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IAF orders more Tejas LCAs to replace MiG-21s

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IAF orders more Tejas LCAs to replace MiG-21s

Ajai Shukla / Bangalore November 23, 2009, 0:45 IST

The Indian Air Force is taking a crucial step towards accepting the indigenous Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) as a replacement for its ageing MiG-21 fighters. Senior air force officers told Business Standard that IAF was ordering a second Tejas squadron (20 aircraft), in addition to the 20 fighters already on order.

Ashok Nayak, chairman of Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd, which will manufacture the Tejas, has confirmed this development. “The Ministry of Defence (MoD) tender for 20 additional Tejas fighters is on track,” he told Business Standard. “After it is issued, we will sit down with MoD and negotiate a price.”

The order for a second squadron is a vital expression of IAF’s confidence in the future of the long-running Tejas programme. So far, IAF had insisted on evaluating the performance of the first squadron before ordering a second, by 2015-2016. That would allow the Tejas to be upgraded to the Tejas Mark II, which would have a new, more powerful engine. But now, with its fighter fleet dwindling, as the old MiG-21s are retired, IAF is taking the Tejas as it is.


WHY LAF URGENTLY NEEDS A SECOND SQUADRON
* Against a sanctioned requirement of 39.5 squadrons, IAF is down to just 32
* By 2015, another 6 squadrons of MiG-21s and two squadrons of MiG-27s would have finished their service lives
* HAL is manufacturing Sukhoi-30MKIs, but the current production is just 14 per year. By 2015, IAF will have just 29 squadrons of fighters
* The shortfall becomes more worrisome with the new requirement of five IAF squadrons for the North-East


“The Tejas, even with its current GE-404 engine, is a better fighter than the MiG-21:agree:explained a senior IAF officer who is familiar with equipment policy. “By 2015, the first Tejas squadron will be ready for IAF. HAL’s assembly line will be free; while the Tejas Mark II finishes testing, HAL can build a second squadron with the GE-404 engine,” he added.

So far, the plan was to produce 12 twin-seater Tejas trainers after the first squadron was built. The new order will be for 18 single-seater and 2 twin-seater Tejas: exactly what equips a fighter squadron.

Here’s why IAF urgently needs that second squadron: Against a sanctioned requirement of 39.5 squadrons (each squadron has 21 fighters), IAF is now down to just 32 squadrons. By 2015, another six squadrons of MiG-21s and two squadrons of MiG-27s would have finished their service lives. Meanwhile, HAL is manufacturing Sukhoi-30MKIs, but the current production is just 14 per year. The mathematics is clear: By 2015, IAF will have just 29 squadrons of fighters.

Making this shortfall even more worrisome is the new requirement of five IAF squadrons for north-east India, as a result of an increased threat assessment from China. Senior IAF officers have recently declared that India actually needs 45 squadrons.

In this context, IAF cannot wait to induct the Tejas as the next light fighter, a role that the MiG-21 has long performed. Medium fighters are as urgently needed, and IAF is currently evaluating six aircraft for this role. But the new Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA), even if the contract is placed expeditiously, is unlikely to enter service before 2015-16. Only in the heavy fighter segment is IAF well placed, with the superlative Sukhoi-30MKI steadily joining the fleet.

The Tejas is currently undergoing weapon trials to obtain its Initial Operational Clearance, most likely by early 2011. Then starts the two-year process for obtaining Final Operational Clearance, after which it can enter service in early 2013. Then, if HAL can deliver 10 Tejas fighters per year, the first squadron will be ready by the end of 2014. And, if all of that goes smoothly, the second Tejas squadron will join IAF by the end of 2016.

IAF has decided that No 45 Squadron, which operated MiG-21M fighters until they were recently retired, will be the first Tejas squadron. It will be based in Sulur, near Coimbatore. It is still not clear where the second Tejas squadron will be based.
 
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This production rate of 10 per might be speculation...

No if we count he number of LCA in IAF by 2015 then :

First Sq:20
Trainer Sq:12
Second Sq:20

Total:52

Certainly not bad,it is good to see now IAF taking more Professional and practical approach to LCA,like PLAAF did to J-10..

