Important for each other – Pakistan and Israel

[Crystal-Clear]

diplomatic relation = fine .
supporting israel = no no no no.

 

[Chakar The Great]

It has to happen, just a matter of time.

 

[xyxmt]

If you want to plant trees then recognizing Israel can only help Pakistan; Israel has lots of experience with successful reforestation and doubtless would be eager to assist: link

least you can do is send us 8 fully grown pine trees that you helped India destroy, is will be a good start and we will forgive the crow.

 

[SQ8]

Is what Israel is doing today really apartheid? Regardless, did nations withhold their recognition of Pakistan until after Bangladesh achieved independence? Do nations today withhold their recognition of Pakistan due to the suppression of Baluchi nationalism? Do you withhold recognition of 20+ majority-Muslim states because they compelled their Jews to leave their homes and exist in only a small corner of the Middle East?

The answer to all of the above is "no". So,

A c. 1619 painting by Domenico Fetti entitled The Parable of the Mote and the Beam.

Why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
- Matthew 7:3
​

"Apartheid" today is reduced to a mere virtue-signaling buzzword that Israel-haters employ to validate the status quo - and keep themselves on top. Why shouldn't those who use it be called out for their distortions?

Nobody gives Pakistan unquestioned aid from my taxes for arresting 9 year old Palestinians. I would also suggest you stick to the topic lest you want your voice silenced in this thread.

You are the problem with Israel- brainwashed into believing that whatever atrocities you do are correct.

Thankfully, the new Jewish generation is recognizing this near pol pot like mentality prevalent in religious extremists in Israel and the current government in power. They are denying birthright visits, they are lobbying against giving Israel free reign in Palestine- Times are changing for the better.

 

[I.R.A]

The Pakistani intelligence agency Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) closely worked with Mossad against the Soviet Union. Both Tel Aviv and Islamabad sided with Washington during the Cold War whereas Islamabad’s arch-rival India sided with the Soviet Union. If it were not for the close co-operation between the ISI and Mossad, the Soviet Union would not have been perhaps defeated.

The people who fought Soviet Union on battlefield are called Afghan Taliban these days. How about Israeli state recognizes them?

Pakistan has slowly moved away from Washington and is strengthening its ties with Moscow, whereas india and Israel are close to Washington ........... so Mosad can take all the credit of defeating USSR, does it matter anymore.

While anti-Israel sentiment does exist in the country, Israelis who have visited the country speak nothing but of praise of the hospitality they have witnessed in Pakistan.

Why should common people have any problem with any other people visiting them, and why should that necessarily dictate the foreign policy?

It doesn't suit any Muslim nation to have ties with a nation that oppresses and kills the weak, that believes in doomsday prophecies and wants destruction, that thinks the rest of the world was born to serve them, that is known for breaking pacts and has never ever once recognized that Muslims were their saviours.

 

[TheNoob]

Israel is more religious than Pakistan.
Yet still more developed! HOW. Oh right, free money from muh holocaust funds.

It doesn't suit any Muslim nation to have ties with a nation that oppresses and kills the weak, that believes in doomsday prophecies and wants destruction, that thinks the rest of the world was born to serve them, that is known for breaking pacts and has never ever once recognized that Muslims were their saviours.

Idk man if thats what we're going abide by...
Might as well destroy relations with the world because everyone has done that and continue to do so.

 

[I.R.A]

Might as well destroy relations with the world because everyone has done that and continue to do so.

Even india hasn't settled indians in IOK.

 

[khanz]

Sorry but i'm selfish and pak only benefits from this. Pakistani logic is weird, emotional ,and just not practical how is not talking to the Israelis helped palestine ? it's just meant Pakistan has been cut off from them you can't aid palestinians without talking to the Israelis also.The world is changing and Pak should move along with it things are not black and white and there is middle ground . We have full diplomatic relations with enemies like afganistan and India who work outright to harm us but it seems to be shocking to have relations with Israel who we actually have no dispute with and besides if have relations it would mean them no longer seeing Pak as an enemy would also make them less enclined to support Indian designs against us , help weaken the stereotypes and narrative built against us in the west and improve pak standing in Washington where Israeli lobby is very powerful . Pakistanis would also be able to visit Al-Aqsa.
You can still support a palestinian state and you don't need to be close allies with Israel or support them in anything but simply recognise them and have very low level diplomatic relations and not be hostile why is that so terrible -So many countries have relations with them but still support palestine such as our best friend Turkey and others like Jordan and Ireland.Way I see it is a only a win situation for us this is a rare occassion i'm gonna have to agree with Solomon lol

