India must not legitimise Israel with Modi’s visit : gulfnews

[Rasengan]

In Quran , many verses are there regarding Nasranis.


2:113 - The Jews say "The Christians have nothing [true] to stand on," and the Christians say, "The Jews have nothing to stand on," although they [both] recite the Scripture.Even thus speak those who know not. Allah will judge between them on the Day of Resurrection concerning that wherein they differ

However this quote does not mention the word Nasrani, because there are a number of denominations within the Christian faith which trace there lineage to the Disciples of Jesus (PBUH). My main point was centered towards the idea, that there is no shred of evidence that the Holy Quran mentions the notion that Jesus (PBUH) was born in Nazareth because its very specific in mentioning groups or tribes. The land of Israel does not solely belong to the Jewish community, because the Palestinians have an equal right at the same time. The bible in its current format is not accepted by the vast majority of Muslims because it has been changed and this occurred during the reign of Constantine. Hence why its not surprising that Christmas and Easter which was a pagan festival was implemented into the empire to create harmony.

Israel as a country never existed although a state called Judea was formed. However just because your ancestors came from a particular land, does not automatically mean that you deserve to steal the land 3000 years later from the current indigenous people who live there. A number of Israelis were European Jews who actually have no ancestry to the land of Judea as they were converting into the faith. I am not advocating a policy of kicking out the Jews, however they should share the land equally which they are not doing at all.

Furthermore, the term used in the Holy Quran for the followers of Jesus (PBUH) is 'Nasara', meaning the helpers. The reason as to why the Holy Quran is calling the adherents of Jesus (PBUH) ‘the Helpers’ stems from a conversation between him and his disciples. According to the Holy Quran when Jesus (PBUH) began his mission he asked his disciples who would be helping him in the cause of God. The Holy Quran states:

“O you who believe! Be you helpers (in the Cause) of Allah as said Jesus, son of Mary, to the disciples: Who are my helpers (in the Cause) of Allah? The disciples said: We are Allah’s helpers.” [61:14]

The most common terminology used for Christians in the Holy Quran is the People of the Book. Nasrani in India claim to be descendants of Saint Thomas and they are called this name in reference to there belief that Jesus (PBUH) was born in Nazareth. I am sure we will have a difference of opinion on this issue, however I will respect your point of view.

 

[Tridibans]

Israels problem is that its problems are not just external

The arabs/muslims are growing deep in israels own heart

You still did not answer my question. My Muslim friend (Shia from Lucknow) told me how his extended family members are worried in Pakistan. He along with his uncles visited Najaf somewhere in Iraq for some religious visit and said many Shias from Pakistan say the same thing (though understandably they are die hard Pakistani patriots)....

 

[Hindustani78]

However this quote does not mention the word Nasrani, because there are a number of denominations within the Christian faith which trace there lineage to the Disciples of Jesus (PBUH). My main point was centered towards the idea, that there is no shred of evidence that the Holy Quran mentions the notion that Jesus (PBUH) was born in Nazareth because its very specific in mentioning groups or tribes. The land of Israel does not solely belong to the Jewish community, because the Palestinians have an equal right at the same time. The bible in its current format is not accepted by the vast majority of Muslims because it has been changed and this occurred during the reign of Constantine. Hence why its not surprising that Christmas and Easter which was a pagan festival was implemented into the empire to create harmony.

Israel as a country never existed although a state called Judea was formed. However just because your ancestors came from a particular land, does not automatically mean that you deserve to steal the land 3000 years later from the current indigenous people who live there. A number of Israelis were European Jews who actually have no ancestry to the land of Judea as they were converting into the faith. I am not advocating a policy of kicking out the Jews, however they should share the land equally which they are not doing at all.