Except engine and AESA radar these ACs can be upgraded to MkII standard in future (avionics,EW,weapon,etc)..:cheers:
 
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I found this article full of speculation first the production rate and then the date mention for the joining of MMRCA,also the joning of I sq of LCA earlierly it was said that I Sq. join after IOC,in this article it has been said it will join after FOC..:undecided:

Except news related to II Sq. of LCA - MkI,which is a precious information and certainly make my morning and day...
 
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This is how i understand the LCA induction time line.

By 2011 IOC is given(work on first squadron has begun)

By 2013 First squadron completely inducted. FOC given work on second squadron has already begun

2015 Second squadron Inducted. LCA mk-2 is ready. 40 Tejas aircraft in service by now.

This is assuming they are inducted at the rate of 10 aircaft per year. Which may be be true for the IOC aircraft.

But the LCA can be Built in half the time of Must other aircraft

The use of composites in the LCA resulted in a 40% reduction in the total number of parts compared to using a metallic frame. Furthermore, the number of fasteners has been reduced by half in the composite structure from the 10,000 that would have been required in a metallic frame design. The composite design also helped to avoid about 2,000 holes being drilled into the airframe. Overall, the aircraft's weight is lowered by 21%. While each of these factors can reduce production costs, an additional benefit — and significant cost savings — is realised in the shorter time required to assemble the aircraft — seven months for the LCA as opposed to 11 months using an all-metal airframe

Since HAL can produce about 14 MKI's a year.

HAL should be able to produce at the very least 20 Tejas aircraft a year after the FOC is given.

Frankly we should have inducted at least 200 of there aircraft by 2020.
Its our cheapest plane.
Its better than our Mirage aircraft.
Its built right here in India

I dont see why we shouldn't be making this plane no stop for 10 years.

Tejas- 200+
Mig-29- 93
Rafael/FA-18 SH-200+
Su-30 MKI-280+
FGFA-20+
UACV- 300+

i dont know why we ant make this our air fleet by 2020. with at least a 1000 planes.
 
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This is how i understand the LCA induction time line.

By 2011 IOC is given(work on first squadron has begun)

By 2013 First squadron completely inducted. FOC given work on second squadron has already begun

2015 Second squadron Inducted. LCA mk-2 is ready. 40 Tejas aircraft in service by now.

This is assuming they are inducted at the rate of 10 aircaft per year. Which may be be true for the IOC aircraft.

But the LCA can be Built in half the time of Must other aircraft



Since HAL can produce about 14 MKI's a year.

HAL should be able to produce at the very least 20 Tejas aircraft a year after the FOC is given.

Frankly we should have inducted at least 200 of there aircraft by 2020.
Its our cheapest plane.
Its better than our Mirage aircraft.
Its built right here in India

I dont see why we shouldn't be making this plane no stop for 10 years.

Tejas- 200+
Mig-29- 93
Rafael/FA-18 SH-200+
Su-30 MKI-280+
FGFA-20+
UACV- 300+

i dont know why we ant make this our air fleet by 2020. with at least a 1000 planes.


Well HAL should go for 20 AC per year,as its all LRU are in india.

Also,there is order of 12 Trainer i don't know this II Sq. come after this Trainer or before or inplace of Trainer IAF going for this Sq.We will have to see..

Any way if we achive IOC by 2010 then we have 8 LSP..

Then I Sq. of 20 possibly by 2012-13,then 12 Trainer by 2013-14(Possibly) ,then 20 by 2015-16..

whatever be the time line ,one thing is sure we have about 60 LCA in IAF by 2015-16 and by the time LCA-MkII will definitely ready and then we can use same production line for MkII or add another Production Line...

As far as number is concern we definitely looking for 200 by 2020,its look tough but hope for the best..
 
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If only 50 units produced till 2015 then I dont think that this jet will go long because after 2015 the Fighter generation AC's would be moving to 5th generation fighter.

I think getting all experience from LCA, Hindustan Aeronautics Limited should work on MCA (5th generation stealth fighter)...........All learning from LCA would be usefull for MCA development.

There is still no standard Engine and Radar for LCA........moving towards 5th generation MCA ...HAL would be having more oppertunities to develop engine and radar.

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If only 50 units produced till 2015 then I dont think that this jet will go long because after 2015 the Fighter generation AC's would be moving to 5th generation fighter.