 

[Foxtrot Delta]

​

THE BLOGS
Turyal Azam Khan
Writer, Blogger and Journalist

Important for each other – Pakistan and Israel
MAR 24, 2019, 8:42 PM

It is pretty clear what Pakistan’s position on the Israel-Palestine conflict is and it is also pretty clear what side Israel chooses to be with when it comes to the rivalry between Pakistan and India. However, despite being on opposing patterns in most cases, Tel Aviv and Islamabad are not at war with and neither have any conflicts as compared with Pakistan’s neighbor Iran. Relations between the two countries have remained very calm despite Islamabad’s decision not to recognize Israel.

It is interesting to note that one of Pakistan’s major allies Saudi Arabia have mutual interests as well when it comes to dealing with Iran, a rival state of both countries. Hence it is important to remember that Israel is a key player in the Middle East region and despite Islamabad’s position on the opposing side, it is important to recognize Israel considering its status in the Middle East.

This view was even stressed by the former Pakistani President General (Retired) Pervez Musharraf. He expressed these views in an interview with the Israeli newspaper Haaretz. In the interview, he admired the military capability of the former Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and also said that while he wants a solution to the Palestinian question, he has to admit that Israel was here to say and that is why it was essential to recognize Israel.

During the recent India-Pakistan tensions which took place after February 14 when an Indian convoy was attacked in the Indian administered-Kashmir area of Pulwama of which New Delhi blames Islamabad for the attack, Musharraf made similar remarks about establishing good ties with Israel. He expressed these statements in a press conference. In 2005, when the former Pakistani president wanted to make contacts with the Israeli leadership with the assistance of Turkey, the Israeli government responded within 24 hours. The late Pakistani Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto also wanted to establish good ties with Israel as per the Israeli media.

The Israeli and Pakistani military worked together during Operation Cyclone at the height of the Cold War. The Pakistani intelligence agency Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) closely worked with Mossad against the Soviet Union. Both Tel Aviv and Islamabad sided with Washington during the Cold War whereas Islamabad’s arch-rival India sided with the Soviet Union. If it were not for the close co-operation between the ISI and Mossad, the Soviet Union would not have been perhaps defeated. Pakistan and Israel are among the most powerful militaries in the world and their co-operation is essential if a time of crisis comes as witnessed during the cold war.

While anti-Israel sentiment does exist in the country, Israelis who have visited the country speak nothing but of praise of the hospitality they have witnessed in Pakistan. The most prominent Israeli figure to have lived in Pakistan is Dan Kieselman, a sports physiotherapist and an osteopath who has worked with the Pakistan national cricket team. Despite a few objections, Kieselman described Lahore as a beautiful city and has claimed to never have hidden his Israeli identity while living with his wife there. He served as the sports physiotherapist for the Pakistani national cricket team from 1995 till 1999. Similarly, an Israeli-Arab lecturer Ramzi Sulaiman took part in a scientific conference organized by the University of Punjab in Lahore in 2015.

When British journalist Saima Mohsin who is of Pakistani origin was in Israel in 2014 covering the Israel-Gaza conflict, she shared something unusual happening in an Israeli restaurant. A song of the popular late Pakistani singer Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan was being played at the restaurant and. The staff had no idea and they were overjoyed upon hearing it.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10152609193659339

Sporting ties between the nations have been remarkable as witnessed at the 2002 Wimbledon Open when Pakistani tennis player Aisam Ul Haq Qureshi teamed up with Israeli tennis player Amir Hadad. Despite condemnation from the Pakistan Sports Board, Qureshi responded which most Pakistanis and Israelis can learn a thing or two from “I would like to be talked about for my tennis rather than politics. If we can change people’s minds, then that would be a good thing.”

When the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu visited India, he stated in an interview regarding Tel Aviv’s relations with Pakistan “We (Israel) are not enemies of Pakistan and Pakistan should not be our enemy either.”

