Hoisting of national flag upsets militant group

[FunkyGen]

Okay then, clarify to what end these UAVs are to be used, what is their motive? Their operations role? And how can they affect war in the sphere of the traditional 350m?

USEs....
Tactical surveillance front line recon. teams
Offence taken by specific special teams behind enemy lines from a remote location
Providing crucial info. to our allies in the area i.e. where the enemy is and how is his preparation going
According to a new video the concept is to develop bird like assets that can do recce. for months and keep on getting charged via solar energy
EFFECTs
A better 3d view of the battle field as high flying assets give you a rather 2d one, thus a better assessment of the terrain and other advantages
Psychological warfare (make them feel we are very very close)
Trust of your allies

I asked what detectors? You don't just find IED detectors being marketed as a huge plate that can find entire IEDs. Secondly, bigger battery means more weight and more weight means your UAV will have to be redesigned and will have a starkly reduced range and service ceiling.

Yaar i gave a very vague idea, i don't stand behind it due to poor understanding but i stand behind the fact that it will be possible one day and there is work being done on the issue

 

[Jaanbaz]

Even Borat doesn't like Uzbeks.

 

[Icarus]

USEs....
Tactical surveillance front line recon. teams

It's COIN, there is no front line.

Offence taken by specific special teams behind enemy lines from a remote location

It's COIN, there are no enemy lines. Distribution is diffused.

Providing crucial info. to our allies in the area i.e. where the enemy is and how is his preparation going

What preparations? The enemy operates in small tactical teams and they don't assemble columns of armour that we can spy on to see how their 'preperation' is going.

According to a new video the concept is to develop bird like assets that can do recce. for months and keep on getting charged via solar energy

Concept, the word says it all, it means it is not ready for real world use.

EFFECTs
A better 3d view of the battle field as high flying assets give you a rather 2d one, thus a better assessment of the terrain and other advantages

Army already uses recon drones to map Op areas.

Psychological warfare (make them feel we are very very close)

I thought the whole idea of a micro-UAV was to be inconspicuous?

Trust of your allies

What trust? What allies? Its just us against the Taliban!

All your points seem to have next to no logical ground beneath them in regards to COIN Ops, where as these points could be pertinent in a conventional war, I believe you are failing to make a distinction between both.

Yaar i gave a very vague idea, i don't stand behind it due to poor understanding but i stand behind the fact that it will be possible one day and there is work being done on the issue

But we have to fight a war today, which is why @Irfan Baloch and I are critical of your standing on the issue.

 

[FunkyGen]

It's COIN, there is no front line.

But there are specified occupied areas of terrorists or strong holds if you wanna.... From where the directions are issued to the handlers, and of course you want them gone so....

What preparations? The enemy operates in small tactical teams and they don't assemble columns of armour that we can spy on to see how their 'preperation' is going.

miscreants may not assemble armour but i'm sure they do assemble weapon caches and store ammo, take them out and you're doing yourself a favour.

Concept, the word says it all, it means it is not ready for real world use.

That's the main point, no body is going to give it you, gotta do it yourself. The project is high tech. i admit but the main point is that the equipment is small and can be prototyped in a short time given the innovation and will is there.

Army already uses recon drones to map Op areas.

Well i used the word 2d and 3d, the concept is much like mapping terrain to know where the weak spots are, where the enemy can hide ied s in the form of rocks and where the terrain has a "ambush history", once done the area should be marked respectively and precautions should be taken to tread through or deploy early warning assets which again are drones but this time should be armed. A generation ahead step would be to develop head sights that can mark the terrain in different colours giving the soldiers the much needed early warning.

I thought the whole idea of a micro-UAV was to be inconspicuous?

Well they'd be scared if they see their men falling down here and there without warning, i'm not saying to command the drone so that it performs a pole dance in front of them rather if possible track their heads and shoot the shit out of them via a silenced gun. My concept revolves around the word "mosquito".

What trust? What allies? Its just us against the Taliban!
All your points seem to have next to no logical ground beneath them in regards to COIN Ops, where as these points could be pertinent in a conventional war, I believe you are failing to make a distinction between both.

