India just hanged Kasab

[MilSpec]

It is amusing so many pakistani members bothered at this execution.

 

[KRAIT]

When Bajrang Dal and Modi will get death penalty for involving in riots against Muslims in the 2002 Gujarat violence?

Bajrang Dal
Modi is cleared by courts of all charges and the real person behind the riots are already given sentences. At least some justice is given by Indian courts. May be you should take a leaf out of it so that you can also get rid of terrorists who are killing innocent people in Pakistan.

Terrorism is problem for both the countries. TTP expressed shock over Kasab's death. Same TTP which is killing people in Pakistan. And we understand how much you hate TTP. We also want innocent victims of TTP to get justice as we know what terrorism feels like. Hope we can find common ground here and understand each other's anger towards these terrorist groups.

Buddy, we are on same side of you as far as terrorism is concerned.

Look @Oscar post. This is what we need on both side. Rationality and common concern. IF Indians have hand in Baluchistan, I am with you but I expect same support against LeT too. We need to forget hate and work towards security of common people whom we don't know but are becoming victims on both sides of borders.

 

[SQ8]

Bajrang Dal
Modi is cleared by courts of all charges and the real person behind the riots are already given sentences. At least some justice is given by Indian courts. May e you should take a leaf out of it so that you can also get rid of terrorists qho are killing innocent people in Pakistan.

Terrorism is problem for both the countries. TTP expressed shock over Kasab's death. Same TTp which is killing people in Pakistan. And we understand how much you hate TTP. We also want innocent victims of TTP to get justice as we know what terrorism feels like. Hope we can find common ground here and understand each other's anger towards these terrorist groups.

Buddy, we are on same side of you as far as terrorism is concerned.

Im not exactly sure he is on that same side.
His current posts seem to imply that terrorism is a means to an end.
Its unfortunate isnt it?whole generations brought up on education systems that preach hatred... on both sides as such.

 

[RazPaK]

^

Advocating peace on military forums.

 

[KRAIT]

Im not exactly sure he is on that same side.
His current posts seem to imply that terrorism is a means to an end.
Its unfortunate isnt it?whole generations brought up on education systems that preach hatred... on both sides as such.

Sir, that's why I believe there must be more communication between Indians and Pakistanis so that we can reason together and understand that we are on same page against terrorism. This forum has helped in understanding that there are people on Pakistan's side who thinks just like us, which was not taught to us and we are always given one side of the story.

People on this forum have good opportunity to talk to each other so that they can find more common ground. We should also focus on education and reforms that we have to make in our society towards this hatred. Now since I have joined the forum, I will teach my kids that there are people in Pakistan who are just like you and me. They have same problems and worries. So instead of making prejudices, you make your own decisions by understanding these people.

Don't believe in what media says. Explore yourself. This is the only way to understand that at the end of the day, violence is no solution. For better future we need cooperation and get rid of this habit of indifference. Hope our next generation will be more tolerant, sympathetic and rational and won't make mistakes that we made.

^
Advocating peace on military forums.

A good king is who avoid wars. Any tom d and harry can fight a war, its the intelligent men who avoid wars and settle the disputes without shedding blood. Hope you learned this.

 

[modern_newton]

Bajrang Dal
Modi is cleared by courts of all charges and the real person behind the riots are already given sentences. At least some justice is given by Indian courts. May be you should take a leaf out of it so that you can also get rid of terrorists who are killing innocent people in Pakistan.

Terrorism is problem for both the countries. TTP expressed shock over Kasab's death. Same TTP which is killing people in Pakistan. And we understand how much you hate TTP. We also want innocent victims of TTP to get justice as we know what terrorism feels like. Hope we can find common ground here and understand each other's anger towards these terrorist groups.

Buddy, we are on same side of you as far as terrorism is concerned.

You blame pakistan army/ISI for actions of Ajmal or you dont? Be honest? I am not like those pakistani here who are cursing ajmal at one hand when you guys also telling them it was Pakistan army/ISI behind his back? so why curse ajmal if he was just a tool in hands of those who used him for political gain?

