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India China war in October again?

That's completely false. I have read previous posts of yours. It seem that you are rather inclined to criticize India and praise her neighbors, in spite of the fact that India's neighbors have far worse problems and have also made far worse mistakes in terms of both internal and foreign policy.

Perhaps a little less naked agenda-pushing, and a little more honesty would be good.

I have been very honest with my opinions on this forum, but I am realizing that everybody here says what is convenient and self-congratulatory rather than what is true.

I think it is time that I too adjust to the atmosphere. Infact, I now feel embarrassed for so openly admitting the weaknesses and failings of my own homeland.

Friend, we come to here to exchange information and knowledge.

Conclusion is drawn from facts that your home media may not want you to know. People can blow anything out from a mouth, so we have to consider facts not just propagandas.

True that I am critique of India foreign policy, which is also based on facts. A simple fact: why can your enemy or your potential enemy in your north solve land dispute with 13 of its 14 neighbors except India, but India manages to resolve none with its neighbors?

Tell me is that India’s problem or Indian neighbor’s problem?

Does the answer need a PhD degree to get?

China has several massive internal problems also, and I think it wouldn't require much effort to highlight them on this forum. However, I admire the current Chinese leadership for their patriotism and their confidence in their own thinking rather than relying on what the west tells them. But this arrogance has been China's downfall in the past. The time of Chairman Mao for example was a disastrous period for China, and many of his policies were downright idiotic, even retarded I might say.

China has a lot of its own internal problems, no question about that. But that doesn’t negate the fact that it has done relatively good in its foreign relationship than India. Does it? And why?

Please don’t tell us China is going to collapse in X years. China would have been collapsed long time ago. :lol:
 
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The article jana posted from Nepal show our Indian forum members to be in a kind of fantasy - why does India not have good relations with any of it's immediate neighbors -- the article from Nepal refers to India as "self proclaimed "big brother" to Nepal, it points out that India is hostile to her neighbors in the North , the south and the east and the West -- yet our Indian friends continue to respond to us with hostility - why Indian friends, why?
 
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Such a long thread i dint read all posts.

But why Indo-China war in Indian ocean ? It should be Indo-US-China war
 
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The article jana posted from Nepal show our Indian forum members to be in a kind of fantasy - why does India not have good relations with any of it's immediate neighbors -- the article from Nepal refers to India as "self proclaimed "big brother" to Nepal, it points out that India is hostile to her neighbors in the North , the south and the east and the West -- yet our Indian friends continue to respond to us with hostility - why Indian friends, why?

According to psychology when someone is suffering from some self-superiority complex sans any actual one, it is result of some hidden inferiority complex. So the patient has to show the former in a bid to cover up his weaknesess
 
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The article jana posted from Nepal show our Indian forum members to be in a kind of fantasy - why does India not have good relations with any of it's immediate neighbors -- the article from Nepal refers to India as "self proclaimed "big brother" to Nepal, it points out that India is hostile to her neighbors in the North , the south and the east and the West -- yet our Indian friends continue to respond to us with hostility - why Indian friends, why?

Muse,

I think as a senior member and think tank ,u display an sound independent mind.

Any way,let me tell u,Telegraph nepal works more or less as a mouthpiece for rebel moist groups present inside Nepal and can compete with Rupee News in its anti-indian vitriolic
 
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Muse,

I think as a senior member and think tank ,u display an sound independent mind.

Any way,let me tell u,Telegraph nepal works more or less as a mouthpiece for rebel moist groups present inside Nepal and can compete with Rupee News in its anti-indian vitriolic

Khajur do you see anything wrong with advice like the bellow? It is very much sane and ubiase advice no matter even if coming from a source which you called biased.

"Rather than concentrating on further irritating smaller neighbors like Nepal, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh, India should learn on how to “behave” with sovereign nation’s in the neighborhood."
 
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No,there will be no India China war in October or ever unless china goes berserk .

why?

The answer lies in the chinese experince of 1987 Sino-Indian skirmish where it met an formidable opponent in India who had learnt her lessons in 62 war.

1987 Sino-Indian skirmish


The 1987 Sino-Indian skirmish occurred at Sumdorong Chu Valley. This was the second conflict between the PRC and India, with the previous one taking place exactly a quarter of a century earlier.

