Important message

[jeypore]

What we've managed to do for the umteenth time in this thread is point out very obvious problems plaguing Pakistan. We all know that Pakistan needs:

1. An independent and revised foreign policy.
2. Concentrate on activities to boost Economics and Trade
3. Get rid of corpulent, corrupt and puppet regimes and politicians.
4. Frame a definite Energy Policy.
5. Nuke India

Even though simple in solution to the problem, but one part does make sense, let me answer to your questions:

1. An independent and revised foreign policy.

You have none because your gov't is puppet of your military, so no one takes you seriously until you solve the problem of democracy and military!!!!!!!!!!!

2. Concentrate on activities to boost Economics and Trade

AS an example people in States fight about taxes and stable gov't. I think you are long off that scenario because the real true gov't has to be formed yet......

3. Get rid of corpulent, corrupt and puppet regimes and politicians.

Join the club of the gov't system around the world... You are the only one that control this matter and no one else, God speed!!

4. Frame a definite Energy Policy.

If the gov't system is right energy will follow........

5. Nuke India

Nuke Pakistan.....

Like you have said, I was also kidding........

 

[MastanKhan]

Exactly what I have been saying all along - geopolitical interests are never static, and Pakistan's blind faith in Chinese "friendship" will be sadly broken should this continue to be ignored.

Hi,

Pakistanis want to fool themselves---and the politicians give them what they want.

 

[muse]

That is the whole point Sir. That is why I say that do not blame the PPP toothless government. The determinal policies of Pakistan are only subservise to the Army. Let me try to put it this way. What should PPP do for a better investment climate = Peace and stability in the country. The biggest possible importer of Pakistani goods today is India so there needs to be peace with it. Just the transit revenue of Indian goods to Afhanistan + energy resources in to India will create development and prosperity centers in Pakistan but what is stopping it?

So it is ironic that when the economic policy is subsersive to the foreign policy, and when Army runs the foreign policy, yet you blame the PPP government!

Pakistan is sitting right next to 2 of the fastest growing economies in the world. It is friends with one who just wants to sell to Pakistan and the other which can buy, well that is the Army story. Is it not Sir? Yet blame the PPP government?

Hi,

Pakistanis want to fool themselves---and the politicians give them what they want.

MastanKhan


Permit me to deal with MK's post first - there isn't a polity in the world, including the US in which politician are courageous to lead - all politicians want to ensure there is as little pain as possible while interests closer to their hearts, will find equally, if not more of a smooth path

And in the same light, while the Pakistan army policy planners are certainly not the brightest of any bunch, it's unfair to suggest that the Pakistan army policy planners have been an obstacle to trade with China - certainly they have been late coming to the understanding that trade policy and not AID policy, is a part of the geo-strategic calculations of all self respecting nation states.

Trade with India offer much promise, a promise that only the resolution of outstanding disputes, can fulfill.

In both cases, leadership is required - like all other politicians, these "professionals" of the Pakistani political system, will not be able to offer the structural framework required to push this existential necessity further -- indeed, I invite you to read the peoples daily editorial with a more critical eye -- note the elements of the esteemed ambassador Masood khan's speech that the editorial highlights and note how the editorial CONTRASTS those with what it characterizes as the concerns of Chinese academicians - the very fact that this important message has to be the center piece of a dialogue that is less than an official government conference, but perhaps, at least one hopes, which will help focus the thinking in official circles in Pakistan, and if this message is also heard in the GHQ and it's Think Tanks, all the better.

 

[iPhone]

Good economy comes with good trade. Good trade comes with a strong political system and govt. How can we expect the chain to follow through when one of the link is broken.

When after every few years we have a military coup or the politicians pulling each others leg to form or derail the govt, how can we form a strong political setup.

But I'll be optimistic here and say that those mistakes are past us and the reality has hit home, even though late but indeed it has struck. Presently completing its 4th year, this is a big step towards building a strong political system. The elected govt will be much more stable and confident on the heels of present ones successful tenure.