The above statement makes the Israeli position on Pakistan quite clear now it is up to the Pakistani leadership in a similar manner. Despite tense relations with India, Pakistan and India still recognize each other and while Islamabad and Tel Aviv have not been involved in any direct conflict and have even co-operated militarily, Islamabad chooses not to recognize Tel Aviv.

It is essential for Pakistan to recognize Israel and start a new chapter. Pakistani Prime Minister Imran Khan whose slogan is Naya Pakistan meaning he wants to make a New Pakistan should start by establishing ties with Israel. Pakistan’s stance on the Israel-Palestine conflict is quite clear however this does not mean that Israel is going anytime soon and in order to maintain a good presence in today’s global village, it is important for Tel Aviv and Islamabad to recognize each other. Who knows that the diplomatic ties between the two countries lead to something better that could not have been achieved if they did not recognize each other.

ABOUT THE AUTHOR
Turyal Azam Khan is a Pakistani writer, blogger, and journalist who focuses on topics such as current affairs, global issues, social issues, lifestyle, and culture. He has written for Asia Times, The Diplomat, Dunya Blogs, The Nation, Daily Times, Naya Daur and EACPE.

Please note that the posts on The Blogs are contributed by third parties. The opinions, facts and any media content in them are presented solely by the authors, and neither The Times of Israel nor its partners assume any responsibility for them. Please contact us in case of abuse. In case of abuse, Report this post.

even though religious mullah (extreme biased religious people) always will portray israel in the most evil way possible we all know there are always good and bad people in every society. but israeli administration shoots itself in the foot everytime and does evil deeds and hence gets hatred from even common people like me, who would love to get along with Israel just for the sake that we admire good qualities of jews and there are many, Pakistaniz don't have a beef with Israel nor do we want one. we would love to keep at a distance not friendly not hostile, But Arabs are Muslims and our Brother's in Faith that's the best kind of brother's one can ever have, so Pakistan and we Pakistaniz shall Always stand With Arabs and Muslims overall like Iran for example because no one like to see their brother getting beaten up or killed.

its simple Israel ends enemity and hostile actions against arabs of Lebanon, Palistine , Syria , We in pakistan will loose all hatred against Israel. but we are advised against the children of Jaqob Peace be upon Him by our Prophet PBUH that Children of Jaqob (Israel) troubled all their elders and the Prophets, messengers sent to them by Allah. even in faith they caused trouble so we shall always be very careful when dealing with the likes of Children of Israel , citizens of Israel. we shall have no hatred if they stop harming our brothers.

 

[niaz]

The world is now a global village and every country in the world matters.

Pakistan's biggest adversary is India and we have a large diplomatic mission in Delhi, why not in Israel? After all Egypt, Jordan & Turkey have diplomatic relations with Israel with no adverse consequence on their relationship with the rest of the Muslim countries. In my personal opinion, there is no harm in having some contact with Israel, as we can only make a meaningful contribution to the Palestinian cause if there is direct contact with the Israeli official channels.

However, since most of my countrymen, for one reason or another, are against formal relations with Israel, I would respect their will and happily accept the status quo.

 

[313ghazi]

I have no personal vendetta with Israel. My problem with them is this;

1. The Occupation of the third holiest site in Islam. The Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) talked about the site of Al Aqsa and referred to it on parity with Makkah and Medinah. Islam does not have two holy sites, it has three. For as long as there has been Islam Muslims have fought for control of that site - just because we have faced defeat recently, doesn't mean we have faced defeat forever.

2. The inhumanity of the treatment of Palestinians at the hands of Israel. I will speak up for injustice everywhere it occurs, as an individual that is my right. If I was the leader of our country, I would of course balance that with the right my people had over me (a leaders duty is to serve his people and their interests). However I'm just a normal person, as such I am thankfully free to stand up to injustice. So I do. I would have done the same with Nazi Germany had I been alive at that time.

I honestly believe if the majority of the worlds countries put people ahead of profits for a moment and just supported the BDS movement - Israel would make peace with the Palestinians. There is no need for the loss of lives, just the loss of money. Unfortunately as we know - in our time, humanity has no value.

