INDIA TESTS NEW CARBINES

[Zarvan]

Pune-based Armament Research & Development Establishment (ARDE) is getting ready to offer indigenously developed Joint Venture Protective Carbine (JVPC) carbine for the Indian Army

The Indian Army is to use a variety of new generation carbines for its existing weaponry. The state-owned Pune-based Armaments Research and Development Establishment (ARDE) is already testing a 5.56 caliber carbine to replace existing Russians carbines. Simultaneously the Indian Army is also searching for carbines in the global market.

ARDE is developing a new Modern Sub-machine Carbine (MSMC), which will replace the Russian 9mm-caliber carbine currently used by the Indian Army and the Indian paramilitary forces.

“Final trials are underway to ensure 99.7% reliability for the new carbine.” said an ARDE scientist. The MSMC is effective up to a range of 200 meters.

However, a senior Indian Army officer said that they would prefer to use carbines from overseas market and not depend solely on the homemade MSMC.

The New MSCMC
The MSMC was originally part of the Indian Small Arms System (INSAS) Program, undertaken by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), initiated in 1982 to provide an indigenous small arms weapons system for the Indian armed forces. A rifle, a light machine gun (LMG) and a carbine were eventually designed as part of the INSAS family.

According to DRDO, introduction of soft-body armour rendered the erstwhile 9 mm carbine, which was operational with the Indian Army, ineffective. This led to the development of the 5.56 mm MSMC.
The problem also lay with the concept of using the same ammunition for all three weapon systems, the LMG, rifle and the carbine. The 5.56 ammunition proved to be too heavy for the short range MSMC, giving a higher recoil and flash effect than was desirable.

The new MSMC features include: a semi bull-pup weapon feed system behind the trigger mechanism, retention of butt, fitted in housing configuration, noise-reduction technology using CFD analysis for development of silencers; reflex sight and passive night sight; and integration of laser spot designator on MSMC for close quarter battle.

Besides, the MSMC has a pistol grip, which allows single-hand firing capability; magazine feeding through pistol grip; retractable butt for better stability while firing; ambidextrous cocking; fire selector to suit left and right hand firers, and, a three-point sling for better carrying and maneuverability.

The ammunition for MSMC is of conventional type with the bullet cylindro-ogival for better ballistics as compared to a 9 mm round. A steel insert has been introduced in the tip of the bullet to achieve better penetration power.

Global Hunt For Carbines

The Indian Army is also on a global hunt for procurement of 43,300 Close Quarter Battle (COB) carbines along with 43318 Night Sights and 3,33,11,500 rounds of ammunition. The tender has been sent to companies in France, Israel, Poland, Czech and Slovak Republic, Russia, Ukraine, Singapore, Germany and the USA.

The essential requirements of the COB include that the weapon should be robust enough to carry enough to withstand, rough uses under various operational conditions. In wet conditions, the weapon should function with the same frequency as dry conditions.

The weapon should achieve minimum 600 rounds per minute cycle rate of fire.

The magazine should be robust enough to withstand rough usage under various operational conditions and have a capacity of 30 rounds.

The weapons should be accurate to the extent that it is able to effectively engage a human target at 200 meters with an aim to fire under normal condition of visibility.

The performance of the weapon should not be adversely affected by extremes of temperature from -30 degrees to +55 degrees Celsius. At these low temperatures, the performance of the weapon should not be degraded by cold weather problems of.

The performance of laser sights/passive night sights and reflex sights should not be affected by the extremes of temperature from -30 degrees Celsius to +55 degrees Celsius.

http://www.battle-technology.com/exhibitions.asp?key=135

 

[SSGcommandoPAK]

Can any Indian member tell me what happened to this Assault riffle and approximately how many of these are in service ?

I hope Pakistan selects the Scar as it would give Pakistan advantage over any riffle India selects accept the Tar-21 ... Sir @Zarvan any reports about the gun trials ?

 

[Zarvan]

Can any Indian member tell me what happened to this Assault riffle and approximately how many of these are in service ?