If we look at history you will find out that our leaders/agencies did not have good intentions towards each others and its start from partition to till now. If you do analysis of partitions, all wars in history, creation of Bangladesh, Issue of kashmir conflicts, support for kashmir/balochi /bengali separatist movement to weaken the strength of others, proxy wars etc you will find out that india and pakistan not had good intentions towards each others. I am not talking about Average indian od pakistan who careless about politics conflicts and just think about thinsg in black and white.

Its very difficult to please Indians. You accuse Pakistan to sponsor terrorism but when they take actions against terrorist you say that our government is sold out and killing his own people after taking money from USA. what is that?

 

[modern_newton]

Im not exactly sure he is on that same side.
His current posts seem to imply that terrorism is a means to an end.
.

well i am talking about root cause of terrorism..just cursing on guy is not a solution unless you dont look at motive behind his actions or what he wanted to achieve or what those who used him wanted to gain from all this episode

 

[KRAIT]

You blame pakistan army/ISI for actions of Ajmal or you dont? Be honest? I am not like those pakistani here who are cursing ajmal at one hand when you guys also telling them it was Pakistan army/ISI behind his back? so who curse ajmal if he was just a tool in hands of those who used him for political gain?

If we look at history you will find out that our leaders/agencies did not have good intentions towards each others and its start from partition to till now. If you do analysis of partitions, all wars in history, creation of Bangladesh, Issue of kashmir conflicts, support for kashmir/balochi /bengali separatist movement to weaken the strength of others, proxy wars etc you will find out that india and pakistan not had good intentions towards each others. I am not talking about Average indian od pakistan who careless about politics conflicts and just think about thinsg in black and white.

Its very difficult to please Indians. You accuse Pakistan to sponsor terrorism but when they take actions against terrorist you say that our government is sold out and killing his own people after taking money from USA. what is that?

We accuse each other for every problem we have. We have fought so many wars. Created so many problems for each other. Where did I say India is also dhuudh ka dhula ? If I blame your army and ISI, I also blame Indian leadership that failed to ensure safety of Indian people and I lament Indian army if there are war crimes done by them.

But look at history. What have we got ? Hundreds of thousands of people are died in conflict between our two nations. What is the result ? We are always on aggressive stance and nuclear threshold can be reached with small wars. Is it necessary to continue this hostility and keep fulfilling the designs of other nations who benefits from animosity of our two nations. We are spending billions on weapons, whereas we are struggling to feed our poor, educate them and provide them basic necessities for their survival.

Ask any poor person, what does he want, war or two time meal. You will know the answer. These discussions of war, who is at fault, you did this, you did that is for people like you and me who have internet connection, that means we don't have to worry for how would we get food for tomorrow. People who are living in US and metropolitan cities, in air conditioned rooms don't know what it feels like to live in 45 degree centrigrade, working hard on a farm and traveling 5 kms daily just for education with 2 suukhi rotis in the bag.

Buddy, go to ground level and you will see, the problems both countries have with each other is miniscule compared to problems these people at ground level face.

 

[SQ8]

well i am talking about root cause of terrorism..just cursing on guy is not a solution unless you dont look at motive behind his actions or what he wanted to achieve or what those who used him wanted to gain from all this episode

That makes sense, but unless you acknowledge that you encouraged terrorism based on that root cause... it wont help to fix it.

Sir, that's why I believe there must be more communication between Indians and Pakistanis so that we can reason together and understand that we are on same page against terrorism. This forum has helped in understanding that there are people on Pakistan's side who thinks just like us, which was not taught to us and we are always given one side of the story.

People on this forum have good opportunity to talk to each other so that they can find more common ground. We should also focus on education and reforms that we have to make in our society towards this hatred. Now since I have joined the forum, I will teach my kids that there are people in Pakistan who are just like you and me. They have same problems and worries. So instead of making prejudices, you make your own decisions by understanding these people.

Don't believe in what media says. Explore yourself. This is the only way to understand that at the end of the day, violence is no solution. For better future we need cooperation and get rid of this habit of indifference. Hope our next generation will be more tolerant, sympathetic and rational and won't make mistakes that we made.