Events leading up the near war
After her return to power in 1980 as Prime Minister of India, Indira Gandhi ordered a general review of India's security plans. In 1982-83, she approved a plan submitted by the Chief of the Army Staff, General K.V. Krishna Rao, to upgrade the sporadic deployment of forces along the Line of Actual Control with the People's Republic of China.

Since the late 1960s, India had developed an elaborate plan to defend the Himalayan frontier with China. This involved the provision of screening defences at the Line of Actual Control and the building of strong defence nodes at key points along the frontier. By the early 1980s, while the forces to man the defences were ready, the nodes were not, and the greatest weakness was in the fact that the servicing road network had not been built. The decision was taken to resume the defence infrastructure construction.

Since 1962, India had not returned to the site of its major defeat-- the Namka Chu an east-west running stream which separates the Thag La and the Hathung La ridge to its south. India's efforts to occupy Thag La was the cassus belli for the October 1962 Chinese military attack on India. Because there were no other feasible defensive locations north of Tawang, the government had more or less decided that in the event of a new war, they would abandon the town and prepare for battle at the Se La pass to its east. However, after the 1980 review, it was decided by the military strategists that it was important to defend Tawang in a future conflict.[1] The army made it clear that the only viable line of defence for Tawang would be along the Hathung La ridge. In 1983, an Intelligence Bureau team went to the pasturage of Sumdorong Chu which is north-east of the confluence of the Namka Chu and Nyamjiang Chu. The defence forces stayed through the summer and returned in winter. This procedure was followed for two years. In 1986, Indian forces found that the Chinese had preceded them and set up semi-permanent structures there.

In Feb 1986 the army nominated a new chief, General K. Sundarji, who was determined to press the decisions taken by General Krishna Rao. In addition, Sundarji sought government permission to conduct an exercise named Operation Chequerboard to see how quickly troops based in the Assam plains could take up their positions on the Sino-Indian border. As part of the exercise, towards the end of the year, the army landed a brigade of troops at Zimithaung, south of Hathung La using its new heavy lift Mi-26 helicopters. These forces occupied the Hathung La, across the Namka Chu from Thag La. All this alarmed the Chinese forces in the region; they responded with alacrity and moved up their forces to take up positions all along the LAC. At points near this area-- Sulu La, Bum La, etc. the troops were now face to face with their Indian counterparts. This caused concerns of Sino-Indian clashes. However, the forces did not engage in combat.


Possibility of war
At the end of 1986, India granted statehood to Arunachal Pradesh, which is an area claimed by China but administered by India. The Chinese government proceeded to protest. But the military movements in Tawang, taken in conjunction with this political action were seen as a provocation by the Chinese. In early 1987 Beijing's tone became similar to that of 1962, and with the Indian Army refusing to stand down, Western diplomats predicted war.

The Indian response to the Chinese buildup was Operation Falcon and involved movements across the Sino-Indian border. Among the more interesting deployments, using Mi-26 heavy lift helicopters, was that of Infantry Combat Vehicles (ICVs)and some armour in North Sikkim in the east and Demchok in the west. These two were viewed as particularly threatening by the PLA because they seemed to indicate that India had moved from a strategy of defence in its own territory to that of a larger offensive involving all of Arunachal Pradesh.

The result was a thaw. Indian Foreign Minister N.D. Tiwari arrived in Beijing in May 1987 en route to Pyongyang, North Korea. He carried with him messages from Indian leaders that there was no intention on New Delhi's part to aggravate the situation. The first formal flag meeting to discuss “ the freezing of the situation” since 1962, was held on the fifth of August 1987 at Bum La in the aftermath of the Wangdung affair. Both sides decided to take up talks with renewed urgency and the following year, Rajiv Gandhi visited Beijing, returning Zhou Enlai's '60s visit.[2]


Aftermath
Both India and China realised the danger of inadvertent conflict and after initial posturing the decision was made to de-escalate their deployments. The Sumdorong Chu fallout was that India and China decided to restart their dialogue on a new and more urgent basis. After Rajiv Gandhi's September 1988 visit, there was a hiatus of sorts because of political turmoil in India. But finally in 1993, the two countries signed an agreement to ensure peace along the LAC.