If Israel would withdraw to the Pre-67 borders, then I have no problem with Israel. Some people will argue that India is also occupying Muslim lands, yet we recognise India. To them I say - we do not recognise the illegal occupation of India. Furthermore India has been a reality for millennia, this is just it's latest form. Israel came about recently and it's borders are disputed. Our nation has agreed to recognise the borders it agrees with the Palestinian people, who's land it currently occupies.

As for the great talk of diplomatic rivers of honey and milk once we recognise Israel - anyone who believes that needs to dip their head in a river for a moment to help them wake up.

Remember the treatment they displayed to Musa (AS) who freed them from the tyranny of Pharoah. They worshipped a calf when he climbed a mountain. Remember the way they behaved with Isa (AS) who told them not to practice Riba. Remember the promises they broke with the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). Remember how they treated the Palestinian people who gave them shelter as the Nazi's drove them out of Europe. They are no different than their Hindu partners in crime across the border.

Lets talk real-politik what advantage has any Muslim nation had by recognising Israel? Would the Gulf Arabs enjoy the favours and protection of the USA, if they were not petrol pumps? What have Morocco and Jordan gained that was not through the efforts of their own hard work? Turkey has been its closest partner in the region for decades - what have they had in return?

What would we stand to gain? We trade in next to nothing anyway - we're broke so we can't import any of the fancy tech the Israeli's develop, not that they'd sell any of it to us anyway. Do you think they'd suddenly stop selling hi-tech weaponry to India? Do our relations with France, Russia, USA or Britain prevent them from selling to India? Of course not. The only nation who doesn't sell is China because they consider the Indian an adversary.

Is Israel capable of doing any real harm to us? No. Are we capable of doing any real harm to Israel? No. The likeliness of any harm either way is extremely unlikely.

What else could we gain from recognising Israel? Favour with the USA? What do you think will change suddenly? They'll back you over the Indians? Every single Pakistani leader has bent over backwards to please the USA and gain their favour. It's always been temporary whilst the US had something to gain. After they they reverted to type. This is how they treat every non white nation who isn't subservient to them. It's high time we stopped thinking like slaves. Stop trying to get into good books and write your own damn book.

The way I see it, if we recognise Israel we gain nothing and to be honest lose nothing either. It's a matter of principle and we know the Pakistani state has a habit of selling principles for dollars. This push to "recognise" Israel that we see in some dark corners, is nothing more than Israel trying to further buy global legitimacy - one insignificant country at a time. It's branding for the zionists - nothing more.

My stance for not recognising it is entirely based on principle. We do know that morality has been sold for dollars in Pakistan before and will be sold again. It's a daily transaction really - just on different scales. If there was any real tangible benefit to be had - our sell out leaders would have done it long ago.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

I have no personal vendetta with Israel. My problem with them is this;

1. The Occupation of the third holiest site in Islam. The Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) talked about the site of Al Aqsa and referred to it on parity with Makkah and Medinah. Islam does not have two holy sites, it has three. For as long as there has been Islam Muslims have fought for control of that site - just because we have faced defeat recently, doesn't mean we have faced defeat forever.

2. The inhumanity of the treatment of Palestinians at the hands of Israel. I will speak up for injustice everywhere it occurs, as an individual that is my right. If I was the leader of our country, I would of course balance that with the right my people had over me (a leaders duty is to serve his people and their interests). However I'm just a normal person, as such I am thankfully free to stand up to injustice. So I do. I would have done the same with Nazi Germany had I been alive at that time.

I honestly believe if the majority of the worlds countries put people ahead of profits for a moment and just supported the BDS movement - Israel would make peace with the Palestinians. There is no need for the loss of lives, just the loss of money. Unfortunately as we know - in our time, humanity has no value.

If Israel would withdraw to the Pre-67 borders, then I have no problem with Israel. Some people will argue that India is also occupying Muslim lands, yet we recognise India. To them I say - we do not recognise the illegal occupation of India. Furthermore India has been a reality for millennia, this is just it's latest form. Israel came about recently and it's borders are disputed. Our nation has agreed to recognise the borders it agrees with the Palestinian people, who's land it currently occupies.

As for the great talk of diplomatic rivers of honey and milk once we recognise Israel - anyone who believes that needs to dip their head in a river for a moment to help them wake up.

