What's new

India looks to Israel for new fighter’s air-to-air missiles

sudhir007

SENIOR MEMBER
Joined
Jul 6, 2009
Messages
4,728
Reaction score
1
India looks to Israel for new fighter's air-to-air missiles - Ariel View

At this stage in its procurement process, the Indian air force wants Israeli-made air-to-air missiles to hang under the wings of its new fighter aircraft.

The Indian government has yet to make the final selection between the French Dassault Rafale and the Russian Sukhoi Su-30. But all indications are that there is a consensus among professionals about the air-to-air weapon.

If the SU-30 is eventually selected to be the backbone of the Indian air force, the intention of New Delhi is to equip it with two Israeli-made, combat-proven air-to-air missiles.

Both are manufactured by Rafael: one is the Python 5, a fifth-generation air-to-air missile; and the other is the Derby active radar missile.

Python 5 has a length of 3.1m (10ft) and diameter of 16cm, and weighs 105kg (230lb). It can carry an 11kg high-explosive fragmentation warhead equipped with an active laser proximity fuse.

The missile features a new electro-optical infrared seeker with high off-boresight capability. The infrared seeker scans the target area for the threat and locks on for terminal chase after the target is identified.

It employs a dual-waveband focal plane array (FPA). The FPA ensures the attainment of small, low-signature aim-points during day or night in clear and cloudy conditions. The highly advanced image and signal algorithms guide the missile towards the target.

Python 5 is also equipped with lock-on before launch (LOBL) and lock-on after launch (LOAL) capabilities. In LOAL mode, the target information is transmitted from the launch aircraft to the missile.

The missile offers a high hit probability and excellent resistance to countermeasures. It can even engage targets capable of performing evasive manoeuvres. The full sphere launch capability allows 360° engagement around the launch aircraft, while the all-aspect/all-direction attack ability ensures the simultaneous destruction of multiple targets.

The Derby is a beyond visual range (BVR), medium-range active radar homing missile. It is 3.6cm long, has a diameter of 16cm and weighs 118kg. The warhead weighs 2kg.

What is currently a clear-cut selection of the air-to-air missiles for India’s next fighter aircraft is only likely to change if the platform deal includes a “must-buy” clause for systems.

- See more at: India looks to Israel for new fighter's air-to-air missiles - Ariel View
 
.
Python
python.png

  • Full sphere launch envelope from very short to beyond visual ranges
  • Excellent acquisition and tracking performance
  • Target Lock-On-Before and After Launch capability
  • Excellent resistance to countermeasures
  • Greater probability of kill
http://www.rafael.co.il/marketing/SIP_STORAGE/FILES/1/921.pdf

Derby
ORD_Derby_lg.jpg

  • Active radar seeker
  • Designed for both medium and short range
  • All weather performance
  • Look-down/Shoot-down capability
  • Lock On Before Launch (LOBL) mode for tight dogfights
  • Advanced programmable ECCM
  • Lightweight
  • Fully developed, tested and proven missile
http://www.rafael.co.il/marketing/SIP_STORAGE/FILES/0/950.pdf
 
. . .
If the SD-10A is in the same class as the R-77 then the Derby is lesser in range, 10-20Km difference. They can laugh all they want, but there is quite a difference between a 175Kg bigger missile and a 115Kg missile. Even they know that.

Note that these ranges are stated for cruise speeds in the transonic regime and at 25000-30000 feet. At Mach 1.6-Mach 2.0 and an altitude of 50000 feet can increase range by 50% at least. So, if a Derby and SD-10A is fired from a Su-35 from that altitude and speed, then the missile ranges could very well be 80-90Km for Derby and 110-120Km for SD-10A. The more powerful motors on SD-10A will allow greater speed and acceleration compared to Derby.

During Garuda 2010, both Singapore and India had to cut down the capabilities of the Aim-120 and R-77 in order to match MICA's capability on Rafale and Mirage-2000. Meaning the rules of engagement did not allow IAF and RSAF to utilize the extra capability their BVR missiles gave as compared to ALA's.