The agreement brought in an interesting concept of "mutual and equal" security where thinning of forces was envisaged, based on geographical and logistical considerations. However, its most important element is to have the two sides work out a mutually acceptable Line of Actual Control. As of now the two sides have their own versions of the Line and there are points, especially in the Sikkim-Bhutan-India trijunction, the Sumdorong Chu area and so on where the claims are disputed.

1987 Sino-Indian skirmish - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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Khajur do you see anything wrong with advice like the bellow? It is very much sane and ubiase advice no matter even if coming from a source which you called biased.

"Rather than concentrating on further irritating smaller neighbors like Nepal, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh, India should learn on how to “behave” with sovereign nation’s in the neighborhood."


Its not about views ,but the intention behind that views and the view maker get more attention.

The buttom line is Telegraph nepal is moist and anti india , always find some excues to potray india as an evil state, out to harm its peaceful neighbours.
 
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khajur

Generally speaking, India do not have good relations with their immediate neighbors - what ever answer India's neighbors have for this peculiar turn of events, Indians, I find generally, are very comfortable with ascribing motivations to their neighbors that, to me, seem dangerous to India. In other words, Indian society lacks the capacity to exaime it's attitude and behaviours in such a manner that it can effect itself, asa result of that critical reflection.
 
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You make it seem like the Chinese gave up their territorial rights to appease a smaller neighbor to resolve a dispute.....

Lets be clear on one thing....Peaceful resolution by the Chinese is more like "An offer you cant refuse".....so peaceful bullying is how China has resolved its disputes....

Also what peaceful means are you referring to?? Does Tibet ring a bell??....Annexing a piece of land based on military might without firing a bullet because the people you subdue are monks with no arms does NOT count as peaceful resolution.....

Stop glorifying the Chinese......Just like India they have their ambitions too....and trust me the Chinese are a lot more stubborn and heavy handed than us mild-mannered desis!!!

Besides the only reason why we have a dispute with China is because we can stand up to them....Its very easy for a small nation to settle dispute with China when they know that the Chinese have the capability to engulf them!!!
You Pakistani's might be scared and enamoured by China....for India its like a mirror image.....there is more similarities between India and China than you can imagine!!!

You nailed it bro.

Just wait for some more time. China will do a Pol Pot on Pakistan. The way Pakistanis did a Pol Pot on BD. And BD was doing a Pol Pot on ethnic Chakmas.
 
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khajur

Generally speaking, India do not have good relations with their immediate neighbors - what ever answer India's neighbors have for this peculiar turn of events, Indians, I find generally, are very comfortable with ascribing motivations to their neighbors that, to me, seem dangerous to India. In other words, Indian society lacks the capacity to exaime it's attitude and behaviours in such a manner that it can effect itself, asa result of that critical reflection.

What are the chances that Indians are more tolerant and do not force solutions down the unwilling throats. We just dont want to give up on our rights and likewise everybody else has a right to stand up for his own claims. If that leaves some with anxiety attacks, what can we do.

Look your countries have outstanding problems with India why dont you realise that India itself is made up of 500+ princely states with diversity that has never been matched in any history. These princely states never had any outstanding issues with the federation.
 
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Nepal Perspective: Can India afford war with China?

Niraj Aryal, Kathmandu:

A country plagued with continued internal conflicts, a beleaguered nation with decades long armed insurgency in the North-East, Muslim population fighting for independent State in Kashmir since the very first day of the partition and now the overshoot of overtly boasted economic prosperity-the violent Maoist insurgency in the country’s most underprivileged states, can India afford War with either Pakistan or China or at worst both together?
However, Indian academics, warn their Government to remain ever prepared to fight China come year 2012 by improving its defense system.

Pretty nervous Indian academics give a very absurd reason for the War that is going to take place in the year 2012 as they opine in a some what frustrated manner?

“…that China will attack India by 2012 to divert the attention of its own people from unprecedented internal dissent, growing unemployment and financial problems that are threatening the hold of Communists in that country, claims Bharat Verma, Editor of the Indian Defense Review.

"China will launch an attack on the soft target- India before 2012. There are multiple reasons for a desperate Beijing to teach India the final lesson, thereby ensuring Chinese supremacy in Asia in this century," Verma is quoted by one of the Indian media.