They'll be able make more and better trading deals and take gutsy decisions. Quiet late but the country has started to walk towards a stronger more mature political setup where military coups will become just a thing of past.

 

[GOD OF WAR]

That is the problem with me my friend. I just cannot read but also read between the lines. Of course, I know that the Army dictator governments are clearly more growth focussed in Pakistan when looking from the Chinese perspectives but that is anyway a given. So no surprises that the PPP government of last years is anyway the scapegoat for the systematic exploitation of the Pakistan economy and its interest and selling them to the hightest bidder for its own interest by Pakistan Army.

Even in the current economic climate, why does China being a friend not actually set up locomotives factory in Pakistan via an investment and actually make the locomotives there instead of exporting them. The demand is huge anyway + when manufacturing in Pakistan, a lot can actually be imported in to China at least in the bordering provinces?

HOw about textiles? That is an already competitive product. Why is China intent on importing cotton rather than value added goods from Pakistan?

To implement the reforms, the Pakistani's need funding. They tried to get it from the himalyan taller friend China but were told to go back to IMF because China does not fund growth but only helps in exports of its products so they had to run back to IMF. If really China has a stake in development of Pakistan, what is stopping it to make investment in the fundamental sectors and not just in the telecom where it is anyway a cash cow situation? And please do not come back with the dams etc. because anyway it is Chinese workers that work there and Pakistan pays the money back several times even when the name plaque says that it was China's funding when rather the Pakistani's paid the principle already and will not pay the debt several times over.

Goods meaning post by you. To amswer your qustions.

1. Unfortunately the dictatorial regimes have done much to forward trade and economy, while NONE of the elected governments have demonstrated any thing to match.

2. Though Im not a fan of Musharaf, but its a fact that he was the architect who re-kindled Russia Pakistan relations after ZA Bhutto in the 1970s. For 2000 to 2010, trade between Russi increased 10 folds, (Im not certain but i think it was from 1billion to 10 billion!!)

3. China and many other countries are not willing to help Pakistan via cash, but in kind. Thats because Zardari's reputation precedes him. No boys trusts this government, hence no cash... Its sad but true. I know from a very reliable source that Zardari also sold the platlets from the blood accumulated for soldiers and other IDPs!! That's the extent of his notoriety. Gillani's wife embezzeled millions from the Zakazt (charity) fund and we all know the '4.5 arab rupey ka ghapla" associated with the 'Hajj-Scandal'. where do you think all that $$ is going? In a few private bank accounts. Since there is no reliability, how can yo u blame China or any other country not helping. Amnesty international says that only 4% of the aid actually reaches the masses!!!

We need to get rid of this government, and install an honest government, short of which all pipe dreams and speculations remain exactly where they are... in the pipe

Once again, I do feel that your posts are beneficial, thanks.

 

[GOD OF WAR]

1. Get the power production levels up and ensure gas supply to industry.

2. Promote known strong points like the textile industry to export to China, helped by requesting China to favor our output.

3. Ask for transfer of technology wherever possible (#1 will help here too.)

4. Improve transit through the KKH as a route for bilateral exports.

and so on.

Common themes in the above are power, infrastructure, and political initiatives.

I hope that is enumerated to your satisfaction.

Sir, all that you have pointed out is the Plan, not the Strategy, the Agenda, not the blue print. All your points while valid cannot be brought into play without an honest government, which brings me to my earlier point, that NONE of it is achievable unless Pakistanis DO something about kicking out and punishing the corrupt politicians. HOW DO PAKISTANIS DO THAT?

Your enumeration was quite satiating

 

[GOD OF WAR]

Even though simple in solution to the problem, but one part does make sense, let me answer to your questions:



You have none because your gov't is puppet of your military, so no one takes you seriously until you solve the problem of democracy and military!!!!!!!!!!!



AS an example people in States fight about taxes and stable gov't. I think you are long off that scenario because the real true gov't has to be formed yet......



Join the club of the gov't system around the world... You are the only one that control this matter and no one else, God speed!!