I hope Pakistan selects the Scar as it would give Pakistan advantage over any riffle India selects accept the Tar-21

There Army has ordered few of these but I don't think Indian Army will use it as its standard Assault Rifle. Ultimately they would go for foreign stuff and I can seriously feel it would be AK ALPHA

 

[randomradio]

Can any Indian member tell me what happened to this Assault riffle and approximately how many of these are in service ?

I hope Pakistan selects the Scar as it would give Pakistan advantage over any riffle India selects accept the Tar-21 ... Sir @Zarvan any reports about the gun trials ?

This is the MCIWS, it's undergoing trials, so we don't know much.

The Scar failed trials in India.

 

[SSGcommandoPAK]

There Army has ordered few of these but I don't think Indian Army will use it as its standard Assault Rifle. Ultimately they would go for foreign stuff and I can seriously feel it would be AK ALPHA

Yes India would most probably use these rifles for there police / Paramilitary forces .

This is the MCIWS, it's undergoing trials, so we don't know much.

The Scar failed trials in India.

I don't know about Indian Scar Trials but in Pakistan its doing great and hopefully Inshallah it might be selected as a replacement for G-3s soon .

 

[ASamiSSG]

Yes India would most probably use these rifles for there police / Paramilitary forces .


I don't know about Indian Scar Trials but in Pakistan its doing great and hopefully Inshallah it might be selected as a replacement for G-3s soon .

The scar looks good I hope the Scar is selected Inshallah..

 

[Gessler]

There Army has ordered few of these but I don't think Indian Army will use it as its standard Assault Rifle. Ultimately they would go for foreign stuff and I can seriously feel it would be AK ALPHA

Two distinct rifle requirements to fulfill. One in 5.56x45mm and other in 7.62x39mm.

The 5.56 rifle is for replacing the INSAS. Most probably the OFB-designed Advanced Assault Rifle (AAR) will be fulfilling this role (the gun you see above). A foreign rifle for the whole infantry is an extremely cost-prohibitive and largely unnecessary exercise, especially when local options are available and private-sector industry is being involved.

The 7.62 rifle is for replacing the AKM and Vz.58 types in use by Rashtriya Rifles and other counter-insurgency units. This is where the AK-Alfa can possibly be selected as Kalashnikov-Israel has offered to set up local production facilities in India. Using the same 7.62x39 round as the older AKs, the specific units will probably find it easier to transition to the new weapon.

 

[Zarvan]

Yes India would most probably use these rifles for there police / Paramilitary forces .


I don't know about Indian Scar Trials but in Pakistan its doing great and hopefully Inshallah it might be selected as a replacement for G-3s soon .

Let's make dua that SCAR is selected because I am smelling some dirty things being played here

 

[Gessler]

For Special Forces use...the Tavor TAR-21 has been pretty much standardized. Everyone from Paras, Garuds, MARCOS are using it in thousands and more will be inducted in future. Tavor X-95/MTAR-21 is also catching on with some para-military units.

Units like Para-SF have also been using M4 carbines for a long time. But I think that sometime in 2020s, these could be replaced by a more modern special forces rifle based around the AR-15 platform. Like the Colt Modular Carbine or some HK416 variant. However, the Tavors will remain the most widely-used SFs weapon.

 

[SSGcommandoPAK]

This is the MCIWS, it's undergoing trials, so we don't know much.

The Scar failed trials in India.

I don't know about Indian Scar trials , but its doing great in Pakistan .

Let's make dua that SCAR is selected because I am smelling some dirty things being played here

Sir mein to kab sae karaha hoon dua Scar kae liae , what type of dirty thing sir ?

 

[Zarvan]

I don't know about Indian Scar trials ,

Sir mein to kab sae karaha hoon dua Scar kae liae , what type of dirty thing sir ?

India never tested SCAR

 

[Gessler]

I did hear about SCARs having some issues when subjected to adverse weather in international trials. Don't know the details though.

India never tested SCAR

I think our Special Frontier Force (SFF) already uses the SCAR. I doubt they bought it without testing.

Seen in the picture are the F2000, SCAR-L rifles and P90 submachine guns. All from FN Herstal.