Furthermore, the term used in the Holy Quran for the followers of Jesus (PBUH) is 'Nasara', meaning the helpers. The reason as to why the Holy Quran is calling the adherents of Jesus (PBUH) ‘the Helpers’ stems from a conversation between him and his disciples. According to the Holy Quran when Jesus (PBUH) began his mission he asked his disciples who would be helping him in the cause of God. The Holy Quran states:

“O you who believe! Be you helpers (in the Cause) of Allah as said Jesus, son of Mary, to the disciples: Who are my helpers (in the Cause) of Allah? The disciples said: We are Allah’s helpers.” [61:14]

The most common terminology used for Christians in the Holy Quran is the People of the Book. Nasrani in India claim to be descendants of Saint Thomas and they are called this name in reference to there belief that Jesus (PBUH) was born in Nazareth. I am sure we will have a difference of opinion on this issue, however I will respect your point of view.

In Quranic verses , Christians have been called as Nasranis and this term has been used many times in Quran in different places.

In Quran, Jesus is referred to in over ninety verses in fifteen surahs and in different verses its mention about the birth of Jesus which are further explained hadiths. Mostly in Surah Maryam and Surah Al Imran , we can find about the Birth of Jesus.

Qur’an says she went to a distant area away from Jerusalem and it was there that Jesus was born. Name of this ‘distant area’ is not mentioned , but many Quranic scholars say that it could be Bethlehem. King Herod was searching for the baby and that ultimately led to flight of Mary with Jesus to Nazareth.

 

[Rasengan]

In Quran, Jesus is referred to in over ninety verses in fifteen surahs and in different verses its mention about the birth of Jesus which are further explained hadiths. Mostly in Surah Maryam and Surah Al Imran , we can find about the Birth of Jesus. Qur’an says she went to a distant area away from Jerusalem and it was there that Jesus was born. Name of this ‘distant area’ is not mentioned , but many Quranic scholars say that it could be Bethlehem. King Herod was searching for the baby and that ultimately led to flight of Mary with Jesus to Nazareth.

I never disputed on the idea that Jesus (PBHU) was never mentioned in the Holy Quran, because there are a number of verses which explain his birth, upbringing and the events of crucifixion. However under no circumstances does the Holy Quran describe Jesus (PBUH) being born in Nazareth, because this perception is only held by Christians which I have always maintained during the course of our small debate. Many Quranic scholars have opinions and viewpoints on topics, however there word is not law because they are not omnipotent. However, why exactly does this particular factoid relate to the State of Israel? Palestine has been mentioned during the times of the Pharaoh's, please read articles on google to learn more on this terminology.

In Quranic verses , Christians have been called as Nasranis and this term has been used many times in Quran in different places.

These quotes from the Holy Quran prove that Christians are called Al-Nasara which means 'the helpers' and if you don't believe me then please invite an Arab into the discussion to verify this. Under no circumstance were Christians called Nasrani.



005:014 (part)
“And from those who said, indeed we are ‘nasara’, We took their covenant; but they forgot a part of what they were reminded of it. So we aroused between them enmity and hatred till the Day of Resurrection…”



009:030
“…And the ‘al-Nasara’ say, 'The Messiah is the Son of God’ That is their saying with their mouths, they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before. May God destroy them! How they are deluded!…”

002:113 (part)
“And the Jews say,- 'The Christians stand not on anything (nothing true) and the al-Nasara (Christians) say, 'The Jews stand not on-anything although they (both) recite the book….”


005:082 (part)
“…Indeed! We are ‘Nasara’. That is because there are among them priests(Qissis) and monks (Ruhban), and because they are not proud / arrogant”


005:018 (part)
“And say the Jews and Christians (al-Nasara), 'We are the children of God, and His beloved…'

 

[Hindustani78]

I never disputed on the idea that Jesus (PBHU) was never mentioned in the Holy Quran, because there are a number of verses which explain his birth, upbringing and the events of crucifixion. However under no circumstances does the Holy Quran describe Jesus (PBUH) being born in Nazareth, because this perception is only held by Christians which I have always maintained during the course of our small debate. Many Quranic scholars have opinions and viewpoints on topics, however there word is not law because they are not omnipotent. However, why exactly does this particular factoid relate to the State of Israel? Palestine has been mentioned during the times of the Pharaoh's, please read articles on google to learn more on this terminology.



These quotes from the Holy Quran prove that Christians are called Al-Nasara which means 'the helpers' and if you don't believe me then please invite an Arab into the discussion to verify this. Under no circumstance were Christians called Nasrani.



