How India lags China in submarine race

[he-man]

You are going to have a shock when you get news that Zhuk radar is offered to PAF...

Read my previous posts.................zhuk is a piece of crap,always was

By the way which zhuk??

Zhuk-m or me or mse or ae??

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

Read my previous posts.................zhuk is a piece of crap,always was

By the way which zhuk??

Zhuk-m or me or mse or ae??

Zhuk -A or later versions...

 

[he-man]

Zhuk -A or later versions...

Thats impossible as its not ready yet.

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

Thats impossible as its not ready yet.

It will be ready in time for Blk 3's....

 

[he-man]

It will be ready in time for Blk 3's....

Dude mig-29 k will be upgraded with it,trust me.

 

[Levina]

Fair enough,we are way way behind china in submarines,,,,,umm,not just submarines but almost everything.

Its not even a news to anyone who is informed.

By the way..........he-man strikes back
@Abingdonboy
@levina
@ranjeet
@Skull and Bones

It's a temporary phase Lolzzz ...last time I welcomed you, you were banned within a day.
Iss baar kuch gad-bad Na kariyo.

For how long are you going to be back ??

Sir did u change ur name recently?? You don't sound like a newbie.

 

[Mo12]

You cant compare India vs China, just like how you cant compare Pakistan vs India, economically and military.

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

Sir did u change ur name recently?? You don't sound like a newbie.

I have been reading this forum since 2007-2008 but decided to join after 6-7 years hence you see my membership date to be 2014...

Dude mig-29 k will be upgraded with it,trust me.

abb kya hua you were against this Zhuk radars...They are perfect if they are in Indian aircraft but junks if they are with others
LOL

 

[Optimos Prime IA]

India is on its way for largest fleet of potent or advanced submarine force in whole of Asia . How ? Check this out 13 old submarines will be updated with one like Vietnam new kilo variants and greman boats to more or less 214 standard with upgrades for weapon and sensors . For it will increase each of their life to 10 years more so All these updated on will stay with IN for the next 15-20 years . Now comes the riper . 6 new scorpene subs already under developments .1 INS Chakra SSN already inducted and another to be leased .so in no time by 2020 India will have 13 old subs (some undergoing upgrades) 2 SSN , 6 advanced SSK .This itself will form 21 attack submarine to defend our territories.

 

[posedion]

I dont see us fighting each other, China will have play a bigger role in peaceful Asian century

 

[Abingdonboy]

Fair enough,we are way way behind china in submarines,,,,,umm,not just submarines but almost everything.

Its not even a news to anyone who is informed.

By the way..........he-man strikes back
@Abingdonboy
@levina
@ranjeet
@Skull and Bones

Welcome back sir


+ It is clear India is lagging behind the PLA(N) in terms of sheer numbers of subs HOWEVER the subs the IN is inducting (Scorpene, Chakra, Arihant, P-75I etc) are qualitatively superior to those the Chinese operate and the numerical superiority of the PLA(N) will only last so long- India's economy is going to close the gap to the Chinese in the long term. And without being too simplistic the Chinese follow the "Eastern"/Russian/Soviet standard of operations/training and the Indian Mil follow NATO/Western standards ie high tempo, realistic, training and it is proven which of these are superior in times of war.


Additionally let's not overlook the fact the IN is building one of the world's finest ASW capabilities in the world (arguably second only to the USN)- Karmorta class ASW Corvettes, P-8Is, S-70Bs etc etc, this is no joke.

 

[IND151]

Welcome back sir


+ It is clear India is lagging behind the PLA(N) in terms of sheer numbers of subs HOWEVER the subs the IN is inducting (Scorpene, Chakra, Arihant, P-75I etc) are qualitatively superior to those the Chinese operate and the numerical superiority of the PLA(N) will only last so long, India's economy is going to close the gap to the Chinese in the long term and without being too simplistic the Chinese follow the "Eastern"/Russian/Soviet standard of operations/training and the Indian Mil follow NATO/Western standards ie high tempo, realistic, training and it is proven which of these are superior.


Additionally let's not underestimate the fact the IN is building one of the world's finest ASW capabilities in the world- Karmorta class ASW Corvettes, P-8Is, S-70Bs etc etc, this is no joke.

Nice explanation....................

 

[GURU DUTT]

Fair enough,we are way way behind china in submarines,,,,,umm,not just submarines but almost everything.

Its not even a news to anyone who is informed.

By the way..........he-man strikes back
@Abingdonboy
@levina
@ranjeet
@Skull and Bones

mera naam kahan hai saab ji

Zhuk -A or later versions...

what if i told you Zhuk AE is already in considaration for first MLU of indian Mig 29Ks

and what if i also told you that india is already testing its own AESA radar "UTTAM" which fill find its way in many fighter jets of IAF

 

[Oldman1]

India says that only about "half" of their submarines are operational at any one time, so that is about 7 active submarines.

China has got 68 submarines which is huge, that is more than all of India's Destroyers+Frigates+Submarines combined.

Which makes it kind of funny that India is talking about blockading us at the Malacca straits. The Malacca straits are about the same distance from China as they are from India, and even our diesel-electric submarines can sail all the way to Pakistan and back.

Well its not like they need the whole entire sub force to cover such a small area. Not like the Pacific Ocean.

 

[Pakistanisage]

How India lags China in submarine race - The Times of India



How India lags behind China in submarine race
IANS|Jul 20, 2015, 06.59 PM IST

INS Chakra, India's only operational nuclear-powered submarine. India is rushing to counter China by building conventional and nuclear submarines with German, French and Russian help.