 

[SSGcommandoPAK]

India never tested SCAR

This is the MCIWS, it's undergoing trials, so we don't know much.

The Scar failed trials in India.

If Scar failed the trials then why do you're special forces still use them ?

 

[randomradio]

If Scar failed the trials then why do you're special forces still use them ?

Yes, my bad. The SCAR did not participate in the tender.

SF uses many types of weapons. The tender I'm talking about is a regular army tender.

 

[muhammadali233]

Pune-based Armament Research & Development Establishment (ARDE) is getting ready to offer indigenously developed Joint Venture Protective Carbine (JVPC) carbine for the Indian Army

The Indian Army is to use a variety of new generation carbines for its existing weaponry. The state-owned Pune-based Armaments Research and Development Establishment (ARDE) is already testing a 5.56 caliber carbine to replace existing Russians carbines. Simultaneously the Indian Army is also searching for carbines in the global market.

ARDE is developing a new Modern Sub-machine Carbine (MSMC), which will replace the Russian 9mm-caliber carbine currently used by the Indian Army and the Indian paramilitary forces.

“Final trials are underway to ensure 99.7% reliability for the new carbine.” said an ARDE scientist. The MSMC is effective up to a range of 200 meters.

However, a senior Indian Army officer said that they would prefer to use carbines from overseas market and not depend solely on the homemade MSMC.

The New MSCMC
The MSMC was originally part of the Indian Small Arms System (INSAS) Program, undertaken by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), initiated in 1982 to provide an indigenous small arms weapons system for the Indian armed forces. A rifle, a light machine gun (LMG) and a carbine were eventually designed as part of the INSAS family.

According to DRDO, introduction of soft-body armour rendered the erstwhile 9 mm carbine, which was operational with the Indian Army, ineffective. This led to the development of the 5.56 mm MSMC.
The problem also lay with the concept of using the same ammunition for all three weapon systems, the LMG, rifle and the carbine. The 5.56 ammunition proved to be too heavy for the short range MSMC, giving a higher recoil and flash effect than was desirable.

The new MSMC features include: a semi bull-pup weapon feed system behind the trigger mechanism, retention of butt, fitted in housing configuration, noise-reduction technology using CFD analysis for development of silencers; reflex sight and passive night sight; and integration of laser spot designator on MSMC for close quarter battle.

Besides, the MSMC has a pistol grip, which allows single-hand firing capability; magazine feeding through pistol grip; retractable butt for better stability while firing; ambidextrous cocking; fire selector to suit left and right hand firers, and, a three-point sling for better carrying and maneuverability.

The ammunition for MSMC is of conventional type with the bullet cylindro-ogival for better ballistics as compared to a 9 mm round. A steel insert has been introduced in the tip of the bullet to achieve better penetration power.

Global Hunt For Carbines

The Indian Army is also on a global hunt for procurement of 43,300 Close Quarter Battle (COB) carbines along with 43318 Night Sights and 3,33,11,500 rounds of ammunition. The tender has been sent to companies in France, Israel, Poland, Czech and Slovak Republic, Russia, Ukraine, Singapore, Germany and the USA.

The essential requirements of the COB include that the weapon should be robust enough to carry enough to withstand, rough uses under various operational conditions. In wet conditions, the weapon should function with the same frequency as dry conditions.

The weapon should achieve minimum 600 rounds per minute cycle rate of fire.

The magazine should be robust enough to withstand rough usage under various operational conditions and have a capacity of 30 rounds.

The weapons should be accurate to the extent that it is able to effectively engage a human target at 200 meters with an aim to fire under normal condition of visibility.

The performance of the weapon should not be adversely affected by extremes of temperature from -30 degrees to +55 degrees Celsius. At these low temperatures, the performance of the weapon should not be degraded by cold weather problems of.

The performance of laser sights/passive night sights and reflex sights should not be affected by the extremes of temperature from -30 degrees Celsius to +55 degrees Celsius.

http://www.battle-technology.com/exhibitions.asp?key=135

that looks like someone described mp-7 over a telegraph
here is a pic of mp-7 for comparison
(its a close i know)