Our allies are the tribals who don't want people whipping them in front of camera, people who fight with us and have given much for Pakistan.
Their areas need to be developed pronto to show that Pakistan is with them in this, and the intelligence be provided to the aman lashkars.

 

[Icarus]

But there are specified occupied areas of terrorists or strong holds if you wanna.... From where the directions are issued to the handlers, and of course you want them gone so....

A handler will not call for a fall-in and issue instructions to hundreds of terrorists in an open field. These are done inside buildings and UAVs cannot eavesdrop, local assets can.

miscreants may not assemble armour but i'm sure they do assemble weapon caches and store ammo, take them out and you're doing yourself a favour.

You overestimate their military capacity, ammo is not stored in enormous dumps, its stored in walls and covered with mud. There's no single "Cache", everyone has their own load.

That's the main point, no body is going to give it you, gotta do it yourself. The project is high tech. i admit but the main point is that the equipment is small and can be prototyped in a short time given the innovation and will is there.

It needs to be proved feasible first, which it hasn't so far. We have surveillance drones and small back pack UAVs but they have limited use, they are mostly used for mapping purposes.

Well i used the word 2d and 3d, the concept is much like mapping terrain to know where the weak spots are, where the enemy can hide ied s in the form of rocks and where the terrain has a "ambush history", once done the area should be marked respectively and precautions should be taken to tread through or deploy early warning assets which again are drones but this time should be armed. A generation ahead step would be to develop head sights that can mark the terrain in different colours giving the soldiers the much needed early warning.

Those points are already taken into consideration and mapping is completed along similar lines.

Well they'd be scared if they see their men falling down here and there without warning, i'm not saying to command the drone so that it performs a pole dance in front of them rather if possible track their heads and shoot the shit out of them via a silenced gun. My concept revolves around the word "mosquito".

Please elaborate.

Our allies are the tribals who don't want people whipping them in front of camera, people who fight with us and have given much for Pakistan.
Their areas need to be developed pronto to show that Pakistan is with them in this, and the intelligence be provided to the aman lashkars.

Development work is being completed ASAP but the tribals cannot process intelligence or receive ground feed from UAVs, they get intelligence from us and we get it from them.

 

[FunkyGen]

A handler will not call for a fall-in and issue instructions to hundreds of terrorists in an open field. These are done inside buildings and UAVs cannot eavesdrop, local assets can.

Of course they can't!
You have to make them!

You overestimate their military capacity, ammo is not stored in enormous dumps, its stored in walls and covered with mud. There's no single "Cache", everyone has their own load.

It was reported in news that PAF targeted their ammo storage or maybe i heard it the wrong way?
And there are videos of SACLOS guided missiles hitting building, what's that for?
Ok let's even ignore that, there was a ammo dump that was intercepted in Balochistan, what was that then?

It needs to be proved feasible first, which it hasn't so far. We have surveillance drones and small back pack UAVs but they have limited use, they are mostly used for mapping purposes.

You need people with innovation for that, sadly we only chase technologies that are battle proven and developed by other countries.

Those points are already taken into consideration and mapping is completed along similar lines.

Well that's great but just imagine your computer tied to your wrist going red and alerting you there are danger points ahead and then you deploy surveillance and end up saving your soldiers in a much alerted way....

 

[Icarus]

Of course they can't!
You have to make them!

Make them what?

It was reported in news that PAF targeted their ammo storage or maybe i heard it the wrong way?

Like I said, everyone has their own cache, you hit the right building, maybe the house of a commander or a training camp and you get a big boom.

And there are videos of SACLOS guided missiles hitting building, what's that for?

Targets of congregation.

Ok let's even ignore that, there was a ammo dump that was intercepted in Balochistan, what was that then?

Ferrari camps, located out in the desert. Not exactly 'Ammo dumps'.

You need people with innovation for that, sadly we only chase technologies that are battle proven and developed by other countries.

We are a developing country, we can't waste capital on R&D, we must have some stability to build on.