If the gov't system is right energy will follow........


Nuke Pakistan.....

Like you have said, I was also kidding........

Accept all your points, Actually that's what I was prompting V Cheng Sir to say. However, as far as Foreign Policy is concerned, its not the military alone to be held responsible. Politicians give the military the chance due to their excessive shenanigans. And our foreign policy is framed in the US.... that's the bitter truth, nothing can happen if we don't internally solve our governance issues.

Thank you for saying what I wanted someone else to spell out.

You nuking first or shall we?

 

[VCheng]

Sir, all that you have pointed out is the Plan, not the Strategy, the Agenda, not the blue print. All your points while valid cannot be brought into play without an honest government, which brings me to my earlier point, that NONE of it is achievable unless Pakistanis DO something about kicking out and punishing the corrupt politicians. HOW DO PAKISTANIS DO THAT?

Your enumeration was quite satiating

I have been saying that all along too!

An an expatriate, it is not for me to TELL the Pakistanis what to do about their government. I am also very clear on that. I will help wherever I can, but this initiative is for all those who can participate directly in the process.

Please do not mind my saying this:

"People get the government they deserve" - Alexis de Toqueville.

 

[GOD OF WAR]

I have been saying that all along too!

An an expatriate, it is not for me to TELL the Pakistanis what to do about their government. I am also very clear on that. I will help wherever I can, but this initiative is for all those who can participate directly in the process.

Please do not mind my saying this:

"People get the government they deserve" - Alexis de Toqueville.

Sir, expats have as much say in Pakistans affairs. the key is honesty and sincerity towards your nation. it doesn't matter where you live and for how long.

Enumerate 'Iniciatives'

There is a Hadees in the same lines as well. 'A people will get rulers that will personify their deeds.' Its also one of the prophecies of the end times.

 

[VCheng]

Sir, expats have as much say in Pakistans affairs. the key is honesty and sincerity towards your nation. it doesn't matter where you live and for how long.

Enumerate 'Iniciatives'

There is a Hadees in the same lines as well. 'A people will get rulers that will personify their deeds.' Its also one of the prophecies of the end times.

Allah bless you for saying that, please tell that to others here who hate me simply for being an expat, including a TT member who said that I could not be sincere or honest towards Pakistan becasue - to put it politely - I have shown my "rear end" and ran away. Nothing is farther from the truth.

 

[regular]

Here you go:

Financial Times - China signs $35bn in deals with Pakistan

China's policy is not to give "aid", that is the forte of the paternalistic Western powers, who can afford it anyway, given that they are high-income nations.

China still has a low GDP per capita, we cannot afford to give out large amounts of "aid", nor do we believe in it. What we can do, is provide a large amount of investment, and that is exactly what we have done.

Great! thats what we need. Investments brings manufacturing and jobs required by our country not the Aid. Cuz Aid is a disese destroys the country's financial infrastructure. pplz gets lazy...

 

[VelocuR]

Read my signature quote. It explain everything in simple one sentence.

 

[AHMED85]

Read my signature quote. It explain everything in simple one sentence.

yaa i agree with you all political parties doing time waste in their mutual conflicts...similarly others..

 

[VelocuR]

^^yeah, it is been last sixty five years, not only current government. This is something we are proud of it and only 200 billions GPDs in our pockets.

Country: Pakistan
Indicator: Balance of Trade
Actual : Aug/2011
Previous: -1842.00
Next Release: -1486.00
Impact: **** (four stars)

Pakistan Balance of Trade

Japan is small country with massive trade with China 300 Billion, compared to large country Pakistan.

 

[jeypore]

Politicians give the military the chance due to their excessive shenanigans.

First of all, the reason your military created there own economic well being because your gov't could not sustain there on existence, based on constant perception of Indian threat....In economic terms they made investment to fund themselves. Intern your military has become more powerful then your own democractic system today.... I think you need to solve that problem first, because until you do not, Pakistan military will keep doing shenanigans to fund it's own operations..........

Thanks..