Imran still chasing talks with military establishment

Imran still chasing talks with military establishment​

ISLAMABAD: Former prime minister Imran Khan on Monday ruled out talks with the government led by Prime Minister Shehbaz Sharif calling it an exercise in futility, but appeared to be keen on initiating a dialogue with the military establishment — the ‘real decision makers’.

Talking to the media during his appearance at the Islamabad High Court (IHC) in connection with multiple cases, the PTI chairman said that he did not believe in “vengeance and will strive for the rule of law” if he came to power again.

In response to a question whether he was ready to hold talks with politicians on the charter of economy, Mr Khan replied that politicians, including the incumbent rulers, were “powerless and they have no authority to conclude the dialogues”. The establishment is the “real decision maker and power is concentrated” within the military, he claimed.

Mr Khan accused former army chief Qamar Javed Bajwa of “backstabbing” and said that he could have sacked Mr Bajwa on at least three different occasions, but he exercised restraint. The PTI chief dispelled the impression of being under pressure and said that he was more concerned for the economy.

He said that the debt servicing exceeded the federal budget, the economy was on the verge of default, and industry had almost collapsed and added that all the economic indicators declined in just one year.

He said that the incumbent government was responsible for the poor economy and the only solution for this problem was to explore venues of income generation, mega reforms, and taking drastic measures.

He further said that his government was buying Russian oil at 40 per cent less price. “Is this a solution, is this a reason for toppling my regime?” he questioned. It may be noted that the first shipment of Russian fuel reached Pakistan on Sunday.

In a comment on the statement of the opposition leader in the National Assembly about a delay in general elections, Mr Khan said that the ruling coalition was reluctant to hold elections even in October fearing defeat. He said that they thought PTI would be crushed but they could only dream for this. He termed the departure of heavyweights from his party ‘as a blessing in disguise’, saying that “he got rid of the electables and that those who had parted ways with him and formed a new party are the ultimate losers”. He was optimistic about winning the next general elections even if he would be jailed.

Mr Khan also distanced himself from the drugs case registered against Rana Sanaullah during his tenure and blamed it on the Anti-Narcotics Force (ANF) headed by a serving major general who had briefed the federal cabinet on the arrest of Mr Sanaullah.

He expressed apprehensions about his military trial in connection with the May 9 violence and said that the authorities were turning “approvers to charge him” under the Army Act. He termed trials of civilians in military courts as the end of democracy and justice.

Bail in graft case

Earlier, Mr Khan appeared before the IHC to pursue his petition seeking direction for the chief commissioner to shift at least four courts from Sector F-8 Markaz to the comparatively secure Federal Judicial Complex (FJC) in Sector G-11.

His lawyer stated that due to the fragile law and order situation in Sector F-8 Markaz, it was not convenient for Mr Khan to appear in the relevant judicial magistrates/trial courts.

These cases were based on the FIRs registered at four police stations in Islamabad.

Also on Monday, the PTI chairman filed two separate petitions, one of which pertained to a corruption case registered in Dera Ghazi Khan.

IHC Chief Justice Aamer Farooq granted Mr Khan protective bail in the corruption case and directed him to approach the chief commissioner for shifting of courts from F-8 to the judicial complex in G-11.

Published in Dawn, June 13th, 2023

Imran still chasing talks with military establishment

Says politicians, including incumbent rulers, are "powerless".

www.dawn.com

https://twitter.com/x/status/1667598306942279685

 

[Samlee]

Maybe That Is WHy IK Has Taken His Statement Against Dirty Harry Back.Something Behind The Scenes Must Be Going On

 

[HAIDER]

I rarely ever read Dawn or any major media outlet in Pakistan. Most of my news comes from Twitter and certain Pakistani journalists who I follow.

Didn't know about comments being closed.

It was quite a rough section...

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

 

[Neelo]

Posting stuff like this only reaffirms what we know about you. Luckily you’ll be dead soon budday and I’ll be dancing on your grave.

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

Posting stuff like this only reaffirms what we know about you. Luckily you’ll be dead soon budday and I’ll be dancing on your grave.

I don't blame you kid on your daily dose of toxic brainwashing. Always be mindful of what you wish for others, karma always boomerangs the ill wisher.

 

[Neelo]

I don't blame you kid on your daily dose of toxic brainwashing. Always be mindful of what you wish for others, karma always boomerangs the ill wisher.
View attachment 934420

I don’t need lectures from an old man who touches little kids. Hope you’re in the ground burning in hell. Patwari machoda.

 

[Trailer23]

Maybe That Is WHy IK Has Taken His Statement Against Dirty Harry Back.Something Behind The Scenes Must Be Going On

I seriously doubt the Establishment wants to have a sit down with IK - any time soon.

If IK had a (Trump) card, he would've played it. Now..., with most of Party Leaders have deserted him in his time of need, he's just clutching on straws - just to be relevant.

