India may snap business, transport links with Pak: Chidambaram

[was]

Hwo cares about this ,trade, with india. better we anticipate them and close all links

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Haha...have you read any articles about Pakistan in the international media lately? Sheesh....

What do articles mean?

What matters are the official positions of states towards Pakistan, and on that count Pakistan's government and her institutions have been exonerated and cooperation between the West seems to be on the upswing.

Again, I don't understand why you guys don't see it as a problem that Pakistani terrorists, trained, motivated, supplied from your country carried out this massacre, that there are still terror organizations recruiting young men with nothing better to do than kill innocents and getting killed in the bargain for some imaginary goodies in the afterlife, that even if there has been no official involvement or it has not been proved yet, everyone is saying that Pakistani elements did it and Pakistan needs to take action against them.

Is just the fact that people are not blaming the Pakistani establishment reason enough to be happy in the face of all this! I for one would not think so. At least it does give a lie to the claims that Pakistan has now come clean of the bad old days of terror being a state policy. It seems to prove that Pakistan will only take action when pushed to the wall. Not a happy situation for a real moderate Pakistani, I guess.

That is a misrepresentation of the Pakistani position. Pakistan has not said 'it does not care', in fact she has clearly indicated that action will be taken on the basis of credible evidence provided. On that count Pakistan raided and shut down the camps and infrastructure of the JuD and and LeT and arrested all three alleged suspects, Lakhvi, Saeed, Shah, along with other leaders and members.

Pakistan repeatedly called for diplomatic engagement, cooperation and even joint investigations from day one. The Indian response was to go on a belligerent and arrogant speculative accusations and demands spree. 'All options open' was threatened', FOB's activated, leave canceled etc. etc.

Instead of respecting Pakistan's process and laws, we have seen continued demands (not requests ) for extradition, and a refusal to share evidence (even no all Pakistan got was transcripts, not evidence that could actually be admissible in a court of law). Pakistan has nonetheless again offered the option of a joint investigation, and yet again been rebuffed.

The GoP and Pakistani institutions have been exonerated, that is a slap in the face of the lies spouted by the likes of Manmohan Singh and Mukherjee. It wasn't hard to see this coming, since India's own evidence dossier cleared Pakistani institutions of involvement.

Until India 'grows up' and acts responsibly and learns some respect, shows it and cooperates, it will continue to exacerbate tensions and prevent progress into the investigation.

 

[Energon]

Until India 'grows up' and acts responsibly and learns some respect, shows it and cooperates, it will continue to exacerbate tensions and prevent progress into the investigation.

Perhaps they will have the luxury of doing so when Pakistan ceases to be a hotbed of Islamist/Islamic terrorism that nurtures, trains and exports people to murder and destabilize India's population. Pakistan isn't in a position to demand anything here let alone respect, and their insistence upon doing so is nothing short of laughable.

Indian authorities much like that of the rest of the world for very good reasons have absolutely no confidence in their Pakistani counterparts. The reason Pakistan is so eager for a "joint cooperation" is because it is the best way to unearth foreign intelligence sources in Pakistan, which as it turns out are going to be far more worthy of protection than any hollow bilateral relationship with Pakistan which culminates in yet another episode of gunfire, explosions, invasion, death and destruction. The investigation was conducted by US, British and Indian intelligence agencies with the sole intention of not letting it be tainted by the involvement of the Pakistani authorities.

The fact that organizations like LeT (originally conceived with help of the Pakistani military/intelligence agencies to breed "non state actors" who could commit acts of murder in India while conveniently making it impossible to hold their host state responsible) are still around despite numerous promises to crack down upon them clearly shows that Pakistan is not interested in eliminating terrorism from their midst as long as Indians are the targets. And it was right for Collin Powell to make issue of this given that he was the person being lied to by Musharraf after the 2002 Parliament attack.

The way the current Pakistani leadership has handled this issue by attempting to obfuscate the origins of the gunmen through a pathetic dog and pony show only further reinforces the idea that they're not serious about eliminating terrorism. It is also clear that not much can be expected from the Pakistani legal establishment which can't even seem to decide upon a sentence for their misbehaving fast bowlers.

The damage is already done... in Mumbai. At this point it's all up to Pakistan, they can either get their act together and do some "growing up" themselves, or face the consequences for being a terrorist haven. Either way, don't expect anyone to treat them with "respect" in the foreseeable future.