Well that's great but just imagine your computer tied to your wrist going red and alerting you there are danger points ahead and then you deploy surveillance and end up saving your soldiers in a much alerted way....

This is not call of duty, it doesn't happen that way. How do you establish connection between UAV and your handheld? How do you encrypt that data? What exactly qualifies as a danger point? These are questions that need to be answered and thought about, in addition to the question if this idea is practical, then why don't we see it being adopted by other countries?

 

[FunkyGen]

Please elaborate.

A quad copter with a long barrel sticking our to take out targets from afar (that's why mosquito).
Equipped with magnifying thermal vision and the gun is gyro stabilized to take out targets from afar, possible range 1 to 2 kms (radio range).
Should have an endurance of 6 hours.
Should be silent.
Gun should fire a suitable long range cartridge.
Should be transportable enough for a 4 man unit deployed behind enemy line.
Should be a rugged design.
Gun should have range enough to keep the asset from being seen.
And of course the flash suppression and sound suppression be there.

Development work is being completed ASAP but the tribals cannot process intelligence or receive ground feed from UAVs, they get intelligence from us and we get it from them.

Well, i did mean raw intelligence, i know they're not that smart.

Make them what?

Eaves drop.... duh!

Like I said, everyone has their own cache, you hit the right building, maybe the house of a commander or a training camp and you get a big boom.

I smell contradiction....

Ferrari camps, located out in the desert. Not exactly 'Ammo dumps'.

Yar you can call whatever the hell you want, it's basically tools and a bunch of em in the wrong hands and you have to intercept them, geez!

We are a developing country, we can't waste capital on R&D, we must have some stability to build on.

We are wasting a lot on our nuclear programme why not waste a percent of it on developing machines that would kill people who killed 60000 Pakistanis... including your comrades, your excuse is just....!

 

[FunkyGen]

This is not call of duty, it doesn't happen that way. How do you establish connection between UAV and your handheld? How do you encrypt that data? What exactly qualifies as a danger point? These are questions that need to be answered and thought about, in addition to the question if this idea is practical, then why don't we see it being adopted by other countries?

This post of yours....... i admit i'm just some stupid guy who is sitting in front of his laptop and blabbing.... BUT
Encryption
Encrypt the data? why'd you even need encryption? there aren't computer experts on the other side but even if there are i'm sure our computer experts are better than them and have available to them better resources to develop encryption. But the question is there is an important issue at hand and you're talking about encryption? ALSO PAKISTAN DOES HAVE A DATA LINK @Dazzler please....
danger point!?
Any point that offers a compromise on our personnels security is a danger point.
rest of it.....
Maybe because 60000 of their people aren't DEAD, we always emphasize that we're in a condition of war yet do nothing out of the box to solve it....

 

[Irfan Baloch]

It's COIN, there is no front line.



It's COIN, there are no enemy lines. Distribution is diffused.



What preparations? The enemy operates in small tactical teams and they don't assemble columns of armour that we can spy on to see how their 'preperation' is going.



Concept, the word says it all, it means it is not ready for real world use.



Army already uses recon drones to map Op areas.



I thought the whole idea of a micro-UAV was to be inconspicuous?



What trust? What allies? Its just us against the Taliban!

All your points seem to have next to no logical ground beneath them in regards to COIN Ops, where as these points could be pertinent in a conventional war, I believe you are failing to make a distinction between both.




But we have to fight a war today, which is why @Irfan Baloch and I are critical of your standing on the issue.

reminds me of neem hakim and neem mullah phrase.
people listen to some technical terms and use them generously without even knowing what they mean. and in many cases they are absolute lies and malicious propoganda

e.g. PAF is carpet bombing FATA
Pakistan army bombarded Lal Masjid with white phosphorus bombs

and of course the frequent use of "COIN".

 

[Icarus]

A quad copter with a long barrel sticking our to take out targets from afar (that's why mosquito).

Oh my god, did you just propose a sniper quad-copter? This thread is going whole new places of weird
.

Equipped with magnifying thermal vision and the gun is gyro stabilized to take out targets from afar, possible range 1 to 2 kms (radio range).