For a Rafale and LCA fight, the sensors on the aircraft will make a huge difference. Rafale, like the MKI, has an OLS type system in front of the canopy. This can allow Rafale to engage the LCA with ease. You can say the LCA will be brought down every time with or without the use of Rafale's radar. Currently, according to MKI pilots, the IAF Mig-29s and Mirage-2000s are always shot down before they are even alerted of the MKI's presence during DACT. So, you can say the LCA is nowhere close to engaging the Rafale or MKI without a decent distraction available. For eg: Rafale and MKI can engage the enemy aircraft and help LCA take stealthy shots from safe distances. Col Ternof explains that in the Red Flag 2008 briefing.

Similarly the JF-17, even with AWACS support, has a massive, massive disadvantage against aircraft like MKI and Rafale because of existing capabilities on the aircraft along with missile advantages. F-16 negates this slightly, but with the addition of the RVV-SD/Astra Mk2 and Meteor, even the existing parity is gone.

Coming to the topic at hand. There is really no major advantage or disadvantage if you compare Derby and MICA EM. When we compare Python 5 and MICA IR, Python has a newer seeker while MICA has greater engagement range.

Its a Dual Purpose Missile

SPYDER Surface-to-Air Launcher for PYthon 5 and DERby Missiles, Israel

SPYDER Surface-to-Air Launcher for PYthon 5 and DERby Missiles - Army Technology

Propulsion and aircraft compatibility
Python-5 is powered by a solid propellant rocket engine. The propulsion system provides a speed of Mach 4 and an operational range of more than 20km.

Python-5 can be integrated with wide range of aircraft, including F-5E/F Tiger-II, F-15 Eagle, F-16I Fighting Falcon, Dassault Mirage F-1C, Mirage 5, Mirage 2000, IAI Kfir, Sea Harrier, HAL Tejas and F-35 Lightning II.
 
. .
Out of the two, i see only the python-5 as the definitive upgrade to the r73 . Coming to the derby, I see no reason for it to be preferred over the astra mk1...i believe the derby does the rounds on the navy harriers as of now(50km?)
 
.
Currently, according to MKI pilots, the IAF Mig-29s and Mirage-2000s are always shot down before they are even alerted of the MKI's presence during DACT. So, you can say the LCA is nowhere close to engaging the Rafale or MKI without a decent distraction available. For eg: Rafale and MKI can engage the enemy aircraft and help LCA take stealthy shots from safe distances. Col Ternof explains that in the Red Flag 2008 briefing.

That is a very interesting analysis and it also tells another dimension of capability of newer generation fighters in the region. The fact that MKIs can detect and take first shot increases their lethality and given newer generation missiles being put on them, will make them peerless machines at least in Asia. I would also like to add the effect of IAF AWACS and this will further add to MKIs existing abilities and this will probably negate any sort of advantage that contemporary adversary fighters might have against it. It remains to be seen/analyzed how this setup will function against J-10B and J-20, but as the analysis suggest, the margin of error for pilots facing MKI will be razor thin.
 
. . .
can any member on PDFtell methe range of all currentisraeli made & used air to air missiles .... thanks in advance
 
.
Read somewhere ( in a chat with IAF/Navy Pilots). When someone asked the engagement range of derby whether its 60KM then the pilot laughed and said its more than 60 KM. Of course its less than r-77. also according to him the kill prob is more with Derby than with r-77 ( I mean its more resistant to counter measures).
I'll try to find the source.
 
.
The author is known to write marketing articles for Israeli products, which are interesting but not really true. Neither additional Su 30s, nor MMRCAs will carry Python V let alone Derby. The Russians might insist on upgraded R73 versions that they produce now, unless we can develop an own SR missile (Maitri or Barak SAMs would be the perfect bases for that), while it doesn't offer advantages over MICA IR and Derby has no chance anyway, since Astra is meant to replace Russian missiles, while MMRCAs are meant to get METEOR. Derby is just a stop gap procurement for LCA, Python V maybe too, but that's it. More interesting would be a joint development of the Python V / Derby successor, which could be more interesting for the coming IAF stealth fighter fleet.
 
. . .

Latest posts

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom