India eyes stealth fighter plane

[shree835]

Are...are you joking? Do you know the history of the JF-17's development? If you did, you wouldn't have made such an obviously dumb comment.



But the problem with your example is that the Kaveri engine isn't going to be used in Tejas. It was meant too, but because it hasn't, your example falls apart.

It looks like you did not understand what @ni8mare wanted to say....He explained you a plain and simple thing.

 

[That Guy]

my post is not offence for you mate.

I disagree, as a Pakistani, I'm the one on the receiving end, not you.

It looks like you did not understand what @ni8mare wanted to say....He explained you a plain and simple thing.

No, I understand. He's saying further R&D on Kaveri would push the Tejas further as an indigenous fighter, and would prove that India has experience with building a next gen, but the fact that Kaveri hasn't produced the results India was looking for ruins his example completely, and proves to me that India still isn't ready to take on a massive project such as a 5th gen.

 

[shree835]

I disagree, as a Pakistani, I'm the one on the receiving end, not you.


No, I understand. He's saying further R&D on Kaveri would push the Tejas further as an indigenous fighter, and would prove that India has experience with building a next gen, but the fact that Kaveri hasn't produced the results India was looking for ruins his example completely, and proves to me that India still isn't ready to take on a massive project such as a 5th gen.

ok...np...As you said "Kaveri hasn't produced the results India was looking for " ...So what next is required to achieve it...??

 

[That Guy]

ok...np...As you said "Kaveri hasn't produced the results India was looking for " ...So what next is required to achieve it...??

A lot, but India doesn't have the means to carry on with it. If it did, we'd see the engine in the Tejas fighter.

--

Okay gents. It's 3:00AM, so I'm off.

I shan't be reading anymore replies from this thread tomorrow, so you might as well save your time. Why? Because the thread will probably be irrelevant by the end of the week.

 

[GURU DUTT]

Sometimes, it's not worth trying. When costs overrun the benefits, it should be cast aside. The US has learned this lesson harshly, but it's too late for them with the F-35.


I know, which is why I used it as an example to further my point, the other guy was the one to derail the thread, not me.

no sir there is no thing in this world which in not worth giving a try or no cost too high to be self reliant and free yes we are not a rich nation and have many other priorities but we cant ignoar the clear and present danger against us in owr immideate naighbour hood

there are always rewards for those who try and try again till they suceed

"girte hain sawar maidan E jang me ... wo tifl kya girenge jo ghutno ke bal chalte hain "

 

[That Guy]

no sir there is no thing in this world which in not worth giving a try or no cost too high to be self reliant and free yes we are not a rich nation and have many other priorities but we cant ignoar the clear and present danger against us in owr immideate naighbour hood

there are always rewards for those who try and try again till they suceed

"girte hain sawar maidan E jang me ... wo tifl kya girenge jo ghutno ke bal chalte hain "

Idealistic view, not realistic.

But anyways, like I said, I'm off. Goodnight.

 

[GURU DUTT]

Idealistic view, not realistic.

But anyways, like I said, I'm off. Goodnight.

well you have to work hard relentlesslly to get your goal just dreaming and making conspiracy theories and waiting for a messiah or sympathy of friends is a recepie for disaster

 

[shree835]

A lot, but India doesn't have the means to carry on with it. If it did, we'd see the engine in the Tejas fighter.

--

Okay gents. It's 3:00AM, so I'm off.

I shan't be reading anymore replies from this thread tomorrow, so you might as well save your time. Why? Because the thread will probably be irrelevant by the end of the week.

Indian reached to 82KN and target is 90KN... And how can you say that "India doesn't have the means to carry on with it"... To make you understand If Indian can achieve 82KN then we can achieve 90KN too...This is just a matter of time...FYI... Here R&D comes into the picture...

 

[nik22]

I get your point, I got it in the beginning, I just don't agree with it. Still, it's up to India if it wants to do so, talking about it on a forum won't change it's mind.

If India wants to go for it, by all means, but the idea that it'll be a true indigenous fighter like the IAF envisions will be a pipedream, just like the Tejas.

I think ADA designers don't have anything to do now. They don't want to sit idle. Still it is at design phase, starting implementation is a different thing altogether.

 

[h0mer]

No, true indigenous does mean 100% indigenous. Right now, Tejas can only technically be called indigenous because it was developed in India and has 60% Indian parts.