A good king is who avoid wars. Any tom d and harry can fight a war, its the intelligent men who avoid wars and settle the disputes without shedding blood. Hope you learned this.

I interact with Indians everyday, study with them, eat with them, party with them, laugh with them and feel sad with em.
Honestly.. out of the 100 or so in my fb list.. about 17 actually said anything about Kasab.. and only one pointed out Pakistan.

That tells a lot about ground realities. Which is that all we do really are about.. is "roti , Kapra and Makaan"..

 

[KRAIT]

That makes sense, but unless you acknowledge that you encouraged terrorism based on that root cause... it wont help to fix it.
I interact with Indians everyday, study with them, eat with them, party with them, laugh with them and feel sad with em.
Honestly.. out of the 100 or so in my fb list.. about 17 actually said anything about Kasab.. and only one pointed out Pakistan.
That tells a lot about ground realities. Which is that all we do really are about.. is "roti , Kapra and Makaan"..

Agreed Sir. This is reality of life. I wish people get to live one week or month of survival at ground level. It clears many things and gives a person better perspective.

 

[modern_newton]

But Pakistan's establishment did train the LET, provided them with weapons and taught them how to fight and recruit.
Did they do it for the Mumbai incident? No I dont think so, the LET was let go after the 2001/2 standoff..to appease the US.
Ties were "kept".. but no control.. .and even the ties there were kept are more for one way information.

Why do you think a terrorist like Hafiz Saeed roams free? Is it because there is no proof against him?
or is because that if caught and tried.. he will expose many of the current and past senior PA command as accomplices in helping the LET at one point or another.. and even if they did not kill Indians..many of these very men ended up joining the ranks of the TTP and killing our own soldiers.. and hence they were accomplice to murder of Pakistani citizens.

The Kashmiris are fighting their freedom struggle in which they are absolutely given the right to shoot and kill their occupiers..
but when they cross that line and kill innocent civilians.. then they become terrorists.
Do they have an option? does it help their cause?
Its a lengthy debate..

Now, why are we certain that the Pakistani Army leadership always works in Pakistan's best interest.
They have led us to massive mistakes and almost commited Hara Kiri for Pakistan..
Which is why I return to my question of asking whether you had relatives in the military.. (although I do too.. a lot)..you are of the opinion that the Pakistani establishment is a "see no evil, hear no evil, do no evil" .. or as we say.. "doodh se dhulay howay"..
That is only for those blinded by jingoism(and goes for Indians too who claims that there have been no injustices against the Kashmiri people)... Our Army has engaged in heinous acts in 71..and some in Balochistan.. on the orders of their leadership.
Does it mean that I now hate my soldier who sits in the murderous cold of Siachen? NO..
Does it mean I hate the officer who sits without his family in Waziristan on eid? NO..
Our Army has also accomplished many more feats than mistakes.. and given sacrifices that are in many cases unmatched for these times.. They are our lions(even if they were led by lambs/weasels/jackals at times)
We cannot be narrow visioned or minded .. As citizens of this country it is our responsibility to each other to point out mistakes in the current.. that stem from the past..so that we make less in the future.

I agree with some points that people in leadership/Army can make errors/mistakes and its true for India as well . Indian leadership also made many mistakes during partitions because of which many conflicts were created between two nations which made the seed of hatred grew

According to you how many wars Pakistani Army/leadership fought for wrong reasons? wars in 1947, 1965, 1971, 1999? If all these wars were fought for wrong reasons then what you will say about those Pakistani soldiers who sacrificed their lives in these wars? did they gave their lives for nothing because of mistakes of leadership? Again you do see any role of india/indian agencies in destabilizing Pakistan?

