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India expanding submarine force to meet China threat

DrSomnath999

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The government of India has approved $10 billion in funding to vastly expand and improve the Indian Navy’s undersea warfare capabilities. Shipbuilders in France, Germany, Russia and Spain are this week lining up bids on the new Indian Navy project which comes less than a year after $18 billion was funded to equip the Indian Air Force with new Rafale fighter aircraft.

The new project includes next generation diesel-electric attack submarines to augment the current fleet which consists of 10 Kilo Class of Russian design; four modified German Type 209 Class and two nuclear powered Akula Class attack submarines leased from Russia. An additional six Scorpene Class diesel-electric submarines of French & Spanish joint design are being built at India’s Mazagon Dock Ltd. shipyards.

Though the total number of new submarines has not been decided, the newer subs will be larger than the six Scorpenes currently building and would include both land attack missile capability and air-independent propulsion (AIP) systems; developed by Swedish naval engineers allowing a diesel-electric submarine to run their ‘air breathing’ engines at low power in conjunction with batteries while submerged for three or more weeks almost as stealthily as a nuclear submarine.

Defense analyst and international security experts alike often ponder confusedly as to why India feels the need for a powerful ‘blue water’ navy in a region with no serious naval power present aside from the United States with whom India has had more or less friendly relations since the end of British rule in 1947; the answer of course being China.

India and China have had tensions off and on since Communist China’s victory over the Nationalist Chinese in 1949. The two nations finally came to blows in a brief border war in 1962. China is a long time supporter of India’s arch nemesis Pakistan. Until recently however, there was no serious naval threat posed to India by China’s minor coastal naval force; separated by the whole of Southeast Asia from the Indian Ocean.

However in tandem with Chinese naval expansion was an expansion of inroads in the Indian Ocean region with purchases of local sea port facilities and airports or investment in joint ventures to expand such facilities or build new ones in partnerships with Burma, Thailand, Seychelles and Pakistan. Projects particularly troublesome to India since all Chinese companies are owned in some fashion by the Chinese government despite the widely held belief in Chinese ‘privatization’.

The sea ports and air ports would provide China bases from which to operate naval aircraft and vessels against Indian seaborne commerce and naval forces on a much shorter logistical leash than if they tethered to bases in China. Of particular concern is China’s fleet of 50 diesel electric submarines which could easily operate out of friendly ports in the Indian Ocean.

India clearly recognizing the problem is now embarking on the best solution $10 Billion can buy. India is also expanding its surface battle fleet with purchases of the former Soviet aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov (renamed Vikramaditya) and the Russian designed Talwar Class stealth frigates for air defense and anti-submarine warfare. India has also begun domestic construction of two 65,000 ton aircraft carriers. There have however been delays and disputes with the Russians over quality and workmanship on the frigates and the rebuilt Gorshkov.
http://www.examiner.com/article/india-expanding-submarine-force-to-meet-china-threat
 
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China already has 12 kilo class subs,so that pretty much is enough for India's existing fleet.
Next year china will start inducting Qing class subs,with enough room for ballistic missiles.
Indian suba dont have capability of carrying ballistic missiles and it doesnt look like new one will have the ability.

So why give a misguiding title to the article.
These subs and newer subs are way behind what china has,and no chance for india for counteracting chinese under sea presence.
 
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China already has 12 kilo class subs,so that pretty much is enough for India's existing fleet.
Next year china will start inducting Qing class subs,with enough room for ballistic missiles.
Indian suba dont have capability of carrying ballistic missiles and it doesnt look like new one will have the ability.

So why give a misguiding title to the article.
These subs and newer subs are way behind what china has,and no chance for india for counteracting chinese under sea presence.

We currently have 10 Kilos, 4 Type-209s and 1 Akula-II (on lease).

Can Qing carry BMs? Thats news to me.

We are building 3 Arihant SSBNs, 6 (perhaps 3-4 more) Scorpene SSKs and soon to open tenders for 6 new-generation SSKs. Work on building 3-4 "S-5"-class SSBNs has already begun. Plus leasing of a 2nd Akula SSN is on the cards, and its also likely India will acquire the designs of the Barracuda SSN to build atleast 9 such SSNs in India.

K-15 SLBM (750km) already in series production, would be tested from Arihant in a couple of months.
K-4 SLBM (3500km) in development
K-5/5 SLBM (5000-6500km) in preliminary stages
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Nirbhay SLCM (1200km) confirmed in development
Sub-based version of supersonic LRCM (600km) also under works.

For anti-submarine warfare, IN is inducting the P-8I "Neptune", the No.1 ASW aircraft around.

So tell me, how do you think India cannot counter chinese UW warfare capabilities? Besides, IN subs have never went into SCS/ECS and PLAN subs never came into IOR either. I think there is some mutual agreement between the two navies not to project undersea warfare capabilities in each other's backyard. This could change but India is well prepared for these types of future situations.