 

[IceCold]

Perhaps they will have the luxury of doing so when Pakistan ceases to be a hotbed of Islamist/Islamic terrorism that nurtures, trains and exports people to murder and destabilize India's population. Pakistan isn't in a position to demand anything here let alone respect, and their insistence upon doing so is nothing short of laughable.

Indian authorities much like that of the rest of the world for very good reasons have absolutely no confidence in their Pakistani counterparts. The reason Pakistan is so eager for a "joint cooperation" is because it is the best way to unearth foreign intelligence sources in Pakistan, which as it turns out are going to be far more worthy of protection than any hollow bilateral relationship with Pakistan which culminates in yet another episode of gunfire, explosions, invasion, death and destruction. The investigation was conducted by US, British and Indian intelligence agencies with the sole intention of not letting it be tainted by the involvement of the Pakistani authorities.

The fact that organizations like LeT (originally conceived with help of the Pakistani military/intelligence agencies to breed "non state actors" who could commit acts of murder in India while conveniently making it impossible to hold their host state responsible) are still around despite numerous promises to crack down upon them clearly shows that Pakistan is not interested in eliminating terrorism from their midst as long as Indians are the targets. And it was right for Collin Powell to make issue of this given that he was the person being lied to by Musharraf after the 2002 Parliament attack.

The way the current Pakistani leadership has handled this issue by attempting to obfuscate the origins of the gunmen through a pathetic dog and pony show only further reinforces the idea that they're not serious about eliminating terrorism. It is also clear that not much can be expected from the Pakistani legal establishment which can't even seem to decide upon a sentence for their misbehaving fast bowlers.

The damage is already done... in Mumbai. At this point it's all up to Pakistan, they can either get their act together and do some "growing up" themselves, or face the consequences for being a terrorist haven. Either way, don't expect anyone to treat them with "respect" in the foreseeable future.

It is good to know that those sitting in the white house doesn't think on the same lines as you do, otherwise we would have been long declared a terrorist state in the wake of Mumbai blasts. Do you seriously believe that if India had so much evidence regarding Pakistan's involvement, it could not even earn Pakistan an international condemnation, how pathetic. Seriously if anyone that needs to grow up, its Indians and their ilks.
On a side note India also said about Pakistani establishment being involved, what do you have to say about that specially when your pals the Brits feel the other way round and more over FBI have cleared ISI.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

^^ Right, let me know when India decides to fulfill her obligations as a UN member and agrees to implement the UNSC resolutions before getting on your sanctimonious high horse of 'responsibility'.

Unlike India, Pakistan did fulfill her obligations by cracking down on the JuD infrastructure after the UN determination. For that matter, interviews by the LeT members in the Indian media have made quite clear that their operations as an organized group have suffered severely since the restrictions applied on them by Pakistan on them after the Parliament attacks.

JuD members said much the same after the Pakistani crackdown in the wake of the UN decision, with most of their centers and charitable entities seized and under government control.

The only 'tamasha' here was the war mongering BS spouted by the Indian media and the GoI. Pakistan has from day one asked for diplomatic and official engagement to bring the perpetrators to task. Neither the UK nor the US have at any point officially asked Pakistan to accede to India's request for extradition, a blatant slap in the face for Indian diplomacy and tantrums.

Whatever absurd reasons India has for not sharing evidence or performing a joint evidence, the fact of the matter is that the people being accused are Pakistani citizens, and Pakistan has all legal justification to try these suspects in her courts and according to her system. If India doe snot like it, tough luck, go suck on your thumbs and mope in a corner like the infants you are - Pakistan has offered all reasonable accommodation for pursuing the case.

As for the 'relationship' threats, I believe you actually have to have one before attempting to threaten one as some sort of loss to Pakistan.

So let Pakistan know when you lot are done 'growing up' and show some responsibility in implementing your intentional and bilateral obligations.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Seriously if anyone that needs to grow up, its Indians and their ilks.

India can't grow up - for her to that she would have to give up her irredentism, stop being belligerent and a bully, fulfil her obligations under the instrument of Partition and the UNSC resolutions and allow a plebiscite in Kashmir.

Its far easier for her to threaten, bluster, and demand than it is to cooperate and engage.

