How India lags China in submarine race

[Chinese-Dragon]

We know how you lead the Chinese gang here.

WHAT?? LOL.

@TaiShang, @ChineseTiger1986, @Edison Chen, @AndrewJin can you tell this guy that I don't "lead the Chinese gang here"?

LOL.

 

[Styx]

They could easily torpedo the 8 submarines sale if they did detect it.

And don't tell me that they won't respond to an unknown enemy submarine near their coastline, IF they knew about it. And just pretend everything is fine and dandy without even investigating what it is.

That's a good way to put everything you have at overwhelming risk. So no, I'd expect some sort of movement at least if they knew there was a possible enemy sub out there.

I think the Chinese navy are smart enough to have avoided a "near the coastline" course. Why would they want to cause an incident ?

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

I think the Chinese navy are smart enough to have avoided a "near the coastline" course. Why would they want to cause an incident ?

That's the standard route that ships use, simply because it costs to much to do otherwise.

To get to Karachi nobody is going to do some wild route that goes all the way to Antarctica and then back, they are obviously going to take the route that gets them there the quickest.

Though I suppose it would be good proof of the endurance of our AIP diesel-electric subs if we did that.

 

[birju]

1. international waters

2. you think IN is so stupid that they'd make public their detection/tracking capabilities ?

His knowledge of military tech is unknown but his rants are worse than that of a .... and only his rants are for drowning unpleasant facts. He is the ultimate Chinese authority here on all things.

i will get banned sooner or later for telling truth i know that but who can change facts or the consequence and actions after facts are known to all.

 

[AndrewJin]

WHAT?? LOL.

@TaiShang, @ChineseTiger1986, @Edison Chen, @AndrewJin can you tell this guy that I don't "lead the Chinese gang here"?

LOL.

Don't have any interest comparing Indian defence, too irrelevant to talk about.

 

[Styx]

That's the standard route that ships use, simply because it costs to much to do otherwise.

To get to Karachi nobody is going to do some wild route that goes all the way to Antarctica and then back, they are obviously going to take the route that gets them there the quickest.

Though I suppose it would be good proof of the endurance of our AIP diesel-electric subs if we did that.

yeah right, and I suppose you have first hand knowledge of PLAN sub routes ?

nobody is saying they went via Antarctica

fact is your sub went through international waters and probably took extra care to avoid any incident with India.

but I can see you're in a troll match with some Indians here, no time right now, I'm out

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

yeah right, and I suppose you have first hand knowledge of PLAN sub routes ?

nobody is saying they went via Antarctica

fact is your sub went through international waters and probably took extra care to avoid any incident with India.

but I can see you're in a troll match with some Indians here, no time right now, I'm out

Exclusive: Chinese submarine lurked past Indian waters, docked in Karachi - India Today

That is all.

You said that why would India tell anyone they detected a sub? And I said it's basically criminal negligence to know that there is a possible enemy sub around and not take any kind of movement in response, the kind of movement that could be picked up by say, a satellite.

Sitting around twiddling your thumbs in response to a possible enemy sub that has been detected is way beyond criminal negligence.

 

[birju]

WHAT?? LOL.

@TaiShang, @ChineseTiger1986, @Edison Chen, @AndrewJin can you tell this guy that I don't "lead the Chinese gang here"?

LOL.

Okay. i will buy that you do not lead the Chinese gang here.

Now we know there is some non-member here who is leading the PRC gang.

I know your tagging tactics. We all know. Even some truth speaking Pakistani members have corroborated this on rare threads that you hare robots and cannot help your destiny.

Continue with your daily rants. You provide us superb entertainment.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

India says that only about "half" of their submarines are operational at any one time, so that is about 7 active submarines.

China has got 68 submarines which is huge, that is more than all of India's Destroyers+Frigates+Submarines combined.

Which makes it kind of funny that India is talking about blockading us at the Malacca straits. The Malacca straits are about the same distance from China as they are from India, and even our diesel-electric submarines can sail all the way to Pakistan and back.

Some mistaken assumptions.China has 38 modern SSKs.But SSKs are unuseable for operations in IOR,not because they can't sail there.But because unlike SSNs they have to surface often during this trip to recharge batteries,which if u do close to enemy waters- total sitting ducks detected by satellites and maritime patrol aircraft like p-8 poseidons.Secondly combined with above disadvantage even though the SSKs would have endurance to travel to IOR,without a refuelling base it doesn't have endurance to travel back to china after operating here,basically making such a mission a suicide one way trip.
Finally SSKs have low speed unsuited for deep ocean deployment,if they try to go high speed they become extremely noisy.Thus noise signature is basically life for a ssk,they can't make a silent underwater dash over 20 knots like latest nuke subs and shake off a pursuing ship.If they try to attain those speeds they become easy detections.Their main advantage is in shallower waters with their batteries switched off and waiting in ambush where they are deadly,and these ops are possible closer to ur own waters only.
It is because of these above reasons that USN completely discarded diesel subs as they are poor for long range global deployments that the usn needs and u are proposing PLAN undertake here.

