not delay the procurement ? Are we at war at the moment or are we going to be at war 6 years from now ? Do you think fishing right dispute in North Natuna sea with China will lead to war ??? Do you think China will risk their trading, investment with Indonesia and ASEAN over that small dispute ? Not to mention both US and China want to get Indonesia into their side or at least stay neutral due to their rivalry and Indonesia geopolitical status as regional power and the most influential member in ASEAN if not de-facto leader (as stated by US foreign ministry).
MEF is not a holy book. Do you think with current economic condition we also want to complete that MEF which is made by previous administration ? The target is too ambitious and we should try to complete it step by step by considering both our economic condition and long term defense industry goals/needs.
Those squadron 14 has already gotten 3 flankers and we also have had flankers simulator so they can still practice until new planes are coming. Maybe better to wait until CATSAA doesnt effect anymore and buy Su 35 since we need heavy fighter that can do Naval attack with Brahmos because our potential dispute is in the sea. That will be inline with the current Flanker present and we also can pay half amount of the contract figure using our commodity that can help the economy as well.
While waiting for the completion of KFX/IFX program (inshaAllah), we can have more focus on Navy and Army needs in equipment that has meaningful local defense industry contribution like frigates/OPV/submarine/APC/medium tank/ammunition/rockets/tactical vehicles/ others.
For Airforce better to spend on more AMRAMM and Sidewinder with meaningful amount of deal so that we can get substantive TOT that can be useful for our indigenous missile program. Any way our AMRAAM and Sidewinder are too few and with the coming of NASAMS system the number become ridiculously small, why do we need to buy more fighter if we dont have enough ammunition to even support our current fighter planes in case small conflict happen in Ambalat block ?
Of course there will be initial production first but that stage is still part of mass production stage. How do you know that we are going to wait in the line ? Indonesian production engineers are also contributing and learning the manufacturing of those planned 6 prototype where the first one is currently being manufactured.
One of the prototype will also be produced in Indonesia with the help of the Korean which is based on work shared deal that have already been agreed in 2015. I assumed the initial production stage will be both conducted by Korean and Indonesia in the same time since both parties are involved in making those 6 planned prototypes. I have to make it clear here since some maybe forget that KFX/IFX will be produced both in KAI Korea and PT Dirgantara Indonesia facility (with different work share due to different investment contribution (80% vs 20 %).
Well even 8 more years is not really that long and shouldnt become the problem as we have already had several capable fighter squadrons that are enough for the next 10 years. We had some serious dispute before with Malaysia but Malaysia also faces delay with their MRCA program and none of our neighbor actually are brave enough to make any conflict with Indonesia as we can be very powerful if we want, considering to our economy and population.
You seem to have a comprehension problem and dont see the main point that I try to bring at my previous comment. Did I say "nothing can be achieve overnight" and "we should start some where" ??? I also have mentioned what you stated above if you read my previous explanation thoroughly.
Not to mention other comment that I made that we need to spare 5 % of defense budget for R&D program and prefer our local defense industry in our procurement process so that they can improve their sophistication in the future and hopefully we can achieve total independency like China some where in the future inshaAllah. This is what I mean to aim big.
Yes, it is better to wait for the next 6-8 years rather than the money is spent on imported fighters and lost KFX/IFX program forever. Do you think we have huge financial capability at the moment ? Do you think this Jokowi administration who are stingy on R&D program and even dont have money to spend on N 245 program which only needs 300 million USD to complete its development will keep spending money on KFX/IFX program ( 2 bilion USD ) after we use around 3-5 billion USD to buy imported fighter ?? Even he has delayed paying our financial contribution for the program since 2017 (just paid again once in early 2019)
Look, this is our last chance to enter fighter development program. If we lost this program I dont think there will be any advance country who will offer us similar program in the future. Maybe Turkey, but it will be after 2040 with their new program since they have already had TFX program at the moment and this if ever happen will delay our progress for more than 2 decades in acquiring capability on fighter development.
Or do we want to make our own 5 generation fighter alone and spend around 10 billion USD (140 trillion Rupiah) with the possibility to only be bought by ourselves (will be very expensive per plane) since other advanced country with better experience and capability must be able to make much superior fighter than us ? Do you think we will also get helped by Lockheed Martin with our new fighter project and get at least 20 technologies that they have given to KFX/IFX program ?
Any way buying F 35 also needs another 8 years for first delivery alone and other new fighter also need maybe 4-8 years on their delivery. Not much different.
Hawk 100/200 planes were delivered in 1998-early 2000. Not really too old since our F 16 planes that were delivered in 1989-1990 are still being operated and even after 30 years of operation are now being upgraded and refurbished. Indonesia has also been able to do overhaul on Hawk independently. Any way recent decision made by Mindef also suggests that our Hawk are likely to be refurbished or get their operational life prolonged a bit (until KFX/IFX planes can replace them all inshaAllah ).
I know the F-16 in your possession is still operating fine and could cover your needs for the next decade but buying the 48 rafale's as addition would be wise idea. The recent 20 billion French purchase it is a good deal for the current date it comes not only with aircraft jet but with other modernization. Indonesia should also add couple of Eurofighters I have seen they have been offered that.
While in the next decade you upgrade and the decade after that you upgrade while making upgrading every decade normal and the average target.
The
KAI KF-X project is interesting tho. 5th generation aircrafts in production currently by South-korea-Indonesia I am looking forward to seeing how these fighter jets turn out in 2026 it should be ready.
Indonesia, France Close to Agreement on 48 Rafale jet Deal: Reports
Indonesia is close to an agreement to purchase 48 Rafale jets as part of a comprehensive defence cooperation deal with France.
Negotiations between France and Indonesia are progressing very well on the sale of 48 Rafale to the Indonesian Air Force, French publication; La Tribune reported quoting its sources.
During a visit to Paris on October 21, Indonesian Defense Minister Prabowo Subianto reiterated his keen interest in the Dassault Aviation fighter plane.
“And the Indonesians would like to go very quickly and would even like an agreement before the end of the year, while the French negotiators would like to take a little time to complete an agreement in a meticulous manner,” the publication’s sources said.
The two countries have initiated a strategic dialogue this year with the objective of quickly signing a cooperation agreement in the field of defense.
Indonesia has recently turned down an offer from the US to buy F-16 jets after the US declined to sell it F-35 fighters. Besides, its deal to buy 12 Su-35 jets from Russsia is in cold storage since 2018.
Dassault is on a roll with a recent order from Greece to buy Rafale jets and on-going contracts with India, Egypt and Qatar and might be ok to a parts-manufacturing eco-system which Indonesia is said to be proposing.
Talks of Indonesia wanting to buy Rafale jets, Gowind Corvettes and Scorpene submarines have been on since January this year when Defense Minister Subianto held a bilateral meeting with his French counterpart Florence Parly in Paris besides discussions with French defence firms such as Dassault Aviation, Thales, Naval Group and Nexter.
or ask for compensation if it damages something..