You think a country should protect its national interests even if it cost the lives of people belong to your enemy or neighbour countries. This question is also for Indians and let see what they or their intelligence would say . I guess answer of raw and ISI will be yes protect your national interests at any cost

 

[A1Kaid]

You confused India with Pakistan. It's your countrymen's lives that nobody gives a $hit for, as evidenced by foreigners bombing you day in and day out over meat and drinks. How much do you think the NATO drone operators in Virginia care for your people's lives? Heck, how much does your own govt care? Who ever cared or apologized when your soldiers were chopped up by foreign helos? Nothing like that ever happens to Indians. So don't talk about who's lives are more valuable in the international community's eyes. Sorry, but there is no contest there. If you want international reactions to the Mumbai massacre, just google it. In the USA even the domestic news channels covered it 24/7. Now when Pakistanis get killed in the customary explosions or gunmen attacks that happen every week or so, nobody finds it newsworthy. They prefer to watch Madonna's latest tour instead.

It's your countrymen's lives that nobody gives a $hit for, as evidenced by foreigners bombing you day in and day out over meat and drinks. How much do you think the NATO drone operators in Virginia care for your people's lives? Heck, how much does your own govt care?

Last time I checked whenever a natural disaster occurred in Pakistan many countries around the world donated generously to Pakistan to save Pakistani lives. Most nations could careless about Indian mud people in the billions if a tsunami strikes or what have you. They don't care if you drown. In Pakistan's case, nations send food, aid, money, medical staff, transport helos, personnel etc to help Pakistanis recover.

If you want international reactions to the Mumbai massacre, just google it.

I did and most people around the world could careless and in fact people commented that it was funny seeing ***-heads being killed.

Now when Pakistanis get killed in the customary explosions or gunmen attacks that happen every week or so, nobody finds it newsworthy. They prefer to watch Madonna's latest tour instead.

You must not be watching American news networks then, because over here drone strikes receive coverage and the lives of the victims receive extensive coverage, this is why there are political organizations standing against drone strikes in the US. So don't lie to people on the forum and your fellow Indian members here just to make them feel better inside. Truth is Indian mud people in the billions life mean nothing to the international community. You talk about drone strikes on militants in tribal regions, the same country US was ready to nuke your country back in 1971, you were going to be second to Japan has that happened.

 

[Developereo]

Joint investigation? That's sick, considering that all evidence pointed to the LeT, an organisation that enjoys the support of the stae of Pakistan. In any case, we have found exactly what Pakistan does with an investigation, a joint investigation would have been a joke.

It's called state support for a terrorist. You believe your version, if that helps you sleep better at night.

You perfectly illustrate the extent of brainwashing by GoI. The GoI logic is as follows:
- GoP is responsible for the terrorism
- Any investigation with GoP is a waste of time
- because GoP is responsible for the terrorism

The GoI stonewalled any reasonable progress on the investigations because it was more interested in grandstanding and point scoring than in an honest investigation.

Whisk away? India went through an extradition process of over a year to get this chap. Pakistan tried desperately to prevent it but promptly changed his tack & labelled him an Indian the moment their request was rejected by the KSA. As for committing crimes holding a Pakistani passport, that would sound reasonable except that Pakistan didn't claim that he had committed any crimes. Nice try. Pretty clear from what extent the Pakistani state went that India was right in it's suspicion of Pakistani state involvement in the attacks & damns any idiotic talk of joint investigation.

Saudi Arabia claimed he was recruiting for terrorism while holding a Pakistani passport. That made him an object of interrogation by Pakistan. India called up the Americans to have him whisked away to India instead, denying Pakistan the opportunity to investigate him.

I would then end up having to label all your speech here just an act of terrorism support. In the end it simply boils down to that. Your excuses for the Abu Jundal affair, ones that the Pakistani authorities didn't even make, make it pretty much clear that there is no reasonable standard that you set yourself to. You will support a terrorist act & support every excuse that can be offered however ridiculous they are. Sad but true.

Where exactly did I support any act of terrorism?

Once again, it is an indication of the Indian brainwashing that defending due process, and not kowtowing to Indian demands, is viewed as support for terrorism.

 

[dravidianhero]

self delete

 

[A1Kaid]

that is not reality.u go to any nook and corner of india they cant talk abt terrorists without mentioning pakistan .more than half the population of india accuses indian muslims as traitors and supporters of pakistan and terrorism.This is the ground reality in india mate.

Of course many Indians Muslims are sympathetic to Pakistan, especially the ones living in the Deccan and cities like Hyderabad, pro-Pakistan areas.