As for the malacca straits we have andaman and nicobar sitting right on the doorstep.You don't.USN and IN already share data on any chinese sub deployments in the region and so far i spoke to 2 naval officers and both said IN has no problems picking up noisy chinese subs.This has also been publicly stated in media.
That leaves really 2-3 type 93 nuke subs which are the only semi-modern Nuke attack subs PLAN has for operations in IOR.The older han class is a huge noisy joke with propulsion problems and obsolete.Even the type 93 noise signature from USN sources is comparable to victor 3 class of ussr-1970s-80s level.Victor was the predecesor of the akula 1 types which have been followed by improved akula,akula 2 and now yasen each with lower signatures.

So the paper number u stated is just that paper figure,and completely irrelevant in terms of operations in indian ocean.When PLAN gets 20-30 modern SSNs we can talk about real threat.Not before.

 

[birju]

yeah right, and I suppose you have first hand knowledge of PLAN sub routes ?

nobody is saying they went via Antarctica

fact is your sub went through international waters and probably took extra care to avoid any incident with India.

but I can see you're in a troll match with some Indians here, no time right now, I'm out

i am also out but everybody would agree that he provides superb entertainment.

i came after two weeks only to find his typical comments. Just imagine how his countrymen bear him. Maybe they do not know him.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

But because unlike SSNs they have to surface often during this trip to recharge batteries.

Our AIP submarine had to stop, surface and recharge batteries on its journey to Karachi? Often?

Huh? Did you read the news?

Exclusive: Chinese submarine lurked past Indian waters, docked in Karachi - India Today

At which part of the journey exactly did our Yuan-class diesel electric AIP submarine have to surface and recharge its batteries?

 

[Sarjen29]

Exclusive: Chinese submarine lurked past Indian waters, docked in Karachi - India Today

That is all.

You said that why would India tell anyone they detected a sub? And I said it's basically criminal negligence to know that there is a possible enemy sub around and not take any kind of movement in response, the kind of movement that could be picked up by say, a satellite.

Sitting around twiddling your thumbs in response to a possible enemy sub that has been detected is way beyond criminal negligence.

Did you even read the Article properly???? Do tell me who told these jornos that in fact Chinese Subs went past Indian Waters????? Do you know anything about Indian Journalism.

 

[birju]

Some mistaken assumptions.China has 38 modern SSKs.But SSKs are unuseable for operations in IOR,not because they can't sail there.But because unlike SSNs they have to surface often during this trip to recharge batteries,which if u do close to enemy waters- total sitting ducks detected by satellites and maritime patrol aircraft like p-8 poseidons.Secondly combined with above disadvantage even though the SSKs would have endurance to travel to IOR,without a refuelling base it doesn't have endurance to travel back to china after operating here,basically making such a mission a suicide one way trip.
Finally SSKs have low speed unsuited for deep ocean deployment,if they try to go high speed they become extremely noisy.Thus noise signature is basically life for a ssk,they can't make a silent underwater dash over 20 knots like latest nuke subs and shake off a pursuing ship.If they try to attain those speeds they become easy detections.Their main advantage is in shallower waters with their batteries switched off and waiting in ambush where they are deadly,and these ops are possible closer to ur own waters only.
It is because of these above reasons that USN completely discarded diesel subs as they are poor for long range global deployments that the usn needs and u are proposing PLAN undertake here.

As for the malacca straits we have andaman and nicobar sitting right on the doorstep.You don't.USN and IN already share data on any chinese sub deployments in the region and so far i spoke to 2 naval officers and both said IN has no problems picking up noisy chinese subs.This has also been publicly stated in media.
That leaves really 2-3 type 93 nuke subs which are the only semi-modern Nuke subs PLAN has for operations in IOR.The older han class is a huge noisy joke with propulsion problems and obsolete.Even the type 93 noise signature from USN sources is comparable to victor 3 class of ussr-1970s-80s level.Victor was the predecesor of the akula 1 types which have been followed by improved akula,akula 2 and now yasen each with lower signatures.

So the paper number u stated is just that paper figure,and completely irrelevant in terms of operations in indian ocean.When PLAN gets 20-30 modern SSNs we can talk about real threat.Not before.

if PLAN gets 15-20 submarines, do you think Japan will keep so low??

Japan already has more than 80 P-3C Orions, the most powerful fleet of anti-submarine aircraft after the United States and 14-16 submarines and their fleet is much younger and technologically superior for early detection and destruction.

and just see how many South Koreans are planning and are operating. The most less talked about fleet of superb submarines in the world is of South Korea. In just 10-15 years, They have built a powerful submarine fleet and so will Vietnam in another ten years.

The PRC Chinese were whining to Russia not to supply subs to Vietnam and the US not to export to Taiwan but they are cry babies.

Even the American aircraft carrier docked in Hong Kong harbor despite whining by PRC Chinese.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

I really don't understand how the war in 1962 and Macmohan line is related to AIP submarines, neither would I try to relate them. Please stick to topic.

If you have missed this post of his

What small area?

If you mean the Malacca straits, what is better for hunting a submarine, than another submarine?

He hasn't even heard of ASW Frigates or aircrafts.

If this level of knowledge on submarines, did you really expect an intellectual response

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Double Post.