It'll take nothing short of a miracle from (the West) to orchestrate a meeting.

If Elections are held in October..., PTI can still give the others a run for their money. Problem is..., who's gonna lead from the front if IK is sidelined with House Arrest?

 

[Fasbre2]

Kid behave yourself, nevertheless, I do promise you a mental Rehab in the future.

Look at yourself kid threatening others .. look behind your back before threaten others…

 

[SaadH]

I seriously doubt the Establishment wants to have a sit down with IK - any time soon.

If IK had a (Trump) card, he would've played it. Now..., with most of Party Leaders have deserted him in his time of need, he's just clutching on straws - just to be relevant.

It'll take nothing short of a miracle from (the West) to orchestrate a meeting.

If Elections are held in October..., PTI can still give the others a run for their money. Problem is..., who's gonna lead from the front if IK is sidelined with House Arrest?

IK's passiveness proved to be his undoing. You can never dislodge an entrenched military establishment through peaceful democratic means. It's never happened in the history of the world. We have three examples from our immediate neighborhood that proves this maxim, i.e. Bangladesh, Iranian revolution and the Taliban.

 

[airhead]

IK's passiveness proved to be his undoing. You can never dislodge an entrenched military establishment through peaceful democratic means. It's never happened in the history of the world. We have three examples from our immediate neighborhood that proves this maxim, i.e. Bangladesh, Iranian revolution and the Taliban.

Turkey !!! Erdogan came in to power 20 or so ago when the military was very much entrenched similar to how it is in Pakistan but gradually he was able to reduce their power and eventually dislodged them. The key was good governance...

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

What are you gonna do about it patwari machoda?

There were a few nut jobs like you here passing silly remarks, I wonder where they are now!

 

[SaadH]

Turkey !!! Erdogan came in to power 20 or so ago when the military was very much entrenched similar to how it is in Pakistan but gradually he was able to reduce their power and eventually dislodged them. The key was good governance...

Turkey's military was hampered by their aspirations to join EU. They couldn't have engaged in massive HR violations and would have any hope of joining the EU. Erdogan used this to his advantage and was also helped by Turkish people's psyche of not accepting any slave masters.

Pak military on the other hand has no compulsions and has full backing of the western colonial powers to take out any perceived threats or even critics of the colonial empires.

 

[blain2]

First of all why would a military will talk at this stage with IK when they are clearly winning? Negotiations happen where power is equal on both sides not when one side has a big advantage.
Secondly if that's how IK wants to be in the power again with the blessings of the army then he is not any different than the rest of corrupt power hungry crooks and he fought for nothing.
IK next government should have a complete control over army and ISI. A civilian supremacy and democracy. Not another product of army's political engineering.

Because the establishment does not look at things as a zero sum game. The establishment could open the door of talks with IK because they *have* to think long term. Pakistan will remain destabilized for as long as a large portion of the population remains disenfranchised. The establishment's antithesis is instability and they loath it. So they are already on the hunt for this stability and a large disenfranchised population does not help.

So, for those who think khakis are duffers who cannot look past their noses, one should realize a few things.

- First is that establishment will not change its goal-posts overnight. They have their views (and also inside knowledge) of what IK can and cannot deliver regardless of what his base may say/think. If they become convinced that IK is more trouble than benefit, they will stick to their current approach. If they believe that there is an opening to work with IK (please refrain from offering up idealistic counter-arguments such as the voice of the people etc. etc.), they will find a way.

- Establishment is a slow moving dinosaur. They are conservative in their outlook on everything. So they will not relent and hand-over control to anyone till they are convinced that things will move forward roughly as they envision it. This civilian *supremacy* is a mirage in our part of the region for now. It will not happen over-night because all, including IK, came into power with some support of the establishment. So this was a partnership from the get-go and eventually the partners fell out.

In the near future too, Pakistan will be ruled by these partnerships/alignments where all entities will have to watch out for the red lines of others. I know this is not what uber-democrats want to hear, but if we want any semblance of stability, this is the only way. Otherwise even free and fair elections and the resulting winning party will not deliver stability to Pakistan.

This, unfortunately, is *my* realistic assessment of the situation on the ground. I could be wrong, but I think I am mostly right.

 

[PakFactor]

Because the establishment does not look at things as a zero sum game. The establishment could open the door of talks with IK because they *have* to think long term. Pakistan will remain destabilized for as long as a large portion of the population remains disenfranchised. The establishment's antithesis is instability and they loath it. So they are already on the hunt for this stability and a large disenfranchised population does not help.

So, for those who think khakis are duffers who cannot look past their noses, one should realize a few things.

- First is that establishment will not change its goal-posts overnight. They have their views (and also inside knowledge) of what IK can and cannot deliver regardless of what his base may say/think. If they become convinced that IK is more trouble than benefit, they will stick to their current approach. If they believe that there is an opening to work with IK (please refrain from offering up idealistic counter-arguments such as the voice of the people etc. etc.), they will find a way.