005:014 (part)
“And from those who said, indeed we are ‘nasara’, We took their covenant; but they forgot a part of what they were reminded of it. So we aroused between them enmity and hatred till the Day of Resurrection…”



009:030
“…And the ‘al-Nasara’ say, 'The Messiah is the Son of God’ That is their saying with their mouths, they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before. May God destroy them! How they are deluded!…”

002:113 (part)
“And the Jews say,- 'The Christians stand not on anything (nothing true) and the al-Nasara (Christians) say, 'The Jews stand not on-anything although they (both) recite the book….”


005:082 (part)
“…Indeed! We are ‘Nasara’. That is because there are among them priests(Qissis) and monks (Ruhban), and because they are not proud / arrogant”


005:018 (part)
“And say the Jews and Christians (al-Nasara), 'We are the children of God, and His beloved…'

Qur’an says she went to a distant area away from Jerusalem and it was there that Jesus was born. Name of this ‘distant area’ is not mentioned , but many Quranic scholars say that it could be Bethlehem.

Bethlehem is a Palestinian city located in the central West Bank, about 10 kilometers south of Jerusalem but Jesus was grown up in Nazareth.

 

[Umair Nawaz]

It is precisely on these grounds that India — being one of the architects of the non-aligned movement, which refuses to align with any bloc or alliance, particularly those led by the US and Russia; and as a supporter of nonviolence and international cooperation as a means of settling disputes — must cancel the visit. New Delhi has an obligation to live up to its own ethics and delegitimise Israel.


m..com/opinion/editorials/india-must-not-legitimise-israel-with-modi-s-visit-1.1528076

THIS ALL WAS ACTUALLY A BIG LIE. They were trying to get attention for such sweet policies. But now when they have the attention their real face is coming to surface. They wont give a damn abt this or palestine or making israel accountable.

 

[Rasengan]

Qur’an says she went to a distant area away from Jerusalem and it was there that Jesus was born. Name of this ‘distant area’ is not mentioned , but many Quranic scholars say that it could be Bethlehem.

Again I never disputed the fact that Jesus (PBUH) was never born from the land of Palestine However, in your previous message you specifically proclaimed that Jesus (PBUH) was from Nazareth which is a city in Israel and this is supported by the Holy Quran and the Bible. Obviously, now you have conceded that the place of birth was never mentioned in the Holy Quran. In addition scholars can have an opinion on a topic, however its just an opinion not 100% guaranteed to be correct. You can personally believe in the conjecture that he was born in Nazareth, however don't characterized this as a linkage to Islam. He may have been born in Bethlehem, however again not mentioned in he Hadith or the Holy Quran. You did not argue on the case of Nasrani because I can now assume that you have accepted the logical argument that Christians are called Al-Nasara. If you require further confirmation, then please ask a member who understands and reads the Holy Quran to translate the verse 5:14 in the link below. Since I can read the Holy Quran, it clearly states Nasara, however for a true and fair view ask another member for verification

Surat Al-Ma'idah - The Noble Qur'an - القرآن الكريم

 

[Umair Nawaz]

israel is jewish land even as per bible and quran itself soindia will never ditch israel no matter what as for palestinians well palestine was never a nation itself but israel was throughout recorded history

india supports israel and long live indo-israeli friendship

not as per Quran.

 

[rmi5]

Two enemies of muslims jews and hindus

Whats the problem

India is a danger to muslim both the iranians and arabs must realise this, Pakistan is a bulwark containing India

We have refused to give them access across Pakistan and put them under pressure in Afghanistan, iran should realise israel will be more of a danger if india is given unwatched access to chabahar, we will hit them in Afghanistan regardless

We have allied with indian ocean states like sri lanka and maldives as a counter balance to India and have allowed China a way to operate in Indian ocean

We understand india is a enemy, india and israel is a threat to all arabs and Iranians too

India is a natural ally of Iran. Jews and Iranians were friends for 2500 years since Cyrus the Great, The Emperor of Persia, freed jews from Babylon oppression. The current Iranian administration was established when ummah non-sense sentiments was very strong in the region, and chose Israel to be an enemy. But, I hope they realize that their true enemies are their neighboring fellow muslims who want to slaughter Iranians since Iranians are shiites.