You do realize you are taking physics from behind? @Oscar this is really your line of speciality, I know that Newtonian laws are being overlooked in this matter but can you please elaborate further?

Should have an endurance of 6 hours.

How?

Should be silent.

How?

Gun should fire a suitable long range cartridge.

Equal and opposite reaction, recoil will not only affect trajectory of bullet but will also throw the quadcopter out of balance with a huge barrel sticking out and four rotors, it will crash to the ground.

Should be transportable enough for a 4 man unit deployed behind enemy line.

How?

Should be a rugged design.

How?

Gun should have range enough to keep the asset from being seen.

How? Range= Larger calibre+Suitable barrel length and both throw the copter's stabilization into disarray.

And of course the flash suppression and sound suppression be there.

How?

Well, i did mean raw intelligence, i know they're not that smart.

They don't need int!

Eaves drop.... duh!

How?

I smell contradiction....

Explain

Yar you can call whatever the hell you want, it's basically tools and a bunch of em in the wrong hands and you have to intercept them, geez!

Huge difference.

We are wasting a lot on our nuclear programme why not waste a percent of it on developing machines that would kill people who killed 60000 Pakistanis... including your comrades, your excuse is just....!

I am now convinced you are basing your entire ideas on some video game, these ideas are in direct conflict with basic physics!

This post of yours....... i admit i'm just some stupid guy who is sitting in front of his laptop and blabbing.... BUT
Encryption
Encrypt the data? why'd you even need encryption? there aren't computer experts on the other side but even if there are i'm sure our computer experts are better than them and have available to them better resources to develop encryption. But the question is there is an important issue at hand and you're talking about encryption? ALSO PAKISTAN DOES HAVE A DATA LINK @Dazzler please....

So you want to have data available on an open stream? You have no idea about the importance of encryption?

danger point!?
Any point that offers a compromise on our personnels security is a danger point.
rest of it.....
Maybe because 60000 of their people aren't DEAD, we always emphasize that we're in a condition of war yet do nothing out of the box to solve it....

Thinking out of the box does not mean coming up with whatever idea you can imagine and boxing it as the solution. You have your ideas but they are impractical and frankly, quite immature.

@Icarus
Mad bro. ?
Come on let's make up......

I'm not mad, I am just amazed about how you can wildly pull ideas from your imagination and then consider it the next pillar of Pakistan's counter terrorism policy.

 

[FunkyGen]

Oh my god, did you just propose a sniper quad-copter? This thread is going whole new places of weird

What you call weird is what i call innovation!

You do realize you are taking physics from behind? @Oscar this is really your line of speciality, I know that Newtonian laws are being overlooked in this matter but can you please elaborate further?

Yeah sure bring him, incorporating sights into drones into isn't a new concept and so isn't gyro stabilization, a where do laws of physics come in play? maybe you forgot to take your elementary physics, not my problem!

How?

With a god damn battery of course!

How?

Oh maybe you didn't know that nobody would hear a small quad half a mile away.... or maybe you need t buy one and do a little experiment!

Equal and opposite reaction, recoil will not only affect trajectory of bullet but will also throw the quadcopter out of balance with a huge barrel sticking out and four rotors, it will crash to the ground.

Now this is where the laws of physics come in play, but i guess you were out to mention them so that i may look stupid, as far as the recoil goes the answer lies in the weight distribution and of course i did mention gyro stabilized.... you know what that means?

How?

Any body who knows a bit about composites can tell you how!?

How?

You haven't seen that before? but how, you're a think tank for god's sake!

Explain

First i said ammo caches, you said....

You overestimate their military capacity, ammo is not stored in enormous dumps, its stored in walls and covered with mud. There's no single "Cache", everyone has their own load.

Then i said....

Like I said, everyone has their own cache, you hit the right building, maybe the house of a commander or a training camp and you get a big boom.

From this post one can easily see that you're admitting that they are present somewhere either in a commander's house or some fighter's house hence the word "contradiction....

They don't need int!

Yeah what they need is Talibs barbequing their asses in their houses, google aman laskar go to images section and see the images for yourself, they are too gruesome to post here, what an idiotic post!