You must be jocking. Let me tell you quite frankly PAF will not be having any 5 generation fighter before 2028. And more LCA will be ordered before 2015. The ultimate aim is to replace Mig-21 with LCA. Mark-II and Mark-III will be in service begning around 2017. The LCA will me main stay for interception and the MMRCA will enter begning 2015. Besides Su-30 MKI numbers will also be increased and the later versions will be having a better engine and AESA.
 
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I would agreed with Mzubair if india planned the LCA to be its main frontline fighter,but as we know thats not the plan.....its mainly a number filler,but an quite effecient one to be frank.......su30mki(upgraded),mrca,pakfa backed by lca-mk2 is a very formidable airforce!....and will remain such till 2025 atleast
 
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I would agreed with Mzubair if india planned the LCA to be its main frontline fighter,but as we know thats not the plan.....its mainly a number filler,but an quite effecient one to be frank.......su30mki(upgraded),mrca,pakfa backed by lca-mk2 is a very formidable airforce!....and will remain such till 2025 atleast

Only one thing i agree with Mzubair is "HAL/DRDO should continue with MCA",yes should be but parallely.

Other than that certainly there is not point to stop LCA,as many of technologies related to LCA going to use in MCA.

As far as Radar and Engine is concern for LCA MkII,we all know that it is either EJ2000 or GE 414 and radar will be el-2052 AESA..

Other than that people should be more specific and clear what they are posting,simply by saying Radar and Engine is not decided for LCA,is certainly not enough,you should mention which version you are talking about ....

LCA MkI alrady have GE-404 engine and hybrid of el-2032 and indian MMR...
 
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lca is finally going to fly, good luck!!!!

Thanks bro.. really a great news for all the scientists who poured their hearts out for this bird :agree: .. great news for Indian Aviation Industry as well.. Now is the time to take another challenge and go all guns blazing for MCA.. :yahoo:
 
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Only one thing i agree with Mzubair is "HAL/DRDO should continue with MCA",yes should be but parallely.

Other than that certainly there is not point to stop LCA,as many of technologies related to LCA going to use in MCA.

Agreed
The Chinese started work on the J-XX even before the J-10 was completed.

That doesn't mean they should Abandon the J-10 now should they.

MCA is currently still in the design Phase and proably wont see a frist flight Until the next decade or so.

A new UACV however is likely to be ready by 2015 and might see heavy Induction as a light bomber.
 
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Definately some good news some credit should be given to the media for the criticism of the policies every now and then.Finally the GOI is taking these crutial steps for india to become indigenous :victory:
 
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Hi gogbot,can you please enlighten us about any indegenous UACV programme.....thanks
 
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'Home-made' Tejas likely to replace ageing MiG-21s - 1 -  National News ? News ? MSN India


'Home-made' Tejas likely to replace ageing MiG-21s
Bangalore: The Indian Air Force is taking a crucial step towards accepting the indigenous Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) as a replacement for its ageing MiG-21 fighters. Senior air force officers told Business Standard that IAF was ordering a second Tejas squadron (20 aircraft), in addition to the 20 fighters already on order.

Ashok Nayak, chairman of Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd, which will manufacture the Tejas, has confirmed this development. "The Ministry of Defence (MoD) tender for 20 additional Tejas fighters is on track," he told Business Standard. "After it is issued, we will sit down with MoD and negotiate a price."

The order for a second squadron is a vital expression of IAF's confidence in the future of the long-running Tejas programme. So far, IAF had insisted on evaluating the performance of the first squadron before ordering a second, by 2015-2016. That would allow the Tejas to be upgraded to the Tejas Mark II, which would have a new, more powerful engine. But now, with its fighter fleet dwindling, as the old MiG-21s are retired, IAF is taking the Tejas as it is.

Why LAF urgently needs a second squadron

* Against a sanctioned requirement of 39.5 squadrons, IAF is down to just 32

* By 2015, another 6 squadrons of MiG-21s and two squadrons of MiG-27s would have finished their service lives

* HAL is manufacturing Sukhoi-30MKIs, but the current production is just 14 per year. By 2015, IAF will have just 29 squadrons of fighters

* The shortfall becomes more worrisome with the new requirement of five IAF squadrons for the North-East
 
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