NEW DELHI: A recent visit by an advanced Chinese Yuan-class submarine to Karachi after traversing the Arabian Sea worried Indian authorities concerned about China's growing undersea-warfare capabilities — more than four times as large as India's.

The submarine, with 65 crew, spent a week in Karachi, refuelling and restocking, before sailing back to China. Yuan-class submarines are diesel-electric, but unlike Indian conventional submarines, which must surface to "breathe" and charge batteries, they are capable of staying submerged for weeks.

India now plans to lease a second nuclear attack submarine from Russia and the government has just approved a Rs 90,000-crore ($14 billion) plan to build six nuclear attack submarines in Vishakapatnam. But as Vice Admiral P Murugesan, the vice chief of naval staff, told The Economic Times last week: "We have started work, but we are still at the pen-to-paper stage."

India is rushing to counter China by building conventional and nuclear submarines with German, French and Russian help. But China's lead is large and growing and it plans to export its undersea expertise.

Particularly disconcerting for India are reports that China plans to sell eight Yuan-class submarines to Pakistan, at a time when Indian submarine forces are, according to this report, in "a state of crisis" and the country jittery about Chinese submarine power.

READ ALSO: Govt approves building of 6 nuclear-powered submarines

A conventional Chinese submarine berthed at Colombo's port twice during 2014, sparking concern in India, leading to a Sri Lankan assurance it would not do anything against Indian interests.

Chinese navy clearly ahead of India

India has 14 submarines — including one nuclear attack submarine, INS Chakra, leased from Russia in 2012 for 10 years — against China's 68 and Pakistan's five.

Most of India's conventional submarines are more than 20 years old and are reaching the end of their service life, according to this report by the parliamentary standing committee on defence (2014-15), which said it was "dismayed" at the "snails-pace" of commissioning naval vessels.

The Indian Navy has commissioned two submarines and de-commissioned five over the last 15 years, defence minister Manohar Parikkar said in a reply in the Rajya Sabha.

China launched or commissioned more than 60 naval ships and craft in 2014. A similar number is expected through the end of 2015.

READ ALSO:Govt's Indian Ocean gambit gathers pace

The Indian Navy has 141 vessels, including 127 surface ships and 14 submarines. The Chinese navy has more than 300 surface combatants, submarines, amphibious ships and missile-armed patrol craft.

Under the sea too, Chinese superiority

The Chinese submarine force currently includes 59 conventional or diesel-electric attack submarines and nine nuclear submarines. Of these nine, five are nuclear attack vessels and four are ballistic-missile submarines.

Nuclear-powered submarines are of two types: attack submarines (SSN) and fleet ballistic missile submarines (SSBN).

Attack submarines are smaller and faster compared to their ballistic-missile counterparts. SSNs are designed to attack enemy ships and submarines using torpedoes and shore facilities with cruise missiles with conventional high-explosive warheads. SSBNs carry ballistic missiles with nuclear warheads.

India's first nuclear submarine was leased in 1988 from the Russian navy and returned in 1991. The present nuclear submarine, INS Chakra, is considered one of the deadliest non-American attack boats in the world.

READ ALSO:Parrikar launches Scorpene submarine into water

India has nine Sindhughosh-class or Kilo-class diesel-electric submarines. They were built under a contract between Russia's Rosvooruzhenie and the Indian defence ministry. The other four are German-made Shishumar-class diesel-electric submarines (Type 1500).

India strives to expand submarine fleet

India plans to add 15 submarines: six conventional French-designed vessels, build six nuclear attack boats and three nuclear ballistic-missile submarines.

The plan to build six French-designed Scorpene-class submarines is called Project 75. The first diesel-electric submarine of this class — INS Kalvari — was launched on April 6, 2015 and is expected to be inducted into the Navy by 2016. The other five will be delivered by 2020.

The Scorpene is a state-of-the-art conventional submarine which incorporates advanced stealth characteristics that make detection difficult. The submarine features anti-ship missiles and advanced torpedoes.

India's first indigenously built nuclear-propelled strategic submarine, INS Arihant (destroyer of the enemy), was launched in 2009 and is currently under trial. The SSBN gives India a nuclear triad of missiles that can be launched by air, from land and under the sea.

READ ALSO:Chinese sub docking in Karachi no threat to India, PLA says

Another indigenous SSBN, INS Aridhaman, is also under construction, and work on a third will start soon, according to this report.

China already has three Jin-class SSBNs in service, according to this report, and may have eight in service by 2020.

A cheaper, quicker option: grow anti-submarine capabilities

To counter China's growing submarine clout, the defence ministry on July 14, 2015, cleared a proposal to purchase four more US-built P-8I long-range, anti-submarine warfare (ASW) maritime patrol aircraft.

India already has six such aircraft, according to this report.

READ ALSO:Chinese sub docking in Lanka 'inimical' to India's interests

In May 2015, INS Kavaratti, a fourth indigenously-built ASW corvette, was launched. It has state-of-art weapons and sensors, including a medium-range gun, torpedo tube, rocket launchers and a helicopter.

India is in the process of finalising a contract with the US's Sikorsky Aircraft Corporation for 16 S-70B ASW choppers. The deal has been pending for the last 15 years.

Most Indian ships lack ASW helicopters at a time of China's growing under-sea dominance.