Among other reasons for this assessment were rising unemployment, flight of capital worth billions of dollars, depletion of its foreign exchange reserves and the ever increasing internal dissent, Verma said in an editorial in the forthcoming issue of the premier defense journal of India.(Source: Indian Express)

At least looking into the Indian anxiety from Kathmandu lens, whether the southern neighbor, Nepal’s self proclaimed big brother any way, can afford war with China or not is not at all debatable …with China equipped with world’s largest military and virtually surrounding India in the Indian Ocean from Sri Lanka to Pakistan and most importantly, India’s neighboring countries of late preferring to side with China including natural gas enriched Myanmar, India is sure to loose the 2012 battle with the northern neighbor, if that happens at all.

If the prediction of the Indian academics is to come true, not only China, come 2012 India is sure to be at war in at least four different fronts, all together.

First and the foremost, India is to prepare itself to fight the internal insurgencies that it claims as to have been funded by China and morally supported by internal political forces such as that with the Naxals and ULFA and a host of similar insurgencies.

Second, a war with nuclear Pakistan looks inevitable, as India continues to create unrest in Baluchistan and support local Taliban outfits in the Swat valley, Pakistan’s patience is tested here.


And thirdly, at war with mediocre neighbors, such as Nepal, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka sans Bhutan for understandable reasons. India can not just ignore this proposition as well. Bhutan’s patience is also being tested, after all for how long it will continue to bow down to the Indian Gods to protect its ruthless regime.

What India can do to avert this war is quite simple as well?

Rather than concentrating on further irritating smaller neighbors like Nepal, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh, India should learn on how to “behave” with sovereign nation’s in the neighborhood.
Here are some important tips for India.

First, respect the sovereignty of the smaller neighbors.

India should stop unnecessarily meddling in the internal matters of the countries in the backyard and immediately recall those erratic undiplomatic envoys, for example Sood of the Talibani fame, who behave as if he were the viceroys of the colonist India.

India must also stop nurturing Terrorists in the neighborhood such as that of the LTTE and those Madhesi armed outfits based in India that are terrorizing Nepali citizens.

India can at best stop playing the dangerous game of using the US card against China with which it shares great economic interests. By the way, India should also keep it in mind that the US is also with Pakistan and China.

India must also stop provoking anti-China elements in the neighborhood as it has been doing it from the Nepalese soil.

Rather than building up its defense at the cost of the millions and millions of destitute citizens who barely get two meals a day, India should finally mend its own erratic ways in dealing with the neighbors who still possess some love for India.

2009-07-14 08:29:57

Telegraph Nepal : Nepal Perspective: Can India afford war with China?

India may not be on equal footing with China, but we have the right to try and defend ourselves.
 
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"Rather than concentrating on further irritating smaller neighbors like Nepal, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh, India should learn on how to “behave” with sovereign nation’s in the neighborhood."

And What exactly does this good behavior, you expect
Could you be more specific, What specific alleged injustice do you want India to correct. Before it is considered a good neighbor.

Could list them for all to read Please.
I am curious to read it.
 
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China will not win any war against India....China even can't afford to have any minor clashes with indian army. Both countries have the fastest growing economy and have more responsibilities in the region. BUT if china wages a war .....

India will probably be dragged into the war... on America's side.

Russia will NOT be on China's side in a war against the India.

Now, if it's just the India versus China, then it's a toss-up.:flame:

But with the COMBINED forces of the US, NATO, Japan and South Korea and that is exactly what will happen in the scenario of a confrontation between the India and China, there is no way in hell China will not be defeated.:usflag:
 
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China will not win any war against India....China even can't afford to have any minor clashes with indian army. Both countries have the fastest growing economy and have more responsibilities in the region. BUT if china wages a war .....

India will probably be dragged into the war... on America's side.

Russia will NOT be on China's side in a war against the India.

Now, if it's just the India versus China, then it's a toss-up.:flame:

But with the COMBINED forces of the US, NATO, Japan and South Korea and that is exactly what will happen in the scenario of a confrontation between the India and China, there is no way in hell China will not be defeated.:usflag:

Man ! With all those countries get involve, it will be a world war

scenario. Tell me the reason for them to fight a war against China ?

For India ? Please do wake up from your wet dreams. :smitten:

:pakistan::china:
 
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