India starts 'visa on arrival' facility for Pakistani senior citizens

[Bang Galore]

........that is another brillant observation and conclusion ....so not giving visa is equal to kicking their old/sick people around. I assume you would be protesting USA not granting visa to LOTS of Indians as they too seem to be 'kicking us around'

You were the one drawing a connection, I wasn't. I would support both those position (going after militants & letting old people & medical tourists in) as separate independent positions. No need to link the two.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Do you even care to read up before you comment-----most of your post's are nothing but blind hate. Do you know the number of patents comming in from Pakistan including childre to get the so called low quality treatment that is deprived in your country. I just preay and wish that medical treatment is accessible to all those who can and cannot afford it beyond any boundaries.

Thanx to the so called low quality treatment a blind guy like me is trying to kick some sense in to "blind" guy like you.

Why do you waste time on pustules?

LET is recruiting and training 30,000 to 40,000 terrorists to carry out attacks in India and we give them visa on arrival?

Congis are minority boot lickkers.

Anyone not entirely dimwitted would have read the bit about this being applied to senior citizens. Those above 65. Those are not terrorists, those are not terrorist backers. Giving these old people visas on arrival will not help the 30,000 or 40,000 who die fighting for their cause within 5 years. Not giving them visas will also not dissuade the fanatics. In short, there is no connection between visas for old people and terrorist fighting measures.

 

[Joe Shearer]

good step, lets hope LeT doesnt play a spoilsport

They may. They are oriented to doing nothing else. So why should that affect our actions and policy? That allows them to dictate terms to us; either we abide by their wish-list, or they will prevent us from doing whatever is the sensible thing to do.

It is best to ignore them, and allow the security forces to handle them. They do that very well.

 

[Mritunjaya]

Shouldn't this be a reason to be nonchalant about their arrival.

Considering that pakistan has an active system to build sleeper cells in India and draw more Indian muslims as jihadis this scheme is fraught with risk. Recent reports have suggested that educated muslims in India are now getting drawn into terrorism on their own free will......last thing they need is a 'chacha' from pakistan telling them its the right thing to do.

How hard is it for an 50 year old ex army officer to show his age as 60, come to India and disappear? Do you think govt. is going to spend resources to search for senior citizens ? the "secular" forces of Indian will never allow this 'witch hunt'.

In any case since there has been no improvement in bilateral ties regarding terror attack in India, there is nothing to be gained by this foolish act. We just had a terror attack in Hyderabad.......the next attack is probably a couple of months away. Nothing has changed.....Indian lives continue to be cheap. Apparently Pakistani sick old men lives are more important.

 

[Joe Shearer]

so long overdue but good step nonetheless



don't you guys have an open border with nepal? was under the impression that theres free flow between the two. or do authorities check everyone who crosses for valid travel documents?

<tongue in cheek>

Only Kashmiris travelling back to their homes by the safe route.

 

[Mritunjaya]

You were the one drawing a connection, I wasn't. I would support both those position (going after militants & letting old people & medical tourists in) as separate independent positions. No need to link the two.

Connection is between pakistani govt. supporting terror and Indian govt. treating pakistani citizens as something separate from their govt. By doing so we play right into pakistani hands.

This has been their standard excuse for the last 50 years. Rouge elements continue to attack us....we 'understand' their 'plight' and release 90,000 POW. We forgive 'death of Indian citizens' in the interest of 'peace'.

Foreign policy is not conducted in this naive manner......its like the US govt. saying Iran govt. is evil but the people are good so let them build nukes. ..........North Korean govt. is evil ...but the people are good.

 

[anonymus]

Considering that pakistan has an active system to build sleeper cells in India and draw more Indian muslims as jihadis this scheme is fraught with risk. Recent reports have suggested that educated muslims in India are now getting drawn into terrorism on their own free will......last thing they need is a 'chacha' from pakistan telling them its the right thing to do.

How hard is it for an 50 year old ex army officer to show his age as 60, come to India and disappear? Do you think govt. is going to spend resources to search for senior citizens ? the "secular" forces of Indian will never allow this 'witch hunt'.