Remember the treatment they displayed to Musa (AS) who freed them from the tyranny of Pharoah. They worshipped a calf when he climbed a mountain. Remember the way they behaved with Isa (AS) who told them not to practice Riba. Remember the promises they broke with the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). Remember how they treated the Palestinian people who gave them shelter as the Nazi's drove them out of Europe. They are no different than their Hindu partners in crime across the border.

Lets talk real-politik what advantage has any Muslim nation had by recognising Israel? Would the Gulf Arabs enjoy the favours and protection of the USA, if they were not petrol pumps? What have Morocco and Jordan gained that was not through the efforts of their own hard work? Turkey has been its closest partner in the region for decades - what have they had in return?

What would we stand to gain? We trade in next to nothing anyway - we're broke so we can't import any of the fancy tech the Israeli's develop, not that they'd sell any of it to us anyway. Do you think they'd suddenly stop selling hi-tech weaponry to India? Do our relations with France, Russia, USA or Britain prevent them from selling to India? Of course not. The only nation who doesn't sell is China because they consider the Indian an adversary.

Is Israel capable of doing any real harm to us? No. Are we capable of doing any real harm to Israel? No. The likeliness of any harm either way is extremely unlikely.

What else could we gain from recognising Israel? Favour with the USA? What do you think will change suddenly? They'll back you over the Indians? Every single Pakistani leader has bent over backwards to please the USA and gain their favour. It's always been temporary whilst the US had something to gain. After they they reverted to type. This is how they treat every non white nation who isn't subservient to them. It's high time we stopped thinking like slaves. Stop trying to get into good books and write your own damn book.

The way I see it, if we recognise Israel we gain nothing and to be honest lose nothing either. It's a matter of principle and we know the Pakistani state has a habit of selling principles for dollars. This push to "recognise" Israel that we see in some dark corners, is nothing more than Israel trying to further buy global legitimacy - one insignificant country at a time. It's branding for the zionists - nothing more.

My stance for not recognising it is entirely based on principle. We do know that morality has been sold for dollars in Pakistan before and will be sold again. It's a daily transaction really - just on different scales. If there was any real tangible benefit to be had - our sell out leaders would have done it long ago.

Right, we gain absolutely nothing.

We would lose our soul and our legitimacy to our people.

We would humiliate ourselves in front of our ancestors and leaders like Quaid and Allama Iqbal.

Pakistan would be humiliated and left in tatters.

Alhmadulilah Pakistani people would never agree to normalize Israel.

 

[Yankee-stani]

Right, we gain absolutely nothing.

We would lose our soul and our legitimacy to our people.

We would humiliate ourselves in front of our ancestors and leaders like Quaid and Allama Iqbal.

Pakistan would be humiliated and left in tatters.

Alhmadulilah Pakistani people would never agree to normalize Israel.

The main reason why I oppose any relations with Israel is simple we cant trust the ((Koshers)) and their expansion plans I mean Netanyahu won an election based on expanding Israel into the West Bank, and Golan Heights, however I equally oppose the cucked Balis and Arabs who misuse our solidarity for missplaced political goals like the "two state solution" hence we should only care about the sanctity of the Al Quds and Masjid Al Aqsa

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

The main reason why I oppose any relations with Israel is simple we cant trust the ((Koshers)) and their expansion plans I mean Netanyahu won an election based on expanding Israel into the West Bank, and Golan Heights, however I equally oppose the cucked Balis and Arabs who misuse our solidarity for missplaced political goals like the "two state solution" hence we should only care about the sanctity of the Al Quds and Masjid Al Aqsa

Our loyalty and respect is not for any ethnic or racial group, but for the path of Muhammad Rasulullah saws and those who walk it.

We are on the path of Quaid and Allama Iqbal not for any reciprocation from anyone, but because Allah swt orders us to support justice and peace.

This is why we are a blessed nation, as our heart beats for Islam and Islam alone. We are not here for any racial nationalism or misplaced ethnic supremacy.

Israel is illegal down to its foundations, which our Quaid referred to as 'the illegitimate child of the West.'

 

[gangsta_rap]

today is reduced to a mere virtue-signaling buzzword

you really are one to talk aren't you shlomo? you're entire presence on this forum has been spewing out one virtue signal after another in your underhand criticism towards Pakistan.