Cant compete with Qing class....

What cant? P-75I? In what respect?
 
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India needs to start incorporating and supporting the fighting arts. All fighting arts in India and abroad in Thailand, Sri Lanka, malayasia, etc need to be brought together and made into one grat fighting art incorporating the best of all. Then this should be taught to all girls and boys from a young age to college. This will help teach no only self defence, but physical and mental conditioning. The biggest issue is that our ppl don;t have a martial state of mind yet till the 18 century, every man was trained in the arts including dalits. This has to be revived and it will help the arts. What we are forgetting is that in ancient times, our ancestors would form groups and make advancements thru rigorous study. This was supported by great Kings and rich businessman. Our ppl need to start reviving this again. Support the old masters, give them a reason to live and flourish once again.
 
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Ya... Read 4#
and FYI... our killo class is around two decades old and we're going to replace them may be some would be upgraded and wold be kept till 2025... but most of their subs are very older than us but still they keep in service to show the strength,(Big weakness)
Theirs only good part is the N-subs which are much noisy than Akula class and our home mad Arihant I believe......
 
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There is no comparison between chinese and indian subs.
China already has a xia class boomer with 12 SLBM.
India has none.
 
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There is no comparison between chinese and indian subs.
China already has a xia class boomer with 12 SLBM.
India has none.

I don't know when u r going to grow up Mr.Jr Troll Tank...:)

Did u even read the article?:what:
We aren't at war with China that ur bring in SLBMs now n then or do u think that China would be floating its entire sub flotilla in IOR leaving SCS open for Vietnam, Philippines n US...:lol:

Can u explain since when Qing Class started to carry SLBMs???

At max there might be some minor confrontations at SCS or IOR between a few naval ships n r u expecting them to fire BM at each other....:rofl:

Where does the article said that India has currently any upper hand over China in Sub stand off but rather its talks about countering China's Sub fleet...:hitwall:

Besides just for ur info India's Nuke Sub capable of carrying SLBM is already facing sea trails while 2 others r already underconstruction n in total 4 Arihant types r planned to be inducted which will be armed with K-15(750km) n K-4(3500km).

As for nuke attack subs we have already inducted(leased) Akula II n plans for one more are already underway with the Russians besides India plans for India's indigenous nuke attack sub r also in pipeline...:D

So plz stop ur mental masturbation n smell the coffee...:)
 
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We currently have 10 Kilos, 4 Type-209s and 1 Akula-II (on lease).
We currently have 12 Kilos, 19 Type-035s ,16 Type-039s ,5 Type-039As,5 Type-039Bs , 3 Type-091s ,1 Type-092,4 Type-093s and 5 Type-094s .
at least 1 Qing class.

Can Qing carry BMs? Thats news to me.
Yes,like Golf Class called SSG

We are building 3 Arihant SSBNs, 6 (perhaps 3-4 more) Scorpene SSKs and soon to open tenders for 6 new-generation SSKs. Work on building 3-4 "S-5"-class SSBNs has already begun. Plus leasing of a 2nd Akula SSN is on the cards, and its also likely India will acquire the designs of the Barracuda SSN to build atleast 9 such SSNs in India.
We never say 'will' and 'future' but do it.
We are building 3 Type 095s SSNs,more to planned.Work on building Type 096 SSBNs and Type 097 SSNs has already begun.

K-15 SLBM (750km) already in series production, would be tested from Arihant in a couple of months.
K-4 SLBM (3500km) in development
K-5/5 SLBM (5000-6500km) in preliminary stages
-
Nirbhay SLCM (1200km) confirmed in development
Sub-based version of supersonic LRCM (600km) also under works.
JL1 SLBM (1700km) was deployed on Type 092 in 1986.
JL1A SLBM (2500km) now in service onType 092
JL-2 SLBM (8000km) now in service onType 094
JL-2A SLBM (12000km)
JL-2B SLBM (14000km)
JL3 SLBM (18000-20000km) for Type 096

CJ-10 SLCM (1500km~2500km) for Type 095


For anti-submarine warfare, IN is inducting the P-8I "Neptune", the No.1 ASW aircraft around.

So tell me, how do you think India cannot counter chinese UW warfare capabilities? Besides, IN subs have never went into SCS/ECS and PLAN subs never came into IOR either. I think there is some mutual agreement between the two navies not to project undersea warfare capabilities in each other's backyard. This could change but India is well prepared for these types of future situations.

Chines submarine can face up to janpanese 100 P-3Cs ,what you think about 8 P-8Is

So tell me, how do you think India can counter chinese capabilities?
 
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I'm not seeing any threat PLAN pose to India. China is not interested in kick Indian navy in IOR. better keep each other at bay.
 
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