Kind of like the JF-17, which is also technically indigenous, but isn't truly indigenous.

"technically indigenous" ? You can't even build a car engine. It's not Indigenous in any way shape or form, all you do is give the Chinese money and buy the knock-down kits to assemble. Even the Sudanese could do this given a couple months.

India has the infrastructure to design/develop jets (even the engines and radar although they are a few years away). Pakistan on the other hand is not even close.

 

[SrNair]

No, true indigenous does mean 100% indigenous. Right now, Tejas can only technically be called indigenous because it was developed in India and has 60% Indian parts.

Kind of like the JF-17, which is also technically indigenous, but isn't truly indigenous.

Indigenous dont mean make system of 100% with huge loss.Profit always a priority.Whole system cant source from locally.Even US dont do that.

Pakistan is stuck right now. If India was in the exact same position, it would do the same as Pakistan. Don't think your politicians are any less corrupt than ours.

But our Politicians will not allow others here.you know very well about diplomtic row.Your news of corruption in India is partly exaggration of our sensational media.We dont live in paranoia of China or any other countries.

 

[Lil Mathew]

No, true indigenous does mean 100% indigenous. Right now, Tejas can only technically be called indigenous because it was developed in India and has 60% Indian parts.

Kind of like the JF-17, which is also technically indigenous, but isn't truly indigenous.

LCA Tejas is a true indegenous fighter with foreign commercially off the shelf components ya systems(say 40% contents by volume ya 90% foreign components).. Same time MKI is a foreign fighter with 100% indegenous components..
For example I buy required paper, pencil, colours from a shop and draw an art.. Ultimately that is my art.. That is LCA.. Otherway I produce paper,pencil and everything but photocopied an existing art with a xerox machine.. That is not my art.. That is MKI..
Through AMCA we are aiming to develop many cutting edge state of art techs including stealth capabilities.. We can also use the experience from MKI, lca,rafael,fgfa etc.etc.. Our R&D organisations already recognised the required techs and are very confident of developing that..
What makes you think we are not capable??
We got LCA now.. Why?? Becos we started it 30 years before.. That is better start early as possible.. We waiting till next decade to compleate fgfa and then copying it makes no sense.. Na??

 

[Sergi]

AMCA .... Hoping we avoid the mistakes we made in LCA programme.
- Build a jet around proven engines.
- Find partners & do JV for Subsystems we don't have.
- make a Naval jet then derive AF version.
- Include production agency in the design and development phase.
- Include the user in the design and development phase.
- make the project manage accountable. And he should be a real manager than a scientist. Let the scientist do what he is best at.
- Zip all the mouths in media. Deliver and then talk. We don't need to know what you can do. Show us what you have done.


Then we are good

 

[$@rJen]

Being smart and not rushing forward with developing a multi-billion dollar 5th gen fighter that would most likely require foreign parts, which would defeat the purpose of it being an "indigenous fighter". You know...that.

India shouldn't do this yet. Wait a while, gain some experience with the FGFA and the go ahead after that. Trust me when I say that India would be better of just finishing the Tejas and developing it further before attempting this massive project.


It's not about jealousy, nor is it about Pakistan's capabilities. No one on PDF would ever claim that Pakistan is capable of developing a 5th, atleast not without massive help from nations such as China or Turkey.

This is about India, is it ready for such a massive undertaking? Does it have the experience needed to develop a 5th gen with purely domestic parts? I can tell you that it is a no on both accounts. Getting the parts from foreign nations and assembling them is easy, anyone can do it, but India is trying to go for 100% indigenous 5th gen fighter, which it can't do. The Tejas is a perfect example of this.

I've said this many times, gain experience through the FGFA before attempting this.

K, Except Russia and US can u point out me a single country who makes a fighter plane 100% with its indigenous parts... not even China can do that. Every country like to boast about themselves, India is no Angel.. and about the stealth, no one is going to give their tech but help yes!! so Ya India is trying to develop on it's own with Russian Help.

 

[HariPrasad]

I propose a medium class fighter of empty weight of 8.5 tons with a single engine of based on Russian PAK FA engine. It should have 4000 KM of range (Without external fuel), it should be stealth, It should carry over 6.5 tons of Payload. It sholud have internal weapon bay and external hand points.