 

[Energon]

It is good to know that those sitting in the white house doesn't think on the same lines as you do,

No? We send drones to bomb targets at will, because we know that the Pakistani establishment can't be relied upon to act constructively. If anything, the current white house legitimized this trend.

 

[Energon]

The only 'tamasha' here was the war mongering BS spouted by the Indian media and the GoI.

??? Are you kidding me? That was the 'tamasha' to you? Not the 10 radicalized murdering maniacs who set sail from Pakistan to hold an entire city hostage? If so, then we are on two very different levels and obviously have nothing meaningful to say to one another.

 

[Flintlock]

India can't grow up - for her to that she would have to give up her irredentism, stop being belligerent and a bully, fulfil her obligations under the instrument of Partition and the UNSC resolutions and allow a plebiscite in Kashmir.

Its far easier for her to threaten, bluster, and demand than it is to cooperate and engage.

Please, don't try and link the two - the terror attacks have little to do with kashmir, and everything to do with Pakistan's inability/unwillingness to control extremists aiming to cause death and destruction in India.

 

[IceCold]

No? We send drones to bomb targets at will, because we know that the Pakistani establishment can't be relied upon to act constructively. If anything, the current white house legitimized this trend.

This so called will of yours is subjected to our approval, is it not? Last time we threaten the mighty US, Mullen was sent in to calm things a bit. You really think you can pull this one off without Pakistan's approval, you couldn't be more wrong.

 

[jeypore]

This so called will of yours is subjected to our approval, is it not? Last time we threaten the mighty US, Mullen was sent in to calm things a bit. You really think you can pull this one off without Pakistan's approval, you couldn't be more wrong.

Icecold, i completly disagree with you on the statement above. Pakistan has never approved drone attacks, yet US is doing it.

Last time we threaten the mighty US, Mullen was sent in to calm things a bit.

Pakistan is in no position to threaten the US, and US would come to your knees to calm things down, utterly nonsence.

 

[IceCold]

Icecold, i completly disagree with you on the statement above. Pakistan has never approved drone attacks, yet US is doing it.



Pakistan is in no position to threaten the US, and US would come to your knees to calm things down, utterly nonsence.

You can disagree with me all you want, do i care, NO

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

??? Are you kidding me? That was the 'tamasha' to you? Not the 10 radicalized murdering maniacs who set sail from Pakistan to hold an entire city hostage? If so, then we are on two very different levels and obviously have nothing meaningful to say to one another.

Please, don't try and link the two - the terror attacks have little to do with kashmir, and everything to do with Pakistan's inability/unwillingness to control extremists aiming to cause death and destruction in India.

Stop dissembling both of you. No connection between the Mumbai attacks and Kasmir was made by me - what I did point out is that in the face of tragedy, the GOI and the Indian media chose to indulge in a tamasha and blame game.

If there is any entity responsible for trivializing and making a tamasha out of the Mumbai tragedy, it is the GoI and the Indian media.

The GoI has acted with extreme irresponsibility and chosen to vitiate the atmosphere instead of engage with Pakistan respectfully and cooperate with her.

I merely pointed out that India's violations of her commitments on Kashmir, to both the instrument of partition and the UNSC resolutions, and her actions in the aftermath of Mumbai, indicate a pattern of such arrogance, belligerence and irresponsibility for the sake of attacking and denigrating Pakistan in some fashion.

 

[Flintlock]

Stop dissembling both of you. No connection between the Mumbai attacks and Kasmir was made by me - what I did point out is that in the face of tragedy, the GOI and the Indian media chose to indulge in a tamasha and blame game.

If there is any entity responsible for trivializing and making a tamasha out of the Mumbai tragedy, it is the GoI and the Indian media.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

If there is any entity responsible for trivializing and making a tamasha out of the Mumbai tragedy, it is the GoI and the Indian media.



[url="

- BrassTacks: The Mumbai Drama-Real Untold Story Part4[/url]

Indeed - the aftermath of the Indian media's tamasha was our own media going over the top. But the difference here is important, the Pakistani response was in reaction to the belligerence, lies and accusations coming out of the Indian media.

The blame for acting irresponsibly, starting the whole 'tamasha' and vitiating the atmosphere still lies with the GoI and Indian Media.