How?

With ample hardware of course! this option is optional though and not a must.... I once saw a documentary with SAS eaves dropping on enemy in a thick jungle to save british soldiers so i know the tech. exists....

I am now convinced you are basing your entire ideas on some video game, these ideas are in direct conflict with basic physics!

I am now convinced you are basing your entire ideas on some video game, these ideas are in direct conflict with basic physics!

No! they are actually in direct with your backwards thinking!

So you want to have data available on an open stream? You have no idea about the importance of encryption?

I don't see it being important when their is no one to decrypt it!

Thinking out of the box does not mean coming up with whatever idea you can imagine and boxing it as the solution. You have your ideas but they are impractical and frankly, quite immature.

I am proud that at least i have ideas which quite frankly you're supposed to have cause you know, you're the "THINK TANK", i although wonder what is in the "TANK".

I'm not mad, I am just amazed about how you can wildly pull ideas from your imagination and then consider it the next pillar of Pakistan's counter terrorism policy.

Our counter terrorism policy to this date has been to let the miscreants rape us over and over again, destroy our strategic assets and issue videos of our beheaded soldiers. So, i think i'm not pulling any ideas as there is no counter terrorism policy to begin with....
Also i feel stupid for posting this particular post, you guys are not innovation friendly i must say.....

reminds me of neem hakim and neem mullah phrase.
people listen to some technical terms and use them generously without even knowing what they mean. and in many cases they are absolute lies and malicious propoganda
e.g. PAF is carpet bombing FATA
Pakistan army bombarded Lal Masjid with white phosphorus bombs
and of course the frequent use of "COIN".

Thank you, i have already ridiculed myself, why'd you have to bring it up?
And when did i ridicule PAF or our armed forces, what the heck i going on in your head? did you even bother reading what we are talking about rather than self thanking? eh?

 

[FunkyGen]

@Abingdonboy @Secur @Chak Bamu @HRK @cb4 @sandy_3126 @niaz @Manticore @Desert Fox @Desertfalcon Sorry to bother you guys but if possible i want you to go through some of the discussion and give me some feed back on whether i am hallucinating or is the tech. really viable!
Example of a drone in service with the British army!

 

[Irfan Baloch]

What you call weird is what i call innovation!


Yeah sure bring him, incorporating sights into drones into isn't a new concept and so isn't gyro stabilization, a where do laws of physics come in play? maybe you forgot to take your elementary physics, not my problem!


With a god damn battery of course!

you should invent a drone that runs on water..
sorry the title for a car that runs on water has been already claimed by a MuslimPakistani scientist.

you are a great find.. what batteries do you carry?
share some more innovative Ideas..
but ensure you patent them first.


please carry on ...this was a great post .. please promise you will continue to write like this.

A handler will not call for a fall-in and issue instructions to hundreds of terrorists in an open field. These are done inside buildings and UAVs cannot eavesdrop, local assets can.

Sir,

i urge you not to indulge in this discussion any longer. I find them mentally degrading

we still need your services in the field.

This post of yours....... i admit i'm just some stupid guy who is sitting in front of his laptop and blabbing.... BUT
Encryption
Encrypt the data? why'd you even need encryption? there aren't computer experts on the other side but even if there are i'm sure our computer experts are better than them

you clueless ... THING...

 

[FunkyGen]

I don't want to continue this discussion any further, i have already admitted that i'm not a specialist and was only here to logicate with proof that there are certain technologies in the world that can prove to be useful for our cause and that we should exploit them. And damn i thought wrong! the kind of attitude i was looking is completely absent here. I know that my idea (or others that share this idea) is not flawed, it is happening some where in the world, maybe even in Pakistan.

The thing is we are always looking at somebody to do the dirty work first and then we look out to either copy the stuff or JV with some other country. I am pretty sure if i was an American i would be getting some +ve reviews cause you know.... they set the standards in such tech. but alas! our bums are too lazy to move because there is "shortage" of funds and that there is no "R and D".

And then of course there are the one liners....
"how"
"how old are you"

No wonder we don't produce good engineers, maybe we should import some!