Sunnis Muslims even kill shia Muslims as demonstrated by Isis and in Pakistan

 

[mike2000 is back]

Well we have a good relation with all those nations you mentioned in there.
Like Israel they are also important to us .We have 7 million expats in GCC and also several billion $ of trade with them .Iran is also our partner .You should know about our project in Chabhar .
Fact is everyone is important to us.This wont be a political trip.

Nobody said otherwise man. But of these Middle Eastern countries think India will jeopardize it's close /strategic relationship with Israel because of them, then they are dreaming. Lol

Of course India is and should keep trading with as much countries as it can, since it serves its interests, it's not a zero sum game anymore unlike during the cold war. Today's competition is much more complex. However if these Middle Eastern countries where to ever put India in a position where it has to choose between them and parsley, then I'm. Afraid they will be dissapointed with the answer.

The arabs millions in reserve and alternative options to sell

India has a 1.2 billion population that cant go two days without fuel, the GCC will lose SOME money... india on the other hand will grind to a halt

The jews are in trouble the muslim world is massive has immense amount of resources and will become the largest faith group in the world

Jews are hated by muslims and their crimes in Palestine will cause immense pain to jews internationally and in israel


Israel faces a demographic nightmare with the amount of arabs/muslims on the verge of overtaking the number if jews across gaza, israel and the west bank

With a higher birth rate, palestinians who marry early have their families quickly will spell the end of a democratic jew state, israel will either become a bi national state where the number of arab/muslims keeps rising or it becomes a apartheid state where it oppresses the majority to keep jew rule a untenable situation


Power comes and goes, power will return to the muslim world it is too big and to full of resources for it not to



Im pakistani i hate jews and i hate hindus so i couldnt care less but it works in our favour if we can instigate muslim countries which india needs against india using israel

Do you really believe all what you wrote or are you being sarcastic?? Lol if we can't compete /stand a chance of beating them then let's outbreed them. FOR REAL? ?? LMAO go ahead and outbreed them. hopefully by doing so you will become a superpower like begladesh and Pakistan are today with about 200million people each and growing

 

[ayesha.a]

Reality is destruction of babri, ban on beef and muslim eating, discrimination against muslims in work place l, Gujraat, etc

Well thank god, that there is a ban on "muslim eating"!

 

[Bang Galore]

Well thank god, that there is a ban on "muslim eating"!

 

[ayesha.a]

The most common terminology used for Christians in the Holy Quran is the People of the Book. Nasrani in India claim to be descendants of Saint Thomas and they are called this name in reference to there belief that Jesus (PBUH) was born in Nazareth.

I'm only responding to this specific part of your post. I have to point out that among christians in India, just as with muslims and hindus, sects exist not so much on the basis of theological questions, but based on who they were before entering that religion. For example, the Nazranis of Kerala were originally from a certain prominent hindu brahmin family, who converted into christianity in the first century AD. It was their lineage that made them want to stand apart from other christians, not really any theological positions. They do claim to have been converted by St Thomas, but doubts have been cast on that claim. (I don't really know much about it.)

BTW, the Nazranis of Kerala owed allegiance to the Syriac church, centered in Persia. Parts of modern day Iran and Syria were their holy land. Of course, today such issues don't really matter to them.

 

[jaatram]

Well thank god, that there is a ban on "muslim eating"!

 

[ayesha.a]

Do you really believe all what you wrote or are you being sarcastic?? Lol if we can't compete /stand a chance of beating them then let's outbreed them. FOR REAL? ?? LMAO go ahead and outbreed them. hopefully by doing so you will become a superpower like begladesh and Pakistan are today with about 200million people each and growing

I don't know if he is serious or not, but I can assure you that there are some nutjobs who seriously do believe that. Another one was that the islamic world will get nuclear weapons (they don't really remember Pakistan, I guess) when the French muslim population reaches 51%, through immigration and outbreeding.