In any case since there has been no improvement in bilateral ties regarding terror attack in India, there is nothing to be gained by this foolish act. We just had a terror attack in Hyderabad.......the next attack is probably a couple of months away. Nothing has changed.....Indian lives continue to be cheap. Apparently Pakistani sick old men lives are more important.

My point was that since India is not providing any Exclusive Service, what difference would it make to to pakistanis if it refuses to treat some patients.Anyway you have responded in an completely tangential manner but for your arguments

1. Would a chacha from pakistan have any out of turn impact on ready to be radicalized muslims?What can he tell them which they cannot gain from Internet?

2.That chacha or 55 year old army officer would be coming on a visa and would have fixed itinerary.How difficult would it be keep an eye over that chacha.Even if he disappears how difficult would it be pinpoint the area in which he has disappeared based on his last known location.

3.Won't bangladesh and nepal route suite better for a sleeper cell.

Connection is between pakistani govt. supporting terror and Indian govt. treating pakistani citizens as something separate from their govt. By doing so we play right into pakistani hands.

This has been their standard excuse for the last 50 years. Rouge elements continue to attack us....we 'understand' their 'plight' and release 90,000 POW. We forgive 'death of Indian citizens' in the interest of 'peace'.

Foreign policy is not conducted in this naive manner......its like the US govt. saying Iran govt. is evil but the people are good so let them build nukes. ..........North Korean govt. is evil ...but the people are good.

1.we were duty bound under geneva convention to release them.

2.North korean government is evil...........and its people are brainwashed.

 

[ShahidT]

There is no such thing as Islamic terrorism.

What the Indian soldiers in uniforms have done and continue to do so is nothing less than terrorism.

Does this mean that Pakistan should stop freeing Indian fisherman, allowing Indians for religious reasons to visit Pakistan? No.

Pakistan as a responsible nation puts politics aside and continues to play its role based on humanitarian grounds, not just with India but throughout the world under the flagship of UN.

allowing sikhs to visit their holy sites is not really a humanitarian gesture like freeing fisherman. would you say that iran allowing ethnic persian zoroastrians to visit the native land of their religion is a humanitarian gesture which should be commended? its more like that is the bare minimum that can be done, be it wartime or peacetime. it's more of an unwritten rule which everyone expects will be followed, unlike breaking your rights under international legal norms and returning fisherman/border crossers.

sikhism is the only religion which was founded and flourished wholly in punjab. so denying sikhs to visit punjab is like barring quraysh tribes from the western half of arabian peninsula, just wrong in every way. but still many of us employ this rhetoric to make it look like we are doing them some great favour. nothing should ever get in the way of our humility and righteousness.

 

[Bang Galore]

Connection is between pakistani govt. supporting terror and Indian govt. treating pakistani citizens as something separate from their govt. By doing so we play right into pakistani hands.

This has been their standard excuse for the last 50 years. Rouge elements continue to attack us....we 'understand' their 'plight' and release 90,000 POW. We forgive 'death of Indian citizens' in the interest of 'peace'.

Foreign policy is not conducted in this naive manner......its like the US govt. saying Iran govt. is evil but the people are good so let them build nukes. ..........North Korean govt. is evil ...but the people are good.

Don't disagree with you in general but there is some logic to treat some segments of the population separately(old with families/requiring medical treatment). However I cannot completely disagree with your point on principle. What is being sought to be done here is to try something different as opposed to not doing that. While scepticism is warranted based on past experience, there is very little else to do if one is looking for any kind of movement at all.

The P.O.W. was at another time, another place. Mrs. Gandhi must have gone after an accepted signed agreement on Kashmir rather than go by Bhutto's assurances but that is purely with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight.

 

[Mritunjaya]

My point was that since India is not providing any Exclusive Service, what difference would it make to to pakistanis if it refuses to treat some patients.Anyway you have responded in an completely tangential manner but for your arguments

1. Would a chacha from pakistan have any out of turn impact on ready to be radicalized muslims?What can he tell them which they cannot gain from Internet?

2.That chacha or 55 year old army officer would be coming on a visa and would have fixed itinerary.How difficult would it be keep an eye over that chacha.Even if he disappears how difficult would it be pinpoint the area in which he has disappeared based on his last known location.

3.Won't bangladesh and nepal route suite better for a sleeper cell.