- Establishment is a slow moving dinosaur. They are conservative in their outlook on everything. So they will not relent and hand-over control to anyone till they are convinced that things will move forward roughly as they envision it. This civilian *supremacy* is a mirage in our part of the region for now. It will not happen over-night because all, including IK, came into power with some support of the establishment. So this was a partnership from the get-go and eventually the partners fell out.

In the near future too, Pakistan will be ruled by these partnerships/alignments where all entities will have to watch out for the red lines of others. I know this is not what uber-democrats want to hear, but if we want any semblance of stability, this is the only way. Otherwise even free and fair elections and the resulting winning party will not deliver stability to Pakistan.

This, unfortunately, is *my* realistic assessment of the situation on the ground. I could be wrong, but I think I am mostly right.

I believe you are 100% right. This country is a social contract between father and son, as Bhutto rightly called Ayub, in essence, the military, abbu ji; we failed to understand its meaning then. So we, the common man, have ourselves to blame.

However, as you mentioned, their approach is slow-moving and very conservative. Still, all their political engineering has failed to produce any beneficial results for the common man overall as they've been busy keeping an eye on each other's tails not to step on. It's as if looking at the phone while driving on the highway is a sure way to get everyone killed in the vehicle and kill those in the other car.

I think, however, the military might need to step back and let the political process play out and mature on its own; yes, it could bring instability for some time, but that's how a new life is born through painful labor. We can't keep creating Frankensteins as they become deranged over time. A Frankenstein made of many parts doesn't feel its own self, and it's a bottle of many things it's not.

 

[airmarshal]

Exactly, first all party conference should be held, the political parties need to decide how much role of the establishment do they want, do they want free and fair elections or not, political maneuvers or not? Do they want dirty video scandals, lies, propaganda, voice recordings, personnel business in politics.

All political parties need to act mature and come to a conclusion, they should decide to avoid all of the above, and criticise each other on polices, statements etc then all parties including Pti should hold talks with the establishment regarding foreign policy, international relations, domestic security policy, general appointments. Make an agreement.

Then we can all move on as a nation, move away from dirty politics in to politics based on policies, working hard in the opposition to come to power rather than buying MNAs.

Shahid Kaqaan Abbasi for some reason is talking sense and on the real issues.

PML-N leaders slam governance system | The Express Tribune

Abbasi, Miftah say change of faces unlikely to improve it

tribune.com.pk

‘Reimagining Pakistan’ seminar paints bleak picture of state’s future

Shahid Khaqan Abbasi says entire revenue being paid against loans’ mark-up; Miftah calls for new social contract.

www.dawn.com

All political parties are on one side. If they want to come back, they need to rebrand themselves and clean up their filth. MQM, PMLN, PPP and JUI are all spent forces. Its only establishment that has ego and foolishness to carry these political dead bodies. Talking to these parties is useless. They are dead and so is their politics. This political funeral pyre is embodiment of establishment's ego and arrogance. The establishment fully owns this mess. It has proven this as it has not moved back an inch from regime change despite strong public reaction and loss of reputation. So the only point is to talk to establishment. The most obstinate powers understand, reflect and change their behaviour. Not our establishment. Its more obstinate than a donkey.

If establishment does not want to talk, it will not have much time on its side. Economy is bleeding. There is no plan B. Pakistan to outsiders is a sh8thole and no one wants to either invest or lend.

Because the establishment does not look at things as a zero sum game. The establishment could open the door of talks with IK because they *have* to think long term. Pakistan will remain destabilized for as long as a large portion of the population remains disenfranchised. The establishment's antithesis is instability and they loath it. So they are already on the hunt for this stability and a large disenfranchised population does not help.

So, for those who think khakis are duffers who cannot look past their noses, one should realize a few things.

- First is that establishment will not change its goal-posts overnight. They have their views (and also inside knowledge) of what IK can and cannot deliver regardless of what his base may say/think. If they become convinced that IK is more trouble than benefit, they will stick to their current approach. If they believe that there is an opening to work with IK (please refrain from offering up idealistic counter-arguments such as the voice of the people etc. etc.), they will find a way.

- Establishment is a slow moving dinosaur. They are conservative in their outlook on everything. So they will not relent and hand-over control to anyone till they are convinced that things will move forward roughly as they envision it. This civilian *supremacy* is a mirage in our part of the region for now. It will not happen over-night because all, including IK, came into power with some support of the establishment. So this was a partnership from the get-go and eventually the partners fell out.

In the near future too, Pakistan will be ruled by these partnerships/alignments where all entities will have to watch out for the red lines of others. I know this is not what uber-democrats want to hear, but if we want any semblance of stability, this is the only way. Otherwise even free and fair elections and the resulting winning party will not deliver stability to Pakistan.

This, unfortunately, is *my* realistic assessment of the situation on the ground. I could be wrong, but I think I am mostly right.

I totally agree.