The point would be to hold pakistanis accountable for their actions, and YES it means hold them accountable for the actions of their govt. too (unless you too want to sprout the nonsense that innocent pak citizens is different from its evil govt.). Its not such a hard concept to understand....its is practiced all over the world.

A well trained "Chacha's" word during the friday namaz has the potential to sow seeds or terror in otherwise normal kids. Friday prayers was the standard propaganda machinery in kashmir. Its a tried and tested method. IB monitor friday sermons in certain mosques in India.

Nepal route is easier....but that does not mean we offer them a buffet of choices.

 

[Mritunjaya]

Don't disagree with you in general but there is some logic to treat some segments of the population separately(old with families/requiring medical treatment). However I cannot completely disagree with your point on principle. What is being sought to be done here is to try something different as opposed to not doing that. While scepticism is warranted based on past experience, there is very little else to do if one is looking for any kind of movement at all.

The P.O.W. was at another time, another place. Mrs. Gandhi must have gone after an accepted signed agreement on Kashmir rather than go by Bhutto's assurances but that is purely with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight.

Logic dictates we receive something in exchange for our gesture of 'visa on arrival'. Obvious logic would be to ask for progress on mumbai terror attack for which we have provided 'dossiers' . What has GOI got other than 'promises' from the GOP ?

Unless India has a clear plan what we expect from pakistan and how to get it ....there is not point in playing our hand and looking like a fool.

How many Indian deaths does it take for the GOI to start valuing them ? It would be nice to have a fixed number so that we know what to expect.

 

[ShahidT]

<tongue in cheek>

Only Kashmiris travelling back to their homes by the safe route.

you do realize that the reason for their picking up arms in the first place is the incredible failure on your part since sheikh abdullah's death to provide them any political air to breathe? i'm not absolving other forces of their part in exacerbating the problems, but the root cause of it all should be the focus of your attention, not feeling smug on their laying down arms to return so that some semblance of peace may return to the valley, and leave your forces with less bogus justification to brutally repress common people. just take a step back, let them live without thorough interference for some time, and hopefully with cooler heads they can articulate their desires in a more cogent and agreeable manner.

however, i'd rather not have thread to turn into another kashmir mud slinging fest as so often happens once the moronic brigades arrive from both sides. lets just end it here and not raise any more sensitive issues with 'tongue-in-cheek' remarks, yes?

 

[Joe Shearer]

you do realize that the reason for their picking up arms in the first place is the incredible failure on your part since sheikh abdullah's death to provide them any political air to breathe? i'm not absolving other forces of their part in exacerbating the problems, but the root cause of it all should be the focus of your attention, not feeling smug on their laying down arms to return so that some semblance of peace may return to the valley, and leave your forces with less bogus justification to brutally repress common people. just take a step back, let them live without thorough interference for some time, and hopefully with cooler heads they can articulate their desires in a more cogent and agreeable manner.

however, i'd rather not have thread to turn into another kashmir mud slinging fest as so often happens once the moronic brigades arrive from both sides. lets just end it here and not raise any more sensitive issues with 'tongue-in-cheek' remarks, yes?

I think you are over-reacting. I think that you raise a number of issues which seek, even demand, rebuttal.

However, in the same spirit of asymmetric tolerance displayed by my country's administration, even when faced by an opposite asymmetry from your country, I shall let this pass. This once.

Please consider this a salute to your balanced views and rational discourse, not as a sign that you can hector others if you dislike the attitude they bring to any discussion.

 

[danger007]

Well, great to know situation has been improved. I will not be surprised if Hinduism evolves into accepting Islam's values of marrying multiple women if there is a need to be, as the women will out number the males soon.

In India marrying multiple women is not allowed(unless his wife is ill or some other medical backgrounds or divorce)... otherwise he will sent to the jail....

 

[Soumitra]

Well, great to know situation has been improved. I will not be surprised if Hinduism evolves into accepting Islam's values of marrying multiple women if there is a need to be, as the women will out number the males soon.

Usually I don't quote on religion but I would like to say that Hinduism is one of the most flexible religion. Infact it is said to be a way of life rather than a religion. We are not stuck with cultural practices and rules evolved 1400 years ago in a far off land. We do and will always change along with the times. We do not consider anything as